Time-Stretch with Markers at DVinfo.net

Marty Baggen · February 10th, 2013, 10:09 AM

Is there a way of Time-Stretching that shifts all markers relative to the the revised clip speed?

I've found it very helpful to place CC entries while the source is playing back at less-than full speed. Once the CC markers are in, I would like to return the clip to normal speed with the cues maintaining their relative positions.

Seth Bloombaum · February 10th, 2013, 11:34 AM

Now that's an interesting workflow question!

So far as I know, it's not directly possible.

However, I can think of a couple things to explore.

Probably the most straightforward and flexible method would be to use J-K-L scrubbing.

J = play reverse 1x
K = pause
L = play forward 1x
spacebar = start stop play, return cursor to start of playback

Maybe you knew about this.
JJ= play reverse 2x
JJJ = 3x
LL = 2x, etc.

But, did you know about this:

K+L = play forward 1/8x (or is it 1/4?)
K+ LL = play forward faster, 1/4 or 1/2x
And so on. To do this trick, you hold down the K key and hit the L key a few times.

To do these playback speed changes without stretching the media means markers never get misaligned!

For another approach, there are "Promote Markers" scripts that transfer markers embedded in the media up to the timeline. Perhaps there are "Demote Markers" scripts as well. If this could be done, you'd do your playbacks with stretched media, mark your CCs, demote the markers from the timeline to the media, unstretch the clip, then promote the marker back to the timeline. Seems too complicated. I always think about just how many clicks it takes to do something.

For another approach, if keyboard shortcuts are unappealing, there is the little yellow "playback rate" control, um, where is that thing? I'm not in front of Vegas at the moment...

But I like keyboard shortcuts! After a while, they get intuitive, automatic, and extremely fast to work with.

Marty Baggen · February 10th, 2013, 04:58 PM

Seth... you have provided further evidence that the most clever minds are in Oregon. The K + L sequence looks to be the solution. I tried to find a method of slower playback, and you have provided it.

I'll be giving it a try soon, and will confirm the results here when I do.

Until then... thanks for solving the issue of stretch-marks.

Marty Baggen · February 10th, 2013, 10:36 PM

Works like a charm Seth.... thank you very much for the tips!

Seth Bloombaum · February 11th, 2013, 12:00 PM

Happy keyboarding, Marty!

Glad it seems like this will work out for you. I haven't worked with AVID, but Vegas' keyboard scrubbing is way more flexible than FCP or Premiere. This is a great little method for finding edit points too, of course, and there are lots of other keyboard shortcuts for working fast.

What market are you editing for that requires CC? Just curious...

Marty Baggen · February 12th, 2013, 08:22 AM

This is primarily educational DVcaptioning.

I've been utilizing the trial of Caption Assistant from VASST. It's excellent for title sync, but without properties control such as vertical and horizontal positioning of the text (no options for positioning to avoid conflict with on screen titles, etc..... and no control of transparency of the text background).

I'm reviewing the markup language commands in Vegas, but have had no luck in sorting out how to enter the parameters and how these commands are done. Hopefully, at least in the case of transparency adjustments... if they are even possible, it can be achieved globally. Marker-by-marker command inserts is obviously not a practical method when it comes to captions with 20 to 30 of them per minute of running time.

That will likely be the topic of my next forum plea!

Thanks Seth... hope all is well in the big city.

February 10th, 2013, 10:09 AM	#1
Marty Baggen Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: monroe, or Posts: 572	Time-Stretch with Markers Is there a way of Time-Stretching that shifts all markers relative to the the revised clip speed? I've found it very helpful to place CC entries while the source is playing back at less-than full speed. Once the CC markers are in, I would like to return the clip to normal speed with the cues maintaining their relative positions.

February 10th, 2013, 11:34 AM	#2
Seth Bloombaum Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,420	Re: Time-Stretch with Markers Now that's an interesting workflow question! So far as I know, it's not directly possible. However, I can think of a couple things to explore. Probably the most straightforward and flexible method would be to use J-K-L scrubbing. J = play reverse 1x K = pause L = play forward 1x spacebar = start stop play, return cursor to start of playback Maybe you knew about this. JJ= play reverse 2x JJJ = 3x LL = 2x, etc. But, did you know about this: K+L = play forward 1/8x (or is it 1/4?) K+ LL = play forward faster, 1/4 or 1/2x And so on. To do this trick, you hold down the K key and hit the L key a few times. To do these playback speed changes without stretching the media means markers never get misaligned! For another approach, there are "Promote Markers" scripts that transfer markers embedded in the media up to the timeline. Perhaps there are "Demote Markers" scripts as well. If this could be done, you'd do your playbacks with stretched media, mark your CCs, demote the markers from the timeline to the media, unstretch the clip, then promote the marker back to the timeline. Seems too complicated. I always think about just how many clicks it takes to do something. For another approach, if keyboard shortcuts are unappealing, there is the little yellow "playback rate" control, um, where is that thing? I'm not in front of Vegas at the moment... But I like keyboard shortcuts! After a while, they get intuitive, automatic, and extremely fast to work with. __________________ 30 years of pro media production. Vegas user since 1.0. Webcaster since 1997. Freelancer since 2000. College instructor since 2001.

February 10th, 2013, 04:58 PM	#3
Marty Baggen Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: monroe, or Posts: 572	Re: Time-Stretch with Markers Seth... you have provided further evidence that the most clever minds are in Oregon. The K + L sequence looks to be the solution. I tried to find a method of slower playback, and you have provided it. I'll be giving it a try soon, and will confirm the results here when I do. Until then... thanks for solving the issue of stretch-marks.

February 10th, 2013, 10:36 PM	#4
Marty Baggen Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: monroe, or Posts: 572	Re: Time-Stretch with Markers Works like a charm Seth.... thank you very much for the tips!

February 11th, 2013, 12:00 PM	#5
Seth Bloombaum Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,420	Re: Time-Stretch with Markers Happy keyboarding, Marty! Glad it seems like this will work out for you. I haven't worked with AVID, but Vegas' keyboard scrubbing is way more flexible than FCP or Premiere. This is a great little method for finding edit points too, of course, and there are lots of other keyboard shortcuts for working fast. What market are you editing for that requires CC? Just curious... __________________ 30 years of pro media production. Vegas user since 1.0. Webcaster since 1997. Freelancer since 2000. College instructor since 2001.

February 12th, 2013, 08:22 AM	#6
Marty Baggen Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: monroe, or Posts: 572	Re: Time-Stretch with Markers This is primarily educational DVcaptioning. I've been utilizing the trial of Caption Assistant from VASST. It's excellent for title sync, but without properties control such as vertical and horizontal positioning of the text (no options for positioning to avoid conflict with on screen titles, etc..... and no control of transparency of the text background). I'm reviewing the markup language commands in Vegas, but have had no luck in sorting out how to enter the parameters and how these commands are done. Hopefully, at least in the case of transparency adjustments... if they are even possible, it can be achieved globally. Marker-by-marker command inserts is obviously not a practical method when it comes to captions with 20 to 30 of them per minute of running time. That will likely be the topic of my next forum plea! Thanks Seth... hope all is well in the big city.