jumping, skipping and ghosting in Vegas pro 8 at DVinfo.net

Jeremy Keeler · October 28th, 2009, 12:31 AM

I'm about to pull my hair out!
For some reason unknown to me, when I work in Vegas for any length of time, especially when I begin to edit and add cross fades, when I go to play the video in the preview window I get jumping, skipping, freezing and ghosting. This has been a problem from the beginning for me. Sometimes it's not so bad, other times like tonight it's unbearable. I notice that if its jumping in the preview window this carries over to the render. Sometimes shutting down vegas for a while and restarting clears it up, but it always seems to come back after 20 or so minutes. Audio does not seem to be effected, only video.

I have a Dell Studio XPS 435T, Intel Core i7-920 processor(8MB L3 Cache 2.66GHz) with 8GB DDR3 SDRAM at 1066MHz and a 1024MB ATI Radeon HD 4870 video card running Vista 64 bit.

Other than Vegas the computer has no other issues, I realize that Vegas is a heavy user of RAM, but I've never seen it come close to using all 8gb and the proc and video card are top notch. This computer is clean, very few minor programs, mainly used by me to surf the web and edit.

So what's going on here? Is it Vegas, my machine or maybe Windows?

I can't help but think that my life would be so much easier if Vegas would just do it's thing!

Jeremy Keeler · October 28th, 2009, 11:27 AM

bumped up so folks can see it!

Don Bloom · October 28th, 2009, 04:53 PM

some questions before we can help.
what version of Vegas?
what are you editing? SD, HDV, XDCam, AVHCD, QT...
what do you have your preview screen set to; Best Full, Good Auto,....?
what kind of effects do you have on the track or clips? CC, MB, any Pan/Crop?

Right now we can't really give you any help-the information above will help us figure out what the problem might be.

Jeremy Keeler · October 28th, 2009, 09:48 PM

Hey Don,

I'm using Vegas 8 (C) build 260.
I'm editing AVCHD off a Panasonic HMC150
Preview Screen is normally set to Best Full, but this problem happens no matter what the setting.
As far as effects go, nothing crazy, just text media, sometimes some brightness and color correction and several crossfades.

I'm checking this post every few hours, I'm determined to figure this out. I greatly appreciate your help.

Don Bloom · October 29th, 2009, 05:57 AM

well, text media and CC both will suck up some juice and can slow down the preview.

I would start with lowering the screen to PREVIEW>AUTO. Then turn off everything you have sone to the clips in the FX - just turn them off in the clip or track level depending on where you put them-don't remove them and see how the preview is. If it's OK then turn the FX on ONE at a time, turn 1 on try the preview, if it's ok then turn that one off and turn on the next one, try the preview. Keep going until you find which one is causing the problem. Also turn off the track (MUTE) with the text -many times that could be the cause.
Also isn't there a newer version of Vegas that works better with AVCHD files? I though there was.
Try these ideas and let us know.

Edward Troxel · October 29th, 2009, 07:38 AM

First of all AVCHD is very tough to edit. You could try converting it to an easier to edit format.

If you look below the preview window at all those text lines, it will show you the frames per second it's displaying. At "Best (Full)" it's probably VERY low. At "Preview (Auto)" it will probably still be less than 29.97. How well it previews will also depend on your computer as well.

Renders should be totally separate from the preview. If you're seeing jumping in the renders, perhaps the project/clip/render settings are wrong? To know what you're seeing, we'd really need to see a small sample.

Jeremy Keeler · October 29th, 2009, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Bloom

well, text media and CC both will suck up some juice and can slow down the preview.

I would start with lowering the screen to PREVIEW>AUTO. Then turn off everything you have sone to the clips in the FX - just turn them off in the clip or track level depending on where you put them-don't remove them and see how the preview is. If it's OK then turn the FX on ONE at a time, turn 1 on try the preview, if it's ok then turn that one off and turn on the next one, try the preview. Keep going until you find which one is causing the problem. Also turn off the track (MUTE) with the text -many times that could be the cause.
Also isn't there a newer version of Vegas that works better with AVCHD files? I though there was.
Try these ideas and let us know.

It bugs me that something as minor as text media of color correction is enough to turn my edit into crap. I have plans on doing so much more in the future, if things take a dump with text media then sheesh!
Sony says that This version of 8 will work fine with AVCHD, I'm beginning to wonder if that's where the problem is.

Jeremy Keeler · October 29th, 2009, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Troxel

First of all AVCHD is very tough to edit. You could try converting it to an easier to edit format.

If you look below the preview window at all those text lines, it will show you the frames per second it's displaying. At "Best (Full)" it's probably VERY low. At "Preview (Auto)" it will probably still be less than 29.97. How well it previews will also depend on your computer as well.

