Vegas Video discussions from 2005 (Q1Q2)

[Glenn Chan]

I did some tests on how memory bandwidth affects rendering time... it only makes a 4% difference for ~50% increases in memory bandwidth.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...id=18841<br />
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...id=18841<br />

If processor speed jumps a lot, then memory bandwidth increases will have a bigger effect. Right now it's not really a bottleneck.

2- Heh, can you afford a quad Xeon? (Quad Opterons are also available; AMD may beat Intel to the punch with dual core processors... by like a few months)

3- I'm not a believer in RAID. see
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...id=18784<br />
and a whole bunch of other threads of you do a search. Unfortunately I did not have the hardware to do a more definitive test.

4- RAM makes a difference for RAM previews, but doesn't really make a difference for rendering speed. If you want to squeeze every last percent of performance out of your system, 4X512MB double-banked/sided sticks of RAM *may* be the best performing RAM configuration on Intel (that's reasonably priced). AMD should be totally different, 4X512MB may give you problems and probably will make no performance difference.

see
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...id=37831<br />
Unfortunately I did not have the hardware to do a more definitive test.

[Peter Jefferson]

i too have bene wary on raid configs.. for ne the strain vegas has on these drives is pretty hard... even with excellent cooling, ive killed off 3 HDDs in 2 yrs...

i prefer to have all my media drives segregated in case of failure, this way if one goes down my media files wont go down with it... in a raid if one goes, they all go and all ur data is gone.. (well there are ways to retrive it if ur using a HW stripe.. but thats another headache.. )on top of that, im yet to see a good working tool which allows me to diagnose each drive wthin a stripe... so pickin up errors early one before they become catastrophes is very difficult to say the least..

persoanlly with this, i'll be buildinga dual core intel unit with at least 3gb ram running on a 1066 fsb baord with a Nvidia 6800gt gfx card. As i use many compositing and particle tools (i distribte particle illusion here in aus) i need something with alot of throughput.. on top of that, with DVCProHD, the FSB bandwidth will definately come in handy

the best thing abotu vegas though is that it will run with any system you throw it on.. unlike many other apps and HW modules out there.. Vegas is one of the better ones to maintain and manage...

[Peter Jefferson]

bloody hell i hate keping secrets..

But i have to say an advanced BIG shout out to Sony for listening to their users in this.
Im also greatful that they have retained the Sonic Foundry team and built Vegas up to what it is today.

Hopefully with a little more assistance from Sony, the distributors can set up mobile demo units and go on the road and really penetrate the market.

there is one feature within V6 which i cant talk about right now, which will change the way Vegas is seen to the unbelievers and those using other platforms will have no choice but to take a step back and look.

Its about time Vegas was given the recognition it deserves.
Being an effective and streamlines editor, a video effects and composite tool, an insanely brilliant audio and Dolby Digital Audio mastering utility and most importantly easily accessable to anyone, Vegas has come to maturity albeit somewhat late compared to the likes of Premiere and Liquid, but in the end we got there and will soon have one of teh definitive tools to process almost any kind of video.

Good work guys and good luck with the launch of V6

[Patrick Masters]

I have heard lots os tuff but am unsure of how much is true/untrue. I heard Sony will be the first NLE to roll out HD-DVD/Blu Ray authoring allowing users to begin authoring for players released later this year. Also heard of them including Nero's Mpeg-4 ASP/H2.64 AVC codecs, and last, heard that they are including Live directo disk recording with use of scopes like DVRack for SD and HDV.

If those three things prove true, combined with the already leaked features, Vegas6+DVD3 will be a MUST HAVE for any serious editor/videographer.

[Aaron Koolen]

Thing is, Vegas needs DVCPROHD support with the new HVX coming out; lets hope it's in there or out soon. But with Sony behind it and them being Panasonic's competition, and their push for HDV, who knows. I don't want to have to change NLE.

I love Vegas, I've used it for years, but it's got a lot of problems IMO. I don't think it's audio manipulation interface is that good. Volume envelopes at extreme ranges are impossible to adjust. Timeline scrubbing is useless (The auto In/Out selection is just stupid). Media mangement blows. It's keyframe mangement for effects is awful (I'm talking about general interface here). Not being able to add audio fx to a clip realtime, but you can to a track - stupid. I hate rendering new FX unless they are so processor intensive that I need to.

