Is Vegas 9 worth the upgrade from 8?

Tom Roper · December 3rd, 2009, 05:53 PM

I'm probably missing something, but I can't imagine not using multiple timelines, like on the order of 50 to 100 in one small project. Many are audio tracks, but is there another way when you do keyframe panning/cropping/track motion/picture-in-picture?

No way would I just encode these keyframe sequences as snippets to drop onto one timeline, things are always changing in the project.

And I don't understand the concept of nesting, unless that means dropping a veg file onto the timeline. If you do that, then go back and modify the nested veg file again, does it update automatically when you render the project you dropped the veg file into? What if you changed the length of the nested veg file? Would the project you dropped the nested veg file into auto-ripple? Maybe it's a more efficient way, I dunno.

The only negative I can see with multiple timelines is you have to be careful to lock the keyframes to events, so if they get shifted along the timeline, the keyframes move together.

I can lock events together, and I can organize a project into one project folder containing sub-folders for each of the medias, video, audio, voice overs etc. It seems like a cleaner way of archiving the project than having all these filetypes mixed into one folder.

Perrone Ford · December 3rd, 2009, 06:10 PM

(I FRIGGIN HATE NOT BEING ABLE TO QUOTE THE LAST POST!!! UGGGHHH!!)

Ok sorry,

In Vegas, you keyframe on the event. I'm doing it right now. If I have 6, 1 minute pieces of video, I can drop them on the same timeline, and keyframe them individually. I don't need a separate timeline for each one. And no matter where I slide them on the timeline, the keyframes stay intact. Audio, video, and photos behave this way.

Yes, nesting means dropping a .veg onto the timeline. It comes in like a rendered event. You can apply any filters keyframes or anything else to it just like it was a single clip. Very handy. And yes, any changes made in that .veg file, automatically happen in the project where that .veg is placed on a timeline. This is particularly handy if you want to work on individual scenes of a movie, and have one overarching master file that holds your final edits and looks. You can even create an SD master file and an HD master file, and drop the SAME .vegs into both and get one SD and one HD project automatically. Set one for 24p the other for 60i and you're golden. However you want to do things.

I separate my media types as well, but that's got nothing to do with this.

Bill Binder · December 3rd, 2009, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Salvatore

I like the new effects from Velvet Matter, the audio duck feature...

There's audio ducking in Vegas 9? Does that come free/included? If so, that's awesome, didn't know that. Does it just create a volume envelope for you or does it do the ducking on the fly without envelopes?

Tom Roper · December 3rd, 2009, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perrone Ford

In Vegas, you keyframe on the event. I'm doing it right now. If I have 6, 1 minute pieces of video, I can drop them on the same timeline, and keyframe them individually. I don't need a separate timeline for each one. And no matter where I slide them on the timeline, the keyframes stay intact. Audio, video, and photos behave this way.

Right, okay. I understand that. The keyframes stay intact if the "lock envelopes to events" box is checked, so we'll assume that it is checked. So you can slide them anywhere, and the keyframes stay intact. But if you have multiple picture-in-picture windows open, you have to have another video track above the main one. At least I don't know another way.

Quote:

Yes, nesting means dropping a .veg onto the timeline. It comes in like a rendered event.

That could be useful and clean, I agree. Does it make more efficient use of memory, or speed editing? Double useful if it would. I'll give it a try on the project I'm doing now.

Thanks, BTW.
Tom

Marc Salvatore · December 4th, 2009, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Binder

There's audio ducking in Vegas 9? Does that come free/included? If so, that's awesome, didn't know that. Does it just create a volume envelope for you or does it do the ducking on the fly without envelopes?

When you have an audio envelope on the timeline, you can now make a selection, then pull on the envelope inside the selection and your 4 points are created automatically.

Edward Troxel · December 4th, 2009, 08:33 AM

Bill, as Marc indicated, Vegas 9 added the feature where if you create a selection area on the timeline and then drag any envelope (it works with all envelopes - not just audio), it will automatically create 4 points - 2 on each end of the selection area - allowing you to modify everything in the selection area.

Personally, for automated ducking, I use the Voice Over tool in Excalibur which can reduce the volume level on an audio background track wherever there is something on the Voice track and let the music remain louder when there is nothing on the voice track. Ultimate S has a similar tool as well.

Pete Cofrancesco · December 4th, 2009, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perrone Ford

(I FRIGGIN HATE NOT BEING ABLE TO QUOTE THE LAST POST!!! UGGGHHH!!)

you have to click on the button with the page icon (right of the Quote button), it toggles to either + or -, then you click Quote. Took me a while to figure it out.

Perrone Ford · December 4th, 2009, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Cofrancesco

you have to click on the button with the page icon (right of the Quote button), it toggles to either + or -, then you click Quote. Took me a while to figure it out.

Excellent! Thanks for the tip!

Marc Salvatore · December 4th, 2009, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Troxel

Personally, for automated ducking, I use the Voice Over tool in Excalibur which can reduce the volume level on an audio background track wherever there is something on the Voice track and let the music remain louder when there is nothing on the voice track. Ultimate S has a similar tool as well.

Good point Edward. One of the great features of Vegas is the ability to use scripting programs like Excalibur. Your program has save me countless hours of work. Could not edit without it.

Edward Troxel · December 6th, 2009, 08:55 AM

Marc, I agree. I'd be lost without scripts at my disposal.

December 3rd, 2009, 06:10 PM	#17
Perrone Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 4,100	(I FRIGGIN HATE NOT BEING ABLE TO QUOTE THE LAST POST!!! UGGGHHH!!) Ok sorry, In Vegas, you keyframe on the event. I'm doing it right now. If I have 6, 1 minute pieces of video, I can drop them on the same timeline, and keyframe them individually. I don't need a separate timeline for each one. And no matter where I slide them on the timeline, the keyframes stay intact. Audio, video, and photos behave this way. Yes, nesting means dropping a .veg onto the timeline. It comes in like a rendered event. You can apply any filters keyframes or anything else to it just like it was a single clip. Very handy. And yes, any changes made in that .veg file, automatically happen in the project where that .veg is placed on a timeline. This is particularly handy if you want to work on individual scenes of a movie, and have one overarching master file that holds your final edits and looks. You can even create an SD master file and an HD master file, and drop the SAME .vegs into both and get one SD and one HD project automatically. Set one for 24p the other for 60i and you're golden. However you want to do things. I separate my media types as well, but that's got nothing to do with this. __________________ DVX100, PMW-EX1, Canon 550D, FigRig, Dell Octocore, Avid MC4/5, MB Looks, RedCineX, Matrox MX02 mini, GTech RAID, Edirol R-4, Senn. G2 Evo, Countryman, Moles and Lowels.

December 4th, 2009, 08:33 AM	#21
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Bill, as Marc indicated, Vegas 9 added the feature where if you create a selection area on the timeline and then drag any envelope (it works with all envelopes - not just audio), it will automatically create 4 points - 2 on each end of the selection area - allowing you to modify everything in the selection area. Personally, for automated ducking, I use the Voice Over tool in Excalibur which can reduce the volume level on an audio background track wherever there is something on the Voice track and let the music remain louder when there is nothing on the voice track. Ultimate S has a similar tool as well. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

December 6th, 2009, 08:55 AM	#25
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Marc, I agree. I'd be lost without scripts at my disposal. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

December 3rd, 2009, 05:53 PM	#16
Tom Roper Trustee Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 1,891	I'm probably missing something, but I can't imagine not using multiple timelines, like on the order of 50 to 100 in one small project. Many are audio tracks, but is there another way when you do keyframe panning/cropping/track motion/picture-in-picture? No way would I just encode these keyframe sequences as snippets to drop onto one timeline, things are always changing in the project. And I don't understand the concept of nesting, unless that means dropping a veg file onto the timeline. If you do that, then go back and modify the nested veg file again, does it update automatically when you render the project you dropped the veg file into? What if you changed the length of the nested veg file? Would the project you dropped the nested veg file into auto-ripple? Maybe it's a more efficient way, I dunno. The only negative I can see with multiple timelines is you have to be careful to lock the keyframes to events, so if they get shifted along the timeline, the keyframes move together. I can lock events together, and I can organize a project into one project folder containing sub-folders for each of the medias, video, audio, voice overs etc. It seems like a cleaner way of archiving the project than having all these filetypes mixed into one folder.