Can Vegas Pro 10 handle everything I need ??

[Edward Troxel]

I know DV and HDV use firewire. Not sure of any others. I'd think tv stations would be going tapeless at this time instead of sticking with tape and firewire.

[Jeff Harper]

Firewire is a delivery system and doesn't have a format. Cameras have the format...tape, AVCHD, etc. The EX3 uses expensive cards. It might also use tapes, I don't know if it does both.

Some guys might be using hard disc recording units on their cameras. Likely those drives use firewire also.

The Sony Z5 and Z7 can accomodate a special sony recording unit that might be ideal for your usage:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/580065-REG/Sony_HVR_MRC1K_HVR_MRC1_MEMORY_RECORDING_UNIT.html
I might be wrong, but with one of the cameras above and the recording unit you'd be set, I would think. You can even record with both tape and recording unit at same time so you'll have a backup.

I suspect the Z5 would be a good choice..the Z7 has interchangeable lenses, don't think you'd need that, but I could be wrong.

[Don Parrish]

Thanks Edward and Jeff,

I am guessing the firewire port on an EX3 would simply output the native files of the camera. The more I think the more I have to learn. It use to be I dealt with video that was ready to be displayed on a television, I guess I am going to have to research editing capabilities of the local stations, more to learn.

Thanks Folks

[Mike Calla]

I'll second what Jeff said - a million times. Vegas is great but not in "professional" environment!.

Harsh words yes, but its true! not to say those of us who use it are not professionals, but off the top of my head, i don't know ANYONE but me (and you guys) who uses Vegas in a professional setting!!!!!! Almost everyone uses FCP, and i know a few top tier guys who use AVID!

I wouldn't dare mention to my clients that i edit on Vegas unless i have to and that is usually well after many days of rough cuts when they finally come in and sit in on the final edit and by that time the edit speaks for itself! I even have cracked copies of CS4 and Avid on hand just in case a client inquires (they almost never do and i never ever use those apps). Same with Protools M-Powered! I bought it (well it was free with gear), but never use it. I do everything in ACID (multi tracking, mixing, mastering, composing, etc).

I love Vegas COMPLETELY!!!!!!!!, I've rarely had problems since version one, but lets face reality; 99.9% of professionals have probably never seen it before and would dismiss it with a wave of their hand.

If you are producing and delivering by yourself, then you can get by easily. But even some dupe houses ingest via avid and fcp using project files! Beware!

Plus, in the future if you don't know FCP, AVID and even PPro, sorry, jobby go bye bye for mr.Vegas user:)! (ever see an ad asking for Vegas editors? EVER??!!!!?)

Take it from someone who's been at it while. Don't use vegas! Buy a iMac/FCP - or hell, find a student who can get a educational discount and get AVID!

Lastly support from 3rd party manufacturers and software developers routinely neglect Vegas! Where as FCP, Avid and even Adobe get new hardware/software constantly. CONSTANTLY!!!

Vegas is awesome but DON'T BUY VEGAS!

[Edward Troxel]

Originally Posted by Mike Calla

(ever see an ad asking for Vegas editors? EVER??!!!!?)

Yes.

There's no reason Vegas can't be used in conjunction with broadcast environments. Yes, if you need to share PROJECTS with someone else, you must use the same editor. However, If I was giving footage to a broadcastor, I would either be giving them the raw footage for THEM to edit or it would be already edited when I gave it to them!

[Jeff Harper]

Edward, you are correct, as always. I'm thinking along the lines of Mike also. If I were to start with a new system today, it would be FCP. Why? I could actually work for other people. I have friends who would throw me extra editing work if I used FCP. They've told me so. They love my editing, but I cannot drive an hour and spend all day editing at their studio. Starting from scratch, FCP wouldn't be a bad choice.

It's much pricier with the hardware, but the things that I see my friends doing, particularly with motion, which I believe is fully integrated with FCP when installed, is amazing. The things they do with DVD menus completely blows me away...3d DVD menus with motion graphics...just crazy stuff.

For handing off raw files Vegas will work, and save a ton of money, if that is all you need to do. I have to admit, I don't brag to anyone I use it either. They always say "Huh?" when I mention it.

Vegas does what I need, and overall it is a great program for event work.

[Don Parrish]

I think Vegas 10 will be what will fill my need. I will be handing off raw video for what I do. I do have a couple of questions, forgive me as I am still learning everyday.

1. When you hand them a completely finished product, what will it be in after completing the project with Vegas, uncompressed, blue ray ?

2. Video that comes out of a camera is in it's native codec, such as the sony EX files stored on the SXS cards? The HD/SDI bnc outputs raw video, no compression, but it's digital, it must be in some kind of format right ??

[Jeff Harper]

Don, if you are handing off raw video as you say, you are not editing it. If it is edited it is not really raw any more.

I would think you would download the video to a portable hard drive and let the station have it that way, or however they want it delivered. Technically if you are handing off raw footage you wouldn't even need an editing program. Obviously you would want one to play with things and to help you learn from mistakes with your camera, but for raw footage delivery you don't actually NEED an editing program.

Anyway the type of files on the camera depend on the camera. the files on the Z5-Z7 would be m2t files.

On the HMC-150 they would be AVCHD type. Don't know about the EX1.

[Seth Bloombaum]

Originally Posted by Don Parrish

...
1. When you hand them a completely finished product, what will it be in after completing the project with Vegas, uncompressed, blue ray ?

2. Video that comes out of a camera is in it's native codec, such as the sony EX files stored on the SXS cards? The HD/SDI bnc outputs raw video, no compression, but it's digital, it must be in some kind of format right ??

