Workflow Issue: Got To Be A Better Way! at DVinfo.net

Ken Matson · January 3rd, 2012, 11:05 AM

Hi all,

So I do a lot of simple transfers of home video tapes (usually VHS but I see it all) to DVD. For most, I just toss it in my consumer copier and I'm done. But I also offer "light editing" services for a little more money. This usually means doing a few fades in/out, losing large drop-out sections, etc. Sometimes I also add a nice menu with chapters, etc in DVD-A.

Here's the problems in workflow I run into that really make it non-profitable at the moment.

1 - I usually copy the VHS to DVD with hardware copier and then pull the vob files into Vegas to edit. I can't believe how poorly Vegas handles these! I have a big bad computer and these stupid VOBs nearly kill it, while I can work with say, AVCHD with no problem at all!

2 - Most of these are around 2 hours (they shot them on 2 hour VHS tapes). If I try to burn DVD straight from Vegas - it tells me it needs like 9G? huh? Forcing me to render and go to DVD-A even if I need no menus or anything. I see no controls for bit rate when burning DVD from Vegas?

3 - Vegas just will NOT line up separate/contiguous VOB files properly - leaving a gap in audio. I've tried all the import methods. I have to use 3rd party VOB merge to get it sewn together, and then I'm dealing with 4G file which I'm sure doesn't help issue #1.

If someone has better suggestion fro any of these problems or overall better workflow for what I'm doing, I would be grateful to hear about it. TIA!

KenM

Edward Troxel · January 3rd, 2012, 11:13 AM

#1 - why not just capture straight to DV instead of going through a DVD (and losing quality) to get it into the computer. Just run the VCR to a convertor like the Canopus ADVC 100 and capture via firewire. That would eliminate many of the other issues you refer to.

#1b - Instead of dragging the VOB files to the timeline, you should use the File - Import - DVD Camcorder Disc instead which will bring in properly formatted MPEG2 files.

#2 - DVD Architect is dumb when it comes to file sizes. If you render out the MPEG2/AC3 files and they're the proper size and you know they are the proper size, ignore it and just go on.

#3 - can be eliminated by changing #1 and capturing DV. You can also eliminate it using the basic DOS "copy" command as follows:

copy /b file1.mpg + file2.mpg + file3.mpg outputfile.mpg

This will merge file1, file2, and file3 into a single new "outputfile" with no audio gaps.

I've read another solution about just copying the entire file structure in and then loading one of the other files (the IFO file maybe?) and it would import correctly as well. I'm sure it's posted on this site somewhere.

Mike Kujbida · January 3rd, 2012, 11:15 AM

Here's the post I made a little while ago that does indeed work like a charm.

If you're like me, you periodically have to import a DVD.
The problem has always been the short gap in the audio and video at the VOB break points.
There are a variety of ways to work around this but now, thanks to Gary James on the Sony Vegas forum, there's a MUCH better and easier way.
I'll quote his post verbatim.

Vegas allows you to open up a DVD .IFO file. This imports the entire .VOB chain for both video and audio tracks.

Click File > Open, then navigate to your VIDEO_TS sub directory and enter *.IFO in the File name input field.
For a regular DVD you will see a VIDEO_TS.IFO, and a VTS_01_0.IFO. Select the VTS_01_0.IFO file and click on Open.
Don't try this on a DVD disk because Vegas will try to build an .sfk file containing audio peaks in the VIDEO_TS directory.

Ken Matson · January 3rd, 2012, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Kujbida

Click File > Open, then navigate to your VIDEO_TS sub directory and enter *.IFO in the File name input field.

Yep - that works pretty well - thanks for the info!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Troxel

#1 - why not just capture straight to DV instead of going through a DVD (and losing quality) to get it into the computer. Just run the VCR to a convertor like the Canopus ADVC 100 and capture via firewire. That would eliminate many of the other issues you refer to.

I have a Decklink Studio Card - and will likely start doing that - i just hate tying up the big computer to capture crappy home vhs video. Letting the hardware unit do it offline is efficient.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Troxel

#2 - DVD Architect is dumb when it comes to file sizes. If you render out the MPEG2/AC3 files and they're the proper size and you know they are the proper size, ignore it and just go on.

I'm not in DVD-A at this point - trying to burn STRAIGHT from Vegas (tools menu) - I see no compression options. One would THINK that a two hour video would naturally fit on a DVD.

Thanks - still aggravating all the time it takes just to add a few fades to a home movie .... maybe I need another consumer type tool for this?

Edward Troxel · January 3rd, 2012, 01:35 PM

Ahhh... I never burn DVDs straight from the Vegas timeline. One would think it would give you the option of bitrate. So it looks like you'll need to render using File - Render As so you can choose the proper bitrate desired and then burn with DVD Architect.

Mike Kujbida · January 3rd, 2012, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Matson

I'm not in DVD-A at this point - trying to burn STRAIGHT from Vegas (tools menu) - I see no compression options. One would THINK that a two hour video would naturally fit on a DVD.

My experience has been that using this option limits you to one hour at the most.
Anything longer and you have to render to MPEG-2 and AC-3 and use DVD Architect..

Quote:

.... maybe I need another consumer type tool for this?

Womble has several different products to check out.