Renders should be totally separate from the preview. If you're seeing jumping in the renders, perhaps the project/clip/render settings are wrong? To know what you're seeing, we'd really need to see a small sample.

Since the skipping and jumping carry over to the render I guess I can render a section and upload it to vimeo and have you guys take a look.

If I were to edit in a different format, which would you recommend and are there some good free/cheap converters out there?

Don Bloom · October 29th, 2009, 03:18 PM

Well it might not be the generated media or CC but in order to find out try without it. There are so many variables it's hard to nail it down. As Edward stated Avchd is difficult to work with but since I don't work with it I can't give you a workaround. Perhaps Jeff or Mike or Edward can.
By all means post a sample so we can see what's happening.

Jeremy Keeler · October 29th, 2009, 09:57 PM

Okay, here is the video that has been killing me on Vegas. It's for a church website, it's very simple, just some cross fades and text.
The skipping begins right away, at 1:40 it gets worse. The audio does not appear to be effected.

Tell me what you guys think.

Jeremy Keeler · October 29th, 2009, 10:06 PM

Though I can't be sure, I am starting to zero in on the AVCHD format as the culprit. Still need more research and help though lol

Don Bloom · October 30th, 2009, 04:02 AM

It's 5AM while I watching and at first I thought it was my eyes. Nope it really was the video. Wow, I have to say I have never seen anything quite like tha so I can understand your pain. However, I would have to agree with your assessment that its not the computer, it's not Vegas but it's the AVCD format. As Edward said it is a difficult format to edit.

Edward Troxel · October 30th, 2009, 07:48 AM

Here's what it looks like to me:

1. The man talking isn't TALKING - the mouth is not moving to make works. It looks like it's repeatedly playing a few frames instead of playing the actual video that goes along with the audio.

2. Same thing here. When she starts playing, it looks fine. Then her hands stop while the music continues and it looks like it's, once again, repeating a few frames over and over.

What if you open a fresh copy of Vegas, drop these clips on the timeline. Can you render to a new format then without this happening? I'd try that first. If that doesn't work, use something else like Cineform or AVCHD UpShift to convert it to another format.

Jeremy Keeler · October 30th, 2009, 09:49 AM

Edward, define fresh copy of Vegas.

This is what I have noticed in the past. If the project I am working in starts to skip and jump, if I save it, then close it and close Vegas, then restart Vegas it seems to play fine for a few minutes. Other times it will actually even render fine(though now that I'm doing more transitions this hasn't been the case) and I can go on.

This is what I'm going to go. I'm going to to download the Cineform Neo trial, take all my project media for this video and put it in a new folder then tell Cineform to convert the folder to .mov and then begin editing the video again. If my skipping and jumping go away, then I know it's AVCHD and I can go to videoguys.com and pick it up for about a 100 bucks.
If it does the exact same thing, well, I might reinstall Vegas on the pc and pray for mercy lol

Edward Troxel · October 30th, 2009, 10:42 AM

Instead of going to mov, I'd use cineform to convert it to the cineform codec instead.

Yes, by fresh copy I meant essentially reboot the computer, open Vegas, drop one of these files on the timeline, and immediately render out. Then use that new render in your "real" project. Of course you'd need to do that for each of the files you've used.

October 28th, 2009, 12:31 AM	#1
Jeremy Keeler New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas Posts: 23	jumping, skipping and ghosting in Vegas pro 8 I'm about to pull my hair out! For some reason unknown to me, when I work in Vegas for any length of time, especially when I begin to edit and add cross fades, when I go to play the video in the preview window I get jumping, skipping, freezing and ghosting. This has been a problem from the beginning for me. Sometimes it's not so bad, other times like tonight it's unbearable. I notice that if its jumping in the preview window this carries over to the render. Sometimes shutting down vegas for a while and restarting clears it up, but it always seems to come back after 20 or so minutes. Audio does not seem to be effected, only video. I have a Dell Studio XPS 435T, Intel Core i7-920 processor(8MB L3 Cache 2.66GHz) with 8GB DDR3 SDRAM at 1066MHz and a 1024MB ATI Radeon HD 4870 video card running Vista 64 bit. Other than Vegas the computer has no other issues, I realize that Vegas is a heavy user of RAM, but I've never seen it come close to using all 8gb and the proc and video card are top notch. This computer is clean, very few minor programs, mainly used by me to surf the web and edit. So what's going on here? Is it Vegas, my machine or maybe Windows? I can't help but think that my life would be so much easier if Vegas would just do it's thing!

