Vegas Video discussions from 2006 (Q1Q2)

Jeff Mack · May 5th, 2006, 09:58 AM

ok, sounds great.

I have never done an animation before. Any comments on how I can learn to do this if I have all of the parts?

Jeff

DJ Kinney · May 5th, 2006, 09:59 AM

This won't help in the traditional way, but I just want to say that photos have always given me fits. I've resized photos again and again in Photoshop, changed pixel aspect ratio, and it's always a case of accidentally stumbling across the right settings. Suddenly it works and I leave it alone.

Matching pictures to video has always been a major problem for me.

Looking forward to a straight answer on picel aspect ratios and size.

DJ

Vincent Croce · May 5th, 2006, 10:13 AM

Glad I'm not the only one, DJ. I achieved some success by changing the template in pan/crop on the photos, but I still get a pic slightly taller than the video when outputting to a wmv. I also think part of my problem is that I'm using 3d on the track. I'll let you know if I stumble on the right solution here.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · May 5th, 2006, 11:32 AM

windows media is square pixel, you're starting with non-square pixel.
you can tick the "stretch to fill" at render, and you won't see those borders, or you can preview it at square by right clicking the Preview Window and turning OFF "simulate display device etc"

Ian Briscoe · May 5th, 2006, 02:30 PM

Hi all

I've put this in the Vegas forum because thats what I use and I want to refer to some Vegas menu options.

I need a bit of help getting my head round aspect ratios and compression. Aspect ratios first...

I live in PAL-ville by the way....

OK - I know that a PAL picture size is 720x576 - which is a ratio of 1.25:1. I also know that pixels aren't square. For a 16:9 project you have to multiply by 1.4568 = 1048/576 = 1.82 - er which is just over 16:9 - but I think this is something to do with hidden pixels - so not too bothered about that.
When I render in Vegas in as either PAL DV or PAL DV widescreen I get exactly the same result when viewed back in Windows Media Player - a correct proportion picture. How does Media Player know that this is a 16:9 file - does the render process put a flag in the file. Because my under standing is that computer pixels are square - therefore I would have expected to see a picture 1.25:1 format. I guess Media player simulates the 16:9 by using more horizontal pictures? Which takes me onto compression....

If I render as n uncompressed avi I DO get a picture in media player with a ratio of 1.25:1 (I measured it!!!) and it looks vertically stretched. Oh and I almost ran out of disk space!!!!

If, after I render, i want to put the output file thorugh another standalone program (to deinterlance for instance), sn't it best to save it as uncompressed so that nothing is lost when taken into the stand alone program? Or would you render as PAL DV in Vegas and then render as uncompressed in the next program in the chain - or am I just losing the plot?

Finally - there is a template for PAL DV and PAL Standard - I can't see the difference.

Sorry it's a long one guys!

Ian

Chris Barcellos · May 5th, 2006, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian Briscoe

Hi all

I've put this in the Vegas forum because thats what I use and I want to refer to some Vegas menu options.

I need a bit of help getting my head round aspect ratios and compression. Aspect ratios first...

I live in PAL-ville by the way....

OK - I know that a PAL picture size is 720x576 - which is a ratio of 1.25:1. I also know that pixels aren't square. For a 16:9 project you have to multiply by 1.4568 = 1048/576 = 1.82 - er which is just over 16:9 - but I think this is something to do with hidden pixels - so not too bothered about that.
When I render in Vegas in as either PAL DV or PAL DV widescreen I get exactly the same result when viewed back in Windows Media Player - a correct proportion picture. How does Media Player know that this is a 16:9 file - does the render process put a flag in the file. Because my under standing is that computer pixels are square - therefore I would have expected to see a picture 1.25:1 format. I guess Media player simulates the 16:9 by using more horizontal pictures? Which takes me onto compression....

If I render as n uncompressed avi I DO get a picture in media player with a ratio of 1.25:1 (I measured it!!!) and it looks vertically stretched. Oh and I almost ran out of disk space!!!!

If, after I render, i want to put the output file thorugh another standalone program (to deinterlance for instance), sn't it best to save it as uncompressed so that nothing is lost when taken into the stand alone program? Or would you render as PAL DV in Vegas and then render as uncompressed in the next program in the chain - or am I just losing the plot?

Finally - there is a template for PAL DV and PAL Standard - I can't see the difference.

Sorry it's a long one guys!

Ian

Just when I think I'm getting my head around 16:9 technical stuff, you set it spinning again. See recent discusssion here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...719#post476719

Ian Briscoe · May 5th, 2006, 02:58 PM

Sorry about that Chris.

I'll have aread of that thread.

Also - just to avoid any confusion (er, any MORE confusion) - I'm shooting using a 16:9 camera.

Ian

John Rofrano · May 5th, 2006, 03:36 PM

Yea, when I say 2D I mean cell animation. Product’s like Bauhaus Mirage will allow you to do onion skinning so you can see the previous frames in the animation and line them up properly. I don’t expect you to spend all that money or time learning an animation package that detailed which is why I said, hire somebody.

~jr

Jeff Mack · May 5th, 2006, 03:40 PM

Thanks for the info.

Jeff

Vincent Croce · May 5th, 2006, 03:49 PM

As usual you were 'spot' on. Thank you for bailing my sorry butt out once again with your editing expertise, DSE. Being my first widescreen project, I see I have a bit to learn about pixel shapes, eh?

Raza Ahmad · May 5th, 2006, 05:47 PM

I don't remember the website, you'll have to google it, but Moho allows for bones to be implanted in a 2D vector graphic, and then you can keyframe the bones to move the object, its an excellent piece of software for basic character animation, and you can learn it overnight. Highly reccomend it for this sort of work.

edit: http://www.lostmarble.com/

-raza

Brandon Wood · May 5th, 2006, 09:19 PM

LOL,

I just don't know how you market yourself, shoot video, edit, keep up with everything there is to know about Vegas and the wedding industry, and still manage to participate in these forums it seems 24/7.

I'm beginning to think you are an android....

Fred Helm · May 5th, 2006, 09:58 PM

I have had the same burdens especially with broken edges and fast motion. I have worked it out though with a cool guy from Sony. My m2t files have to be loaded onto timeline and rendered to intermediate codec. Work with those files and render to NTSC DV stock or 720p 2,3. Those are the only two that work for me. Every other combination, and i mean hundreds of "custom" combinations are horrible. Interlacing issues and bottom field first wiped me out for weeks. I rendered a 10 second motion clip 51 diff times and saved the output to compare the only two options were as listed. Sony has stated they have some .exe conflicts with xp background files that can play havoc with renders. I have the email if its needed identifying the conflicting exe's

Graham Bernard · May 6th, 2006, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brandon Wood

Anyone know how to recreate that 16-18 fps look to mimic the old 8 or super8 mm choppy filmlook in Vegas? A script or filter maybe?

Have you tried Vegas own "Film Effects" Fx?

You get : Jitter; Dust; Scratches; HAIR!; Flicker and Dust .!!

Plus there are Templates for "very Old Film"; "Low Quality Colour"; Circa 1908 and 1980.

Try 'em

Grazie

Phil Hamilton · May 6th, 2006, 09:55 AM

Did you try the VLC player?

May 5th, 2006, 11:32 AM	#1459
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	windows media is square pixel, you're starting with non-square pixel. you can tick the "stretch to fill" at render, and you won't see those borders, or you can preview it at square by right clicking the Preview Window and turning OFF "simulate display device etc" __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

May 5th, 2006, 02:30 PM	#1460
Ian Briscoe Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Southport - UK Posts: 208	My head hurts! Need help on aspect ratio and compression Hi all I've put this in the Vegas forum because thats what I use and I want to refer to some Vegas menu options. I need a bit of help getting my head round aspect ratios and compression. Aspect ratios first... I live in PAL-ville by the way.... OK - I know that a PAL picture size is 720x576 - which is a ratio of 1.25:1. I also know that pixels aren't square. For a 16:9 project you have to multiply by 1.4568 = 1048/576 = 1.82 - er which is just over 16:9 - but I think this is something to do with hidden pixels - so not too bothered about that. When I render in Vegas in as either PAL DV or PAL DV widescreen I get exactly the same result when viewed back in Windows Media Player - a correct proportion picture. How does Media Player know that this is a 16:9 file - does the render process put a flag in the file. Because my under standing is that computer pixels are square - therefore I would have expected to see a picture 1.25:1 format. I guess Media player simulates the 16:9 by using more horizontal pictures? Which takes me onto compression.... If I render as n uncompressed avi I DO get a picture in media player with a ratio of 1.25:1 (I measured it!!!) and it looks vertically stretched. Oh and I almost ran out of disk space!!!! If, after I render, i want to put the output file thorugh another standalone program (to deinterlance for instance), sn't it best to save it as uncompressed so that nothing is lost when taken into the stand alone program? Or would you render as PAL DV in Vegas and then render as uncompressed in the next program in the chain - or am I just losing the plot? Finally - there is a template for PAL DV and PAL Standard - I can't see the difference. Sorry it's a long one guys! Ian

May 5th, 2006, 03:36 PM	#1463
John Rofrano Sponsor: VASST Join Date: May 2005 Location: New York Posts: 516	Yea, when I say 2D I mean cell animation. Product’s like Bauhaus Mirage will allow you to do onion skinning so you can see the previous frames in the animation and line them up properly. I don’t expect you to spend all that money or time learning an animation package that detailed which is why I said, hire somebody. ~jr __________________ Developer: VASST Ultimate S, Scattershot 3D, Mayhem, FASST Apps, and other VASST Software plug-ins Web Site: www.johnrofrano.com

May 5th, 2006, 03:49 PM	#1465
Vincent Croce Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Fort Myers, FL Posts: 263	You da man! As usual you were 'spot' on. Thank you for bailing my sorry butt out once again with your editing expertise, DSE. Being my first widescreen project, I see I have a bit to learn about pixel shapes, eh?

May 5th, 2006, 05:47 PM	#1466
Raza Ahmad Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: los angeles, ca Posts: 61	Moho I don't remember the website, you'll have to google it, but Moho allows for bones to be implanted in a 2D vector graphic, and then you can keyframe the bones to move the object, its an excellent piece of software for basic character animation, and you can learn it overnight. Highly reccomend it for this sort of work. edit: http://www.lostmarble.com/ -raza

May 5th, 2006, 09:58 AM	#1456
Jeff Mack Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: McKinney, TX Posts: 195	ok, sounds great. I have never done an animation before. Any comments on how I can learn to do this if I have all of the parts? Jeff

May 5th, 2006, 09:59 AM	#1457
DJ Kinney Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 277	This won't help in the traditional way, but I just want to say that photos have always given me fits. I've resized photos again and again in Photoshop, changed pixel aspect ratio, and it's always a case of accidentally stumbling across the right settings. Suddenly it works and I leave it alone. Matching pictures to video has always been a major problem for me. Looking forward to a straight answer on picel aspect ratios and size. DJ

May 5th, 2006, 10:13 AM	#1458
Vincent Croce Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Fort Myers, FL Posts: 263	Glad I'm not the only one, DJ. I achieved some success by changing the template in pan/crop on the photos, but I still get a pic slightly taller than the video when outputting to a wmv. I also think part of my problem is that I'm using 3d on the track. I'll let you know if I stumble on the right solution here.

May 5th, 2006, 02:58 PM	#1462
Ian Briscoe Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Southport - UK Posts: 208	Sorry about that Chris. I'll have aread of that thread. Also - just to avoid any confusion (er, any MORE confusion) - I'm shooting using a 16:9 camera. Ian

May 5th, 2006, 03:40 PM	#1464
Jeff Mack Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: McKinney, TX Posts: 195	Thanks for the info. Jeff

May 5th, 2006, 09:19 PM	#1467
Brandon Wood Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Mauriceville, TX Posts: 146	LOL, I just don't know how you market yourself, shoot video, edit, keep up with everything there is to know about Vegas and the wedding industry, and still manage to participate in these forums it seems 24/7. I'm beginning to think you are an android....

May 5th, 2006, 09:58 PM	#1468
Fred Helm Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: san diego, ca Posts: 150	I have had the same burdens especially with broken edges and fast motion. I have worked it out though with a cool guy from Sony. My m2t files have to be loaded onto timeline and rendered to intermediate codec. Work with those files and render to NTSC DV stock or 720p 2,3. Those are the only two that work for me. Every other combination, and i mean hundreds of "custom" combinations are horrible. Interlacing issues and bottom field first wiped me out for weeks. I rendered a 10 second motion clip 51 diff times and saved the output to compare the only two options were as listed. Sony has stated they have some .exe conflicts with xp background files that can play havoc with renders. I have the email if its needed identifying the conflicting exe's

May 6th, 2006, 09:55 AM	#1470
Phil Hamilton Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 150	Did you try the VLC player? __________________ Phil Hamilton hamiltonp@sbcglobal.net Dallas, Texas " I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! ..."