New DIY PC For Sony Vegas 9.0

[Spiro Kalogeropoulos]

I purchased a used G-Technologies 8TB G-Speed ES Drive system on eBay, only to find out that I only have two PCI-E 1x slots available on my PC and the G-Speed has a PCI-E 4x card, so I think the only way I can use the hard drive system is to purchase an entirely new Motherboard, Processor, and RAM. I would appreciate your opinion on the following system (not enough, overkill, technical conflicts, etc.?). I will be editing video in VEGAS 9.0 from my Canon 5D MkII in HD. Here are the components with the NewEgg links:

Intel LGA 1156 Intel P55 ATX Intel Motherboard (Newegg.com - Intel BOXDP55KG LGA 1156 Intel P55 ATX Intel Motherboard)

Intel Core i5-750 Lynnfield 2.66GHz 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Processor (Newegg.com - Intel Core i5-750 Lynnfield 2.66GHz 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Processor BX80605I5750)

16 GB TOTAL - Qty (2) Crucial 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Desktop Memory (Newegg.com - Crucial 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Desktop Memory Model CT2KIT51264BA1339) - 16 GB Total


THANKS!

[Randall Leong]

Spiro,

That Intel-branded P55 motherboard is okay, but like all other LGA 1156/P55 platforms the DP55KG/i5-750 combo suffers from not having enough full-bandwidth PCIe 2.0 lanes for any serious editing work. With that motherboard, your G-RAID card will be forced to use either the PCIe x8 slot (which would drop the main PCIe x16 slot to x8 mode) or the half-bandwidth PCIe x4 slot (which would have only one-fourth of the total slot bandwidth of the PCIe x8 slot due to Intel artificially restricting the P55 PCH's PCIe hub to half of the full clock speed of the PCIe 2.0 bus). And newer PCIe RAID cards are now just beginning to out-transfer a PCIe 1.0 x4 slot. In addition, the DP55KG is somewhat pricey for a P55 motherboard which lacks both onboard SATA 6Gbps and USB 3.0 controllers (however, the DP55KG adds two internal SATA 3 Gbps ports controlled by a Marvell controller in addition to the six internal SATA 3 Gbps ports native to the P55 PCH).

Also, your choice of an i5-750 is less than ideal for a video editing system: It lacks HyperThreading, which adds four logical cores to the four physical cores (hence the four-core, eight-thread spec of the i7 processors). As such, the i5-7xx processors have four cores but only four threads.

For serious video editing you're better off with an X58 motherboard and an LGA 1366 processor like the i7-950. If you pick the 1366/X58 combo, make sure that you also purchase 12GB or more of RAM, especially if you are planning to purchase Adobe Premiere Pro CS5.

By the way, unless you're going to work directly with AVCHD footage Vegas 9 Pro does not take full advantage of even a three-year-old Core 2 Quad system, let anone an i5 or i7 system.

[Spiro Kalogeropoulos]

That’s really good information. Thank You. I didn’t know there were such differences between chipsets, but I suppose the differences do get exaggerated when you’re trying to push the limits of the systems. I did a little more research and did realize that the i7 processors were the preferred CPUs for video editing.

So, with regards to a X58 motherboard I found one Intel and one ASUS (see below). Will both of these motherboards accept an i7-870 processor and the Crucial RAM I’d listed in my first post without any problems? Looks like the ASUS has more room for RAM. Let me know if one motherboard is more preferred than the other. I also noticed that many are ditching the stock cooler that comes with the processor for the “Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus” unit. Does this really make a big difference?


Intel Board with 2 x PCIe 2.0 x16, 1 x PCI Express x4, 2 x PCI Express x1, and 1 x PCI Slot
Newegg.com - Intel Extreme Series BOXDX58SO LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX Intel Motherboard


ASUS Board with 3 x PCIe 2.0 x16 (at x16/x8/x8 or x16/x16/x1 mode), 1 x PCI Express x1, and 2 x PCI Slots
Newegg.com - ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard


Finally, you mentioned that Vegas 9.0 Pro would be unable to tap into the processing capabilities of an i7 processor. Is this due to limitations with Sony Vegas software? Or would updating to Vegas 10 help open up it’s processing capabilities? I will probably be getting Cineform Neoscene to convert the files from my Canon 5D MkII, to enable easier processing in post (i.e. Magic bullet’s Looks, etc.).