October 28th, 2009, 04:53 PM	#3
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	some questions before we can help. what version of Vegas? what are you editing? SD, HDV, XDCam, AVHCD, QT... what do you have your preview screen set to; Best Full, Good Auto,....? what kind of effects do you have on the track or clips? CC, MB, any Pan/Crop? Right now we can't really give you any help-the information above will help us figure out what the problem might be. __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

October 29th, 2009, 05:57 AM	#5
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	well, text media and CC both will suck up some juice and can slow down the preview. I would start with lowering the screen to PREVIEW>AUTO. Then turn off everything you have sone to the clips in the FX - just turn them off in the clip or track level depending on where you put them-don't remove them and see how the preview is. If it's OK then turn the FX on ONE at a time, turn 1 on try the preview, if it's ok then turn that one off and turn on the next one, try the preview. Keep going until you find which one is causing the problem. Also turn off the track (MUTE) with the text -many times that could be the cause. Also isn't there a newer version of Vegas that works better with AVCHD files? I though there was. Try these ideas and let us know. __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

October 29th, 2009, 07:38 AM	#6
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	First of all AVCHD is very tough to edit. You could try converting it to an easier to edit format. If you look below the preview window at all those text lines, it will show you the frames per second it's displaying. At "Best (Full)" it's probably VERY low. At "Preview (Auto)" it will probably still be less than 29.97. How well it previews will also depend on your computer as well. Renders should be totally separate from the preview. If you're seeing jumping in the renders, perhaps the project/clip/render settings are wrong? To know what you're seeing, we'd really need to see a small sample. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

October 29th, 2009, 03:18 PM	#9
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	Well it might not be the generated media or CC but in order to find out try without it. There are so many variables it's hard to nail it down. As Edward stated Avchd is difficult to work with but since I don't work with it I can't give you a workaround. Perhaps Jeff or Mike or Edward can. By all means post a sample so we can see what's happening. __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

October 28th, 2009, 11:27 AM	#2
Jeremy Keeler New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas Posts: 23	bumped up so folks can see it!

October 28th, 2009, 09:48 PM	#4
Jeremy Keeler New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas Posts: 23	Hey Don, I'm using Vegas 8 (C) build 260. I'm editing AVCHD off a Panasonic HMC150 Preview Screen is normally set to Best Full, but this problem happens no matter what the setting. As far as effects go, nothing crazy, just text media, sometimes some brightness and color correction and several crossfades. I'm checking this post every few hours, I'm determined to figure this out. I greatly appreciate your help.

October 29th, 2009, 09:57 PM	#10
Jeremy Keeler New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas Posts: 23	Okay, here is the video that has been killing me on Vegas. It's for a church website, it's very simple, just some cross fades and text. The skipping begins right away, at 1:40 it gets worse. The audio does not appear to be effected. Tell me what you guys think. Take the name bad edit, dvinfo sample on Vimeo

October 29th, 2009, 10:06 PM	#11
Jeremy Keeler New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas Posts: 23	Though I can't be sure, I am starting to zero in on the AVCHD format as the culprit. Still need more research and help though lol

October 30th, 2009, 04:02 AM	#12
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	It's 5AM while I watching and at first I thought it was my eyes. Nope it really was the video. Wow, I have to say I have never seen anything quite like tha so I can understand your pain. However, I would have to agree with your assessment that its not the computer, it's not Vegas but it's the AVCD format. As Edward said it is a difficult format to edit. __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

October 30th, 2009, 07:48 AM	#13
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Here's what it looks like to me: 1. The man talking isn't TALKING - the mouth is not moving to make works. It looks like it's repeatedly playing a few frames instead of playing the actual video that goes along with the audio. 2. Same thing here. When she starts playing, it looks fine. Then her hands stop while the music continues and it looks like it's, once again, repeating a few frames over and over. What if you open a fresh copy of Vegas, drop these clips on the timeline. Can you render to a new format then without this happening? I'd try that first. If that doesn't work, use something else like Cineform or AVCHD UpShift to convert it to another format. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

October 30th, 2009, 09:49 AM	#14
Jeremy Keeler New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas Posts: 23	Edward, define fresh copy of Vegas. This is what I have noticed in the past. If the project I am working in starts to skip and jump, if I save it, then close it and close Vegas, then restart Vegas it seems to play fine for a few minutes. Other times it will actually even render fine(though now that I'm doing more transitions this hasn't been the case) and I can go on. This is what I'm going to go. I'm going to to download the Cineform Neo trial, take all my project media for this video and put it in a new folder then tell Cineform to convert the folder to .mov and then begin editing the video again. If my skipping and jumping go away, then I know it's AVCHD and I can go to videoguys.com and pick it up for about a 100 bucks. If it does the exact same thing, well, I might reinstall Vegas on the pc and pray for mercy lol

October 30th, 2009, 10:42 AM	#15
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Instead of going to mov, I'd use cineform to convert it to the cineform codec instead. Yes, by fresh copy I meant essentially reboot the computer, open Vegas, drop one of these files on the timeline, and immediately render out. Then use that new render in your "real" project. Of course you'd need to do that for each of the files you've used. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters