Footage in a wrapper, does Vegas automatically deal with it? at DVinfo.net

Jeff Harper · December 31st, 2011, 09:14 AM

In other threads I've heard it said you can mix, say, 24p footage with 24p 60i (wrapper) and that "Your NLE will deal with it".

It is my understanding for best results I would want to remove the pulldown before bringing into Vegas so that the frame rates match. That's how I've done it, anyway.

Is the statement that one can mixed wrapped and unwrapped footage, regardless of NLE, and it will be treated properly, automatically?

Thanks in advance for any help.

David Jimerson · December 31st, 2011, 05:04 PM

Vegas will remove pulldown automatically if there are flags to tell it to do so.

In HDV material, they usually do not exist. AVCHD may or may not have them. DV does. DVCPRO (25, 50, HD) does.

Not every NLE is the same. Some require that you remove pulldown at ingest (FCP, Avid). Some do it automatically just by dropping it onto a timeline (Vegas, Premiere Pro, Edius). Some can't do it at all (Liquid).

Some can only remove advanced (2:3:3:2) pulldown (FCP) and will require you to use other software to remove standard (2:3) pulldown.

Now, if you're wanting to mix the footage on a 60i timeline, then yes, for the most part, any NLE will be able to handle it, because *adding* pulldown to the 24p material is easy. But if it's all underlying 24p footage, you should edit it on a 24p timeline if you're able to, so you'll want to remove pulldown.

I would caution against calling it a "wrapper," though. A "wrapper" would be a file format like AVI or MOV or MXF; these are wrappers which can contain (almost) any codec. When you add pulldown to 24p, it's because you're encoding it into a 59.94 stream. It's not the same thing -- while a wrapper is agnostic and it's the codec that matters, a 59.94 stream is actually a full-blown 59.94 file. It will be treated as such unless pulldown is then removed.

Jeff Harper · January 1st, 2012, 08:24 AM

David, thanks for the explanation, and for discussing pulldown vs wrapper.

I wonder if there are differences between the nature of the 30p footage from the GH2 and XA10. I need to learn that myself, since I own the cameras, obviously, but the concepts here are still a but fuzzy for me, despite your good explanation..

Previously, I've shot in 24p in a 60i stream with the GH1 and for lack of knowing what else to do I simply removed pulldown with Cineform, and then brought into the timeline and all was well, in order to mix it with true 24p footage.

December 31st, 2011, 09:14 AM	#1
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Footage in a wrapper, does Vegas automatically deal with it? In other threads I've heard it said you can mix, say, 24p footage with 24p 60i (wrapper) and that "Your NLE will deal with it". It is my understanding for best results I would want to remove the pulldown before bringing into Vegas so that the frame rates match. That's how I've done it, anyway. Is the statement that one can mixed wrapped and unwrapped footage, regardless of NLE, and it will be treated properly, automatically? Thanks in advance for any help.

December 31st, 2011, 05:04 PM	#2
David Jimerson Jubal 28 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Wilmington, NC Posts: 872	Re: Footage in a wrapper, does Vegas automatically deal with it? Vegas will remove pulldown automatically if there are flags to tell it to do so. In HDV material, they usually do not exist. AVCHD may or may not have them. DV does. DVCPRO (25, 50, HD) does. Not every NLE is the same. Some require that you remove pulldown at ingest (FCP, Avid). Some do it automatically just by dropping it onto a timeline (Vegas, Premiere Pro, Edius). Some can't do it at all (Liquid). Some can only remove advanced (2:3:3:2) pulldown (FCP) and will require you to use other software to remove standard (2:3) pulldown. Now, if you're wanting to mix the footage on a 60i timeline, then yes, for the most part, any NLE will be able to handle it, because adding pulldown to the 24p material is easy. But if it's all underlying 24p footage, you should edit it on a 24p timeline if you're able to, so you'll want to remove pulldown. I would caution against calling it a "wrapper," though. A "wrapper" would be a file format like AVI or MOV or MXF; these are wrappers which can contain (almost) any codec. When you add pulldown to 24p, it's because you're encoding it into a 59.94 stream. It's not the same thing -- while a wrapper is agnostic and it's the codec that matters, a 59.94 stream is actually a full-blown 59.94 file. It will be treated as such unless pulldown is then removed. __________________ www.wrightsvillebeachstudios.com

January 1st, 2012, 08:24 AM	#3
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Footage in a wrapper, does Vegas automatically deal with it? David, thanks for the explanation, and for discussing pulldown vs wrapper. I wonder if there are differences between the nature of the 30p footage from the GH2 and XA10. I need to learn that myself, since I own the cameras, obviously, but the concepts here are still a but fuzzy for me, despite your good explanation.. Previously, I've shot in 24p in a 60i stream with the GH1 and for lack of knowing what else to do I simply removed pulldown with Cineform, and then brought into the timeline and all was well, in order to mix it with true 24p footage.