60fps problem

[Pieter Samijn]

I have shot some 60fps (NOT 60i) footage and i will edit them now in Vegas12.0. I created a project with 30fps so i can create smooth slowmotions. But vegas seems to have a problem with handling 60fps. When i just import the footage the framerate drops gigantic, sometimes 7fps. When i stretch the footage it seems to work well. When i change the properties also to 60fps the problem stays.
Someone else who has this problem?

[Kim Olsson]

I do often import 720p/60fps clips (.MOV, x264, 45000kbps) from my DSLR (Canon 60D). I have no problems at all...
my workflow/preview is in realtime, with no stutter or whatsoever....

Only when I use alot of tracks, using track motion, and adding filters or other plug-ins.. But that is unavoidable...

You have to share your computer spec..

Because it sounds like it is your computer setup which causing the framedrops....

Anyway, my computer setup is configured this way:
CPU: Intel Ivy Bridge 3770K 4.5GHz
RAM: 32GB (1600MHz)
GPU: Nvidia GTX670
HD: SSD 120GB system disk

The CPU will be the working horse when working inside Vegas Pro... The RAM will also help transfer data rate. And VP now also using the GPU for powering the workflow, and rendering to specific codec if you have a supported GPU. The SSD harddrive will read files faster rapidly, and load time will be so much greater.

But please share your computer spec so we can see if thats your problem...

/Kim

[Pieter Samijn]

The 60fps files are 1920*1080 AVC MP4-files

My computer is a little less powerfull then yours :) but i didn't have problems before:
Intel Core i7 930
6GB RAM
Ati Radeon HD5870

[Kim Olsson]

If you didnt have this issue before, its definitly not your system then.
And by looking on your spec, you should be able to edit without any problems...

#Check that you CPU isnt utilized by any other application or malware in your computer
#Check that your system drive isnt complete full. Have atleast 10-20GB empty
#Clean your TEMP drive
#Uninstall Vegas and reinstall
#Check that your preview setting isnt at highest (best)
#Installed any codec or plug-in latley??
#Does ALL video clips behaive like this? Or is it just this clip??

Come back and update us, maybe have some more suggestion

/Happy editing

[Ilkka Pouhakka]

Is the problem before you've done anything, in Vegas' preview window or after the rendering?
If it's during playback then the cause might be too slow HDD. If it's inside the Vegas' preview window, try changing the preview settings and see how it works out.

[Pieter Samijn]

I thought also in that direction. It is in the preview window but also when i play the footage in a regular player (BSplayer for example) after a while the video drops frames for like a second. Also audio/video sychronisation is not optimal in a regular player. It happens also in the Draft/Quarter preview. The footage is now stored on a external HDD connected trough USB2.0. But i tested this problem by placing the footage on an internal HDD connected trough SATA but the problem stays the same. I don't have aan SSD drive to test.

I also raised the Dynamic RAM Previeuw up to 4GB but Vegas was constantly crashing and freezing and the problem was also still there. I set it back to 2GB.

[Ilkka Pouhakka]

Render it to 30 fps and see if it works normally.
If it does, then the problem is most likely too slow HDD and/or your CPU.

[Pieter Samijn]

I have done some tests with some footage for the framedropproblem but also for the A/V synchronisation.

-Placing footage on SD-Card (fastest storage device i have). Still the same problems. Cardreader is connected internal trough SATA.
-Monitoring CPU and RAM, they work regular.
-Rendering to 1080p30: no framedrops in rendered file but A/V sync is still bad.
-Rendering to 720p30: no framedrops in rendered file but A/V sync is still bad but better then 1080.
-Rendering to other format (720p WMV): plays good.
-Trying to play original footage in other players:
---Quiktime: more framedrops than goodframes, A/V sync cannot be seen due the framedrops.
---Windowsmediaplayer: minimal framedrops, bad A/V sync
---BS Player: big seconddrops after a while, bad A/V sync
-Updating codecpack (cccp) and trying to play original footage in other players:
---Quiktime: problem stays the same
---Windowsmediaplayer: no video any more, only sound.
---BS Player: problem stays the same
-Playing the footage from the camera directly on TV trough HDMI: plays correct, no framedrops, A/V sync correct.