More input would be very much appreciated. Thanks.

[Jeff Harper]

Yes, Spiro, get 1366 Chipset. Both will work, but the 1366 is better for your files.

[Larry Reavis]

a few months ago I spent a lot of time studying options before building my new computer. I, too, would recommend an X58 MB. Look around for an i7-9?? - some are really cheap. I found a new 940 on Amazon for $225, and built the entire rig for less than $1000. I now run it at around 3.8 mHz. See details at

Sony Creative Software - Forums - Vegas Pro - Video Messages

I'm sorry I got the ECO RAM. It works, but I can't overclock it. After investing so much time reading and building, I'm also sorry I didn't go ahead and spend another $700 or so to get a 980x, which would have given me more than 50% faster speed. But my rig is 100% quirk free, so it's ok.

[Randall Leong]

Originally Posted by Spiro Kalogeropoulos

That’s really good information. Thank You. I didn’t know there were such differences between chipsets, but I suppose the differences do get exaggerated when you’re trying to push the limits of the systems. I did a little more research and did realize that the i7 processors were the preferred CPUs for video editing.

So, with regards to a X58 motherboard I found one Intel and one ASUS (see below). Will both of these motherboards accept an i7-870 processor and the Crucial RAM I’d listed in my first post without any problems? Looks like the ASUS has more room for RAM. Let me know if one motherboard is more preferred than the other. I also noticed that many are ditching the stock cooler that comes with the processor for the “Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus” unit. Does this really make a big difference?


Intel Board with 2 x PCIe 2.0 x16, 1 x PCI Express x4, 2 x PCI Express x1, and 1 x PCI Slot
Newegg.com - Intel Extreme Series BOXDX58SO LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX Intel Motherboard


ASUS Board with 3 x PCIe 2.0 x16 (at x16/x8/x8 or x16/x16/x1 mode), 1 x PCI Express x1, and 2 x PCI Slots
Newegg.com - ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard


Finally, you mentioned that Vegas 9.0 Pro would be unable to tap into the processing capabilities of an i7 processor. Is this due to limitations with Sony Vegas software? Or would updating to Vegas 10 help open up it’s processing capabilities? I will probably be getting Cineform Neoscene to convert the files from my Canon 5D MkII, to enable easier processing in post (i.e. Magic bullet’s Looks, etc.).

More input would be very much appreciated. Thanks.

The i7-870, like other i7-8xx processors, are strictly LGA 1156. 1156 and 1366 are not directly compatible with one another. Among the current Core i7 processors on the market the only ones that are compatible with 1366 and X58 are (from least-expensive to most-expensive) the i7-950, i7-960, i7-970 and i7-980X. Older, lower-numbered CPUs i7-920, i7-930, i7-940, i7-965X and i7-975X are no longer in current production.

Second, Vegas 9 Pro was developed when the i7 processors were still on the drawing board at Intel. The fastest consumer/enthusiast CPUs on the market at the time of Vegas 9's development was a Socket LGA 775 Core 2 Extreme QX9650 and QX9770.

[Spiro Kalogeropoulos]

Sorry about this post being so long, but it seems like there are so many little details that need to be right, or I'll end up buying stuff and then returning it because it doesn't integrate with it's software .

So, I'll need to upgrade to Vegas 10 Pro once I get the system up to speed in order to take advantage of the upgraded hardware. I'll also go ahead and upgrade from Windows XP to Windows 7 (64Bit). Newegg has this OEM verion for $95: Newegg.com - Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit 1-Pack for System Builders - Operating Systems. Is there any benefit to using Windows 7 Pro versus the Home version for video editing purposes?

It looks like the Processor/MoBo combo I will go with will be the i7-950 with the Asus 1366/X58 Motherboard (Newegg.com - Intel Core i7-950 Bloomfield 3.06GHz 4 x 256KB L2 Cache 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor BX80601950) (Newegg.com - ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard). The motherboard has (3) 16x PCIe slots, (1) 1x PCIe slot, and (1) standard PCI slot.

I'll be plugging in an ATI Radeon HD2600 XT video card (512MB GDDR3) into one of the 16x PCIe slots, the 4xPCIe Controller Card for my G-technologies G-Speed ES raid hard drive system into the other 16x PCIe slot (you can do that right?), my M-Audio Audiophile 24/96 card into the standard PCI slot, and my UAD-2 Audio plug-in PCIe 1x card into the PCIe 1x slot. I'll just be left with one open PCIe 16x slot. Does anyone see any conflict with adding all of these cards onto this motherboard like this??

Also, the motherboard says that it has 6-240pin, DDR3 2000(O.C.)/1600/1333/1066, 24MB Max, Triple Channel Supported. Does this mean I have to buy triple channel RAM? Like this one:

Newegg.com - Crucial 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1066 (PC3 8500) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model CT3KIT25664BA1067

Or will this one work with the motherboard?: Newegg.com - Crucial 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Desktop Memory Model CT2KIT51264BA1339

I'd hate to buy all this stuff for close to $1,000 and not have it work when I install it. I appreciate everyone's response and advice.


Thanks.

[Larry Reavis]

buy vegas 10, but park it until bugs are gone - it's generally not faster; search for "Vegas 10" in

Sony Creative Software - Forums - Vegas Pro - Video Messages

For 100% quirk-free editing, I use only 8c. But I always render in 9c-64 - it never fails. I only render in 32-bit (with 9c-32) when I have to produce an intermediate (Cineform or PicVideo) from an interlaced file that I need to deinterlace with the Mike Crash Smart Deinterlace (I only produce 60fps progressive now). Then I put that deinterlaced clip on the 8c timeline for inclusion in my project.

Win7-64 pro has few advantages (WinXP mode, which I don't like as much as the free VMware virtual machine), etc. I have pro, but use few of its benefits above what I could have gotten with home.

triple-channel ram? Yes - but make sure it's compatible (check ASUS website, or RAM manufacturer's website).

ATI cards now are excellent, but some animation apps still prefer nVidia (in case you might want to create some animations). The one I chose is a fairly good performer, and draws little power, and cheap.

The 950 does have some bandwidth benefits in additional to - perhaps - better speed than the 940; but speed is mainly a matter of luck/karma - some chips can be overclocked a lot without quirks, but others of the same designation can't. I'd recommend overclocking - I got 50% or so over stock speed and no quirks, and with acceptable temperatures with my good heatsink, but do it cautiously after reading a bit (the above link on my previous post covers the basics)

[Gregory Gatz]

Originally Posted by Randall Leong

....

By the way, unless you're going to work directly with AVCHD footage Vegas 9 Pro does not take full advantage of even a three-year-old Core 2 Quad system, let alone an i5 or i7 system.

Could you elaborate ?

My experience with 8.0c and now 10 is that rendering speed scales rather nicely ( varies, depending on the codec ) with the number of cores, both real and virtual ..

[Jeff Harper]

Gregory, yes, you are right, the faster the processor, more cores, the faster Vegas will be, generally speaking.

[Spiro Kalogeropoulos]

I pulled up the acceptable RAM for the ASUS P6X58D motherboard and it has various manufacturers and types of RAM available. Is 1600 necessarily better or faster than 1333 RAM? Is there a manufacturer that is preferred?

Also, the board specs say that triple channel RAM is supported. I'm not sure what this is, but I'm assuming the board will support any kind of RAM including triple channel?

The motherboard has 6 RAM slots, so are there certain guidlines with regards to which slots need to be filled in a certain order or only filling an even instead of an odd number of slots casuing issues?

I was thinking of maxing the board out with RAM (24 MB), but from what I'm reading here it is overkill to do anything above 12MB (also, some people are saying they have 12MB but thier system is only reading 8MB, what's up with that?). I'm thinking 6 sticks of 1333 DDR3 2MB RAM would do the trick.

How does this look for the P6X58D board?: Newegg.com - Crucial 2GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Desktop Memory Model CT25664BA1339
Let me know if there are any other issues with regards to voltage, buffered/unbuffered/latency/etc that I should be concerned with.

Thanks.

[Spiro Kalogeropoulos]

I think this is the better Crucial RAM (I'm runing the DDR2 Ballistix in my current system).