Jeff Harper · January 3rd, 2012, 04:30 PM

DVDA has a single movie, non menu option that requires virtually no learning curve. You render out as suggested with Vegas to a bit rate that will allow your movie to fit on a DVD.

The absolutely simplest option if you insist on burning from Vegas, would be to use a dual layer disc. I stopped using single layers for the most part and there is no more concern with quality vs size of the files.

Leslie Wand · January 3rd, 2012, 07:24 PM

womble dvd. enough said....

Ken Matson · January 5th, 2012, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leslie Wand

womble dvd. enough said....

Looks promising - I think I'll try the free trial next one of these projects .... thanks!

January 3rd, 2012, 01:35 PM	#5
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Re: Workflow Issue: Got To Be A Better Way! Ahhh... I never burn DVDs straight from the Vegas timeline. One would think it would give you the option of bitrate. So it looks like you'll need to render using File - Render As so you can choose the proper bitrate desired and then burn with DVD Architect. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

January 3rd, 2012, 04:30 PM	#7
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Workflow Issue: Got To Be A Better Way! DVDA has a single movie, non menu option that requires virtually no learning curve. You render out as suggested with Vegas to a bit rate that will allow your movie to fit on a DVD. The absolutely simplest option if you insist on burning from Vegas, would be to use a dual layer disc. I stopped using single layers for the most part and there is no more concern with quality vs size of the files.

January 3rd, 2012, 07:24 PM	#8
Leslie Wand Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: upper hunter, australia Posts: 1,410	Re: Workflow Issue: Got To Be A Better Way! womble dvd. enough said.... __________________ www.lesliewand.com.au

January 3rd, 2012, 11:05 AM	#1
Ken Matson Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Central, PA Posts: 30	Workflow Issue: Got To Be A Better Way! Hi all, So I do a lot of simple transfers of home video tapes (usually VHS but I see it all) to DVD. For most, I just toss it in my consumer copier and I'm done. But I also offer "light editing" services for a little more money. This usually means doing a few fades in/out, losing large drop-out sections, etc. Sometimes I also add a nice menu with chapters, etc in DVD-A. Here's the problems in workflow I run into that really make it non-profitable at the moment. 1 - I usually copy the VHS to DVD with hardware copier and then pull the vob files into Vegas to edit. I can't believe how poorly Vegas handles these! I have a big bad computer and these stupid VOBs nearly kill it, while I can work with say, AVCHD with no problem at all! 2 - Most of these are around 2 hours (they shot them on 2 hour VHS tapes). If I try to burn DVD straight from Vegas - it tells me it needs like 9G? huh? Forcing me to render and go to DVD-A even if I need no menus or anything. I see no controls for bit rate when burning DVD from Vegas? 3 - Vegas just will NOT line up separate/contiguous VOB files properly - leaving a gap in audio. I've tried all the import methods. I have to use 3rd party VOB merge to get it sewn together, and then I'm dealing with 4G file which I'm sure doesn't help issue #1. If someone has better suggestion fro any of these problems or overall better workflow for what I'm doing, I would be grateful to hear about it. TIA! KenM __________________ KenM

January 3rd, 2012, 11:13 AM	#2
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Re: Workflow Issue: Got To Be A Better Way! #1 - why not just capture straight to DV instead of going through a DVD (and losing quality) to get it into the computer. Just run the VCR to a convertor like the Canopus ADVC 100 and capture via firewire. That would eliminate many of the other issues you refer to. #1b - Instead of dragging the VOB files to the timeline, you should use the File - Import - DVD Camcorder Disc instead which will bring in properly formatted MPEG2 files. #2 - DVD Architect is dumb when it comes to file sizes. If you render out the MPEG2/AC3 files and they're the proper size and you know they are the proper size, ignore it and just go on. #3 - can be eliminated by changing #1 and capturing DV. You can also eliminate it using the basic DOS "copy" command as follows: copy /b file1.mpg + file2.mpg + file3.mpg outputfile.mpg This will merge file1, file2, and file3 into a single new "outputfile" with no audio gaps. I've read another solution about just copying the entire file structure in and then loading one of the other files (the IFO file maybe?) and it would import correctly as well. I'm sure it's posted on this site somewhere. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

January 3rd, 2012, 11:15 AM	#3
Mike Kujbida Inner Circle Join Date: May 2005 Location: Windsor, ON Canada Posts: 2,770	Re: Workflow Issue: Got To Be A Better Way! Here's the post I made a little while ago that does indeed work like a charm. If you're like me, you periodically have to import a DVD. The problem has always been the short gap in the audio and video at the VOB break points. There are a variety of ways to work around this but now, thanks to Gary James on the Sony Vegas forum, there's a MUCH better and easier way. I'll quote his post verbatim. Vegas allows you to open up a DVD .IFO file. This imports the entire .VOB chain for both video and audio tracks. Click File > Open, then navigate to your VIDEO_TS sub directory and enter *.IFO in the File name input field. For a regular DVD you will see a VIDEO_TS.IFO, and a VTS_01_0.IFO. Select the VTS_01_0.IFO file and click on Open. Don't try this on a DVD disk because Vegas will try to build an .sfk file containing audio peaks in the VIDEO_TS directory.