Don't get me wrong as I said I love it compared to some other NLE's that I've used and because I have a lot of $$ invested in it and DVDA, of course I want it to get better and not have to change my NLE. I love features like it's format agnostic approach - that's how NLE's should be, but I think it's lacking in a lot of respects.

Can't wait until tomorrow!


Aaron

[Peter Jefferson]

without gettin into trouble, one thing to note about SOny and DVDArchitect is that it will only allow you to work with projects which have been approved by the DVD Forum, so DL DVD-r, not being recognised as yet, wont be recognised.
As for BluRay, i honestly cant say.. not that i cant actaully say, but i honestly dont know.. lol

with regard to Aarons comments, i liek the way u explain what doesnt work well for you.
With regard to audio filters, i personally run them all on the track with automation envelopes and only utlise what i need when i need it. It allows for a smoother transition between scenes with some bleed/fallout and is very easy to manage. Thats how i do it anyway as it gives me filters on hand without having to resort to leaving the application.. If worse comes to worse, i'l open the file in Soundforge and work on it from there.

With regard to timeline scrubbing, i actaully find that it works like a pseudo trimmer. Im very happy with the behaviour of it, as id rather just click on where i want to start from and hit play, as oppsed to finding and draggin a pointer. For example, if i am zoomed in to lets say 3 sonds... 75 frames within my viewable screen.. and i want to start it there, with a "proper" scrub tool, id either have to drag to where it is.. or zoom all the way out again, find it, place it in the correct spot then zoom back in to my 75 frames..
With long form work, i cant stress how much time this "flying scrubber" saves..

With regard to keyframing im baffled as to why you feel its awful?? compared to EdiusPro3, Liquid, Premiere and Matrox fx, the closest thing to it would be the Matrox effects... Premiere is riddled with drop down menus and lists, pinnacle is hit and miss and you cant continuously loop a clip while tweaking an effect, Mind you its realtime HD output to analogue and component is incredible... Edius Pro 3 filters are VERY powerful and flexible, but your stuck with Edius.. (whether or not thats a good or bad thing.. i wont comment) and Matrox FX are prolly the closest thing youll get to a Vegas filter..but the RTx100 will prolly end up being obsolete as HDV comes to the fore..

with regard to Final Cut.. well with final cut, u have to render EVERYTHING even before u start tweaking.. i dont know how anyone can consider FCP a streamlined system.. and i can go on about it, but im not here for that.. and then theres avid.. which is a different ball game altogether..

Now im not baggin any of these apps, they all have their plusses obviously.. else they wouldnt be where they are..

but the point of this whole thread was to thank the guys at Sony/Sonic Foundry for a job well done..

Vegas is one of the better multiformat applications out there..

[Aaron Koolen]

Peter, I actually agree with you. Vegas is one of the better multi format apps out there. I wasn't saying that Vegas has all these bad things that other apps don't, I was just saying that it still has some really bad things (IMO of course)

What I meant about timeline scrubbing, was I wish for something like Avid (and Premiere I think does it too) where I can just click ANYWHERE in the timeline, either on the ruler or on the tracks and scrub. I hate having to move up to the ruler to scrub back and forth, or as was added in Vegas 5, click once, then click again and start dragging. With a hotkey to switch between scrub and edit modes, I'd be set! I also loathe the auto selection creation when you click and drag (I do know about backspace, but I think it's silly to have to do that)

Automation envelopes, must be something I just do not know about enough. Can they be adjusted on a per clip level? I'm assuming they work like the Volume and Pan envelopes? I will have to look into this more.

I can probably agree keyframing is better in Vegas than some apps (I haven't used all NLE's) I find though, that the effects dialogs are HUGE for what they do, that the area under the effects doesn't size properly and is awkward to navigate.

Anyway, wasn't really hassling Vegas (Or was I? :) ) as I said it's a great piece of software, but after using it for a while now, I think it still needs some things - and I guess as a user I can wish and ask for them, and hope they deliver. But I realise not everyone will be completely satisfied.

Roll on tomorrow!