1) A project completed in Vegas can be delivered in any of many formats. Let's see, mxf, avi, qt, either of those last two could be in any of several codecs. Vegas can deliver others, but those would be the most likely candidates for a broadcaster. Vegas won't render QT ProRes422, which might be a typical delivery from FinalCut. Vegas will do Avid DNxHD (if you download the appropriate codec), which might be a typical delivery from AVID. MXF might be used in an all-Sony house. AVI can wrap a whole series of codecs, including Cineform and uncompressed. Usually, you'd deliver any of these on a portable hard drive.

2) The Sony EX1 and EX3 deliver XDCAM-EX format files on the SxS, and get wrapped in MXF.

HD-SDI only comes in a couple flavors, "regular" and dual-link. This is a transmission standard, not a storage standard. AFAIK, any device that records HD-SDI lays it down in some codec, ProRes422 is common, Cineform on a few. Vegas will read ProRes (but can't write it).

I think the OP would do well to get the spec from a couple broadcasters he might shop footage or program to, and see what they expect.

[Philip Howells]

This thread interests me greatly and bothers me a little so may I ask this question?

I'm planning to move from Avid Liquid 7.2 to Vegas 10 (64-bit). I was hoping to do so (installing Windows 7 64-bit and Vegas 10 64 bit on my computer in a natural lull in my business but now I find I shall have a couple of incomplete programmes. They consist of various sections of a 2 hour programme each section consisting of edited vision and mixed voice tracks. They will need the addition of music tracks the client hasn't yet chosen and then stitching together to create the finished programmes which will then be authored to DVDs.

I was planning to take them to a point when no further editing was required in Liquid then fuse them to m2v/wav files and import those into Vegas 10 for completion.

Is that possible and is there a better way? I confess that even in advance of this thread I was considering delaying the changeover until both programmes had been completed, approved and delivered. Although 80% of our work is approved at first edit my gut instinct is also telling e that if I've made a serious error that needs editing I might be creating quite a problem by not waiting.

Your views and advice would be welcomed.

[Gerald Webb]

Phillip, do you mind me asking why you would want come to Vegas rather than on to MC5?
I just kind of thought that if you knew your way around in Avid, wouldn't Vegas be a bit limited in its tool set?

[Philip Howells]

Gerald I'm coming to the end of my career and until Avid started playing half-truths three years ago over NextGen (the Liquid replacement) it provided most of my needs. In the time it took for Avid to come clean and admit they had no intention of replacing Liquid the other serious NLEs developed further refinements.

I would have remained with Liquid, after all if it ain't broke .... but I found that important things like New Blue plugins simply aren't being made for Liquid any more - furthermore when I tried to install a Liquid version of a plugin I managed to source thanks to Ed Troxel here, it wouldn't install and the best I got from an Avid Liquid moderator was "plugins have always been tricky in Liquid". It was this last remark which finally determined me to move.

I could have moved to MC it's true but although the transfer cost was about the same as buying new into Vegas or Edius, the almost annual upgrades which often cost the same again made it unattractive. Then there is the very precise specification of the computer on which MC is supported. Of course the forums tell how MC works adequately on other spec computers but that's not reassuring. Finally, MC does far more than my rather modest needs now I do almost only weddings.

A pal in the wedding forum assured me that after a lifetime of NLE experience starting with MC when it was on a dedicated Mac, through Fast, Pinnacle, a diversion to Premiere, then Liquid, converting to Vegas wouldn't be a huge curve - and even then it would be a matter of finding out how to do what I wanted not finding out what I wanted in the first place.

Given that, do you think I'm making the wrong decision? It's probably too late to persuade Avid to let me into their transfer scheme which ended last June but your advice would be valuable.

[Leslie Wand]

philip,

i think, considering your circumstances, you'll find vegas offers all you could want and much more.

after 40+ years in the film and tv industry, and having worked with nearly every nle (from avid through to vegas - with almost every letter inbetween), i can assure you as an indie producer you'll want for nothing (other than buying plugins, a faster pc, bigger monitors, etc.,)

my only reservations have been voiced by many above - it's not industry standard in as much as there's literally no collaboration path, and it can't even spit out a cmx edl - but otherwise it rocks.....

[Philip Howells]

Leslie, that's very encouraging, thank you.

I long ago learned that nothing in life is perfect and I know I shall miss never having to save and the background rendering of Liquid but the disadvantages of Liquid now outweigh the advantages.

[Don Bloom]

Hi Philip,
I remember when Liquid first came out. Man I thought it was the cats meow, then I tried it and well let's just say it wasn't my cup of tea although it has some very innovative stuff for it's time.
I've been using Vegas since version 2 and have done all kinds of stuff, short and long form type stuff with it over the years, use many of the NewBlue plugins, have had stuff published on the web, on the TV and on the "big screen" (stuff for seminars projected onto the 10 and 12 foot fast folds ;-0 ).
While Vegas doesn't talk well with other NLEs that has never been a problem for me and I have been a happy camper with it. There is very little I can't do with it and botom line is that my clients are quite happy with the finished product I deliver. As one of my corporate clients once told me " I don't care if you use Movie Maker" to do the job, all I care about is what thefinished product looks like".
Learning curve is really not all that bad and after a couple of days one should have been able to figure out enough to be able to get thru an edit, maybe not as fast as one would like but that'll come in time.
I love Vegas (the software-well the town also but that's a different story).
Edward T has those great newsletter that although they may be written for the older versions the basics of Vegas are still the same, you might want to check them out if you haven't already.