Crucial Ballistix 2GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model

Newegg.com - Crucial Ballistix 2GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model BL25664BN1608

It is listed in the MoBo manual as being compatible. 6 Sticks for 12 MB total.

[Spiro Kalogeropoulos]

Or with this I can fill in only 3 of the 6 RAM slots and get 12MB RAM, while having the capability to add more at a later time. This specific Corsair model numberis not shown in the QVL for the ASUS P6X58D motherboard.

Newegg.com - CORSAIR DOMINATOR 12GB (3 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMP12GX3M3A1600C9

[Adam Stanislav]

Originally Posted by Spiro Kalogeropoulos

I pulled up the acceptable RAM for the ASUS P6X58D motherboard and it has various manufacturers and types of RAM available. Is 1600 necessarily better or faster than 1333 RAM?

I have just built one with that motherboard and an i7 950. It turned out my power supply was dead, so I will not be able to test it until the new power supply arrives. I did, however, put 24 gigabytes of 1333 DDR3 RAM into it because I downloaded the motherboard manual before I ordered all the parts and there it says the Intel spec prohibits using two 1600 memory sticks together (that is one in the blue slot and one in the adjacent black slot on the motherboard). So, at least in theory, you can only go with 1600 if you plan to fill only one half of the available memory slots, which would limit you to 12 Gig.

Twice as much memory is better than a slight increase in memory speed (1600 is only 1.2 times faster than 1333). That is because Windows always runs zillion processes in the background (mostly without your knowledge) and all of them consume memory. If you have less memory, Windows starts swapping processes from the memory to the hard drive and back all the time (again, mostly without your knowledge). And that takes more time than you gain by having faster memory but less of it.

Memory is relatively inexpensive in comparison with the cost of the rest of the things you need to build a computer. So it is always best to use as much memory as the motherboard allows. So, go with the 1333.

[Larry Reavis]

Originally Posted by Spiro Kalogeropoulos

I pulled up the acceptable RAM for the ASUS P6X58D motherboard and it has various manufacturers and types of RAM available. Is 1600 necessarily better or faster than 1333 RAM? Is there a manufacturer that is preferred?

Also, the board specs say that triple channel RAM is supported. I'm not sure what this is, but I'm assuming the board will support any kind of RAM including triple channel?

The motherboard has 6 RAM slots, so are there certain guidlines with regards to which slots need to be filled in a certain order or only filling an even instead of an odd number of slots casuing issues?

I was thinking of maxing the board out with RAM (24 MB), but from what I'm reading here it is overkill to do anything above 12MB (also, some people are saying they have 12MB but thier system is only reading 8MB, what's up with that?). I'm thinking 6 sticks of 1333 DDR3 2MB RAM would do the trick.

How does this look for the P6X58D board?: Newegg.com - Crucial 2GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Desktop Memory Model CT25664BA1339
Let me know if there are any other issues with regards to voltage, buffered/unbuffered/latency/etc that I should be concerned with.

Thanks.

1. Yes, 1600 is better than lower speed. That was my main mistake when I built my rig. Rendering speed won't be enhanced, but preview playback without stutter is much enhanced, according to those who have done a lot more testing of RAM speed than I have.

2. Slots: yes, you need to populate according to your owner's manual - you can't expect good results if you have, say, three sticks and just put them wherever convenient.

3. More than 12 gb RAM surely is overkill - for now; but the future demands? who knows? I'd put in 3 sticks, as others have suggested, and leave the option open to add more at some future time (although when I built mine, I couldn't find 4-gb sticks for my MB, so had to populate all 6 slots).

Having said that, I once experimented with Win7-64bit and all worked, albeit slowly, with only 2 gb RAM!

After 6 gb, I really couldn't tell any difference, although when rendering heavy projects with lots of effects, most of the 6 gb got used, according to monitoring apps. - but I still could carry on other business, such as browse the web with VMware (using a Linux appliance), etc., while doing heavy-duty rendering. It only got slow when the CPU usage approached 100%. So: 6 gb probably is OK, 12 gb leaves lots of headroom - for now. In any case, buy your sticks in sets of 3 in order to get the benefit of DDR3.