But now the weirdest part: Playing the footage in Cineform (Software from the manufacturer (GoPro)) goes without problems?!

I think there is a codecproblem?

[Kim Olsson]

I never liked codec packs...
Try out VLC player instead... search for videolan or vlc on google...

From review on internet, many have your problems aswell... some stated that new version of VLC media player did fix the issue,,,

Others did beef up their computer and that did also fix the issue..

Maybe this cineform codec is the issue to it all...

If you render it out to a example .mp4 or a .m2t does it playback well then on your computer ?

[Ron Windeyer]

For what it's worth: I shoot all my video in 1920*1080, 50P, mts files (I'm in PAL-land). Haven't had any trouble. The preview is pretty good - as stated by another poster, if you add lots of tracks, ESPECIALLY animated titles, do NOT expect to be able to preview that in anything like real time. It's awful. However, the end result is always great, after rendering.
There is a caveat which I will share: I usually render to a mp4 file, 1920*1080, 50P. This plays well on my PS3. The render takes a while but as stated the result is great.
I have also tried rendering to m2ts files. This is problematic - it appears that the MainConcept encoder doesn't/can't place a "50 fps" flag in the video file. So when you play it back the audio runs at the correct speed, while the video runs as fast as the player thinks it should. Doesn't take very long to get out of sync!
There is a remedy for this - if you run the finished m2ts file through TsmuxeR (free downlaod, very small program) it adds the "50 fps" flag, and the problem automagically goes away.
I keep the dynamic RAM preview to 200 MB - the default setting. Have heard that bad things can happen if you increase it too much.
Hope some of that helps :)

[Pieter Samijn]

Originally Posted by Kim Olsson

I never liked codec packs...
Try out VLC player instead... search for videolan or vlc on google...

From review on internet, many have your problems aswell... some stated that new version of VLC media player did fix the issue,,,

Others did beef up their computer and that did also fix the issue..

Maybe this cineform codec is the issue to it all...

If you render it out to a example .mp4 or a .m2t does it playback well then on your computer ?

VLC update was good for the framedrops but there is still an A/V problem.
Cineform is not a codec, its the editor designed by GoPro.

You said, you don't like codecpacks but how do you edit without them?

But it's getting worser. Today a tested the camera again by slapping the table to have a good view at the A/V. Now, in all players, also a 30fps rendered file or straight from the camera on tv, Audio is far behind.

If you want to test it: i put the original file online:
https://mega.co.nz/#!7dFTCSRK!aV5Rt3...9La60aAxdbHPhM

I also made a screenhot of that clip:
Timeline 1&2 are the footage imported without editing. As you can see, the video is 19 frames longer than the audio!
Timeline 4&5 are the footage edited to synchronise the audio. No stretching is needed, it's just behind.

Imageshack - hero3av.jpg

[Shaun Roemich]

Originally Posted by Pieter Samijn

V
Cineform is not a codec, its the editor designed by GoPro.

Actually, CIneform IS a Digital Intermediate codec. The GoPro application is designed to re-encode the native GoPro footage into something that NLEs don't choke on... Cineform.

[Pieter Samijn]

Originally Posted by Shaun Roemich

Actually, CIneform IS a Digital Intermediate codec. The GoPro application is designed to re-encode the native GoPro footage into something that NLEs don't choke on... Cineform.

Hmm, i didn't know that, I thought it was only from GoPro.
But now knowing Cineform is the codec who books the best result, how can i use the codec in Vegas? Everywhere i look for the download, it's the Cineform Studio (with reference to the GoPro website)...

[Shaun Roemich]

There is a Cineform Sub Forum right here on DVInfo. Perhaps post a question there.

CineForm Software Showcase Forum at DVinfo.net

[Pieter Samijn]

Originally Posted by Shaun Roemich

There is a Cineform Sub Forum right here on DVInfo. Perhaps post a question there.
CineForm Software Showcase Forum at DVinfo.net

Thanks!
I also found out that the Avid DNxHD is a great help. After installing this codec i managed to properly watch the footage in WMPlayer.