Aaron

[Edward Troxel]

What I meant about timeline scrubbing, was I wish for something like Avid (and Premiere I think does it too) where I can just click ANYWHERE in the timeline, either on the ruler or on the tracks and scrub. I hate having to move up to the ruler to scrub back and forth

But then how would you MOVE an event? I need to click and drag on an event to MOVE it to a new location. How would I do that if click and drag scrubbed instead?

Automation envelopes, must be something I just do not know about enough. Can they be adjusted on a per clip level?

In the same manner that a volume envelope can be applied to a single clip. IOW, you can add points, just like a volume envelope, and adjust it as needed. If it's only "on" for that one clip, the rest will be untouch. Also, don't rule out using more tracks. You can have as many as you need.


To everyone, look for a new newsletter in the next 24 to 28 hours talking about Vegas 6 and DVDA 3! If you don't know where to find the newsletters, just click on the link under my name!

[Peter Jefferson]

"Anyway, wasn't really hassling Vegas (Or was I? :) ) as I said it's a great piece of software, but after using it for a while now, I think it still needs some things - and I guess as a user I can wish and ask for them, and hope they deliver. But I realise not everyone will be completely satisfied."

I totally agree, and i hope my post didnt come out too strongly, coz that wasnt my intention :)
Yes, vegas could be better.. but as u mentioned it here, why not add it to the Sony feedback area on Sonys site.
Sony always listen to their users (believe me, when u see V6, youll know what im talkin about)

As for needing things, i totally agree.. id love to run ParticleIllusion within the Vegas keyframer.. PI is awesome, but if its keyframer needs work.. then again, its similar to SpiceMaster.. but id prefer to run it in my NLE...
What id REALLY like, is to hit record and literally drag the touchpanel and have my keys recorded as i move my touchpad (the touchpad seen in light rays, cookie cutter etc) At the moment Vegas does this with the Surround panner, but i dont see why they cant do it for filters.. it would save SOOOOOO much time in keyframing..

Id also like the cookie cutter to have the facity to load in your own alpha's this way u can literally have ANY shape u need as oppsed to useng the shapes they give us.... Spice master has somethign close to this... but its no cigar..

thers lots id like to have.. but in the realworld, i guess it all comes down to time and research $$

[Aaron Koolen]

Originally Posted by Edward Troxel

But then how would you MOVE an event? I need to click and drag on an event to MOVE it to a new location. How would I do that if click and drag scrubbed instead?

Edward, with a change of state - with a hotkey. Hit it goes into scrub mode, and scrub away. Hit again and goback into edit mode. Avid does this (I think it's avid, it's been a long time since I used it and Premiere) it really, really is a nice feature. Saves having to be accurate to the ruler size when you want to scrub. They could easily implement this and have the currently functionality unchanged for those that don't use it.

Aaron

[Richard Alvarez]

"Caps Lock" in Avid, makes for audio scrub in timeline.

[Bob Costa]

For quite a while, it was told that installing SP2 for XP would cause major problems for Vegas. But I have been holding off for a long time, and it may be time to byte the bullet. Can anyone tell me if the problems with SP2/Vegas have been addressed either by Sony in Vegas updates or by Microsoft in later patches to SP2 ??

[Ian Slessor]

Hi all,

This message board is so very helpful. OK enough of the kudos.

As I mentioned in a previous post I did the video for my daughter's Competition Showcase. It's 48 dances, each about 3 minutes long.

I've followed Ed Troxel's advice from his Vegas Newsletter - love YOU, Ed! - and I'm rendering out each dance.

I plan to have 3 menus - Main, Pre-Intermission & Post-Intermission - with the Pre & Post menus featuring chapters broken up into about 3 dances each. The main is just a pretty little intro directing the viewer to whichever set of dances they want, "Pre" or "Post."

Which is better?

Placing all of my "Pre" rendered dances on a vegas timeline and adding my chapter markers there or do it all through DVDA then repeating for "Post" rendered dances?

I hope that was clear.

Thanks for any help you can render...hehe. Render.

sincerely,

ian

[Peter Jefferson]

Personally id wait for DVDA3 to be released.. I cant go into detail but when its released i will.
For what you want to do there is a better and more efficient workflow coming :)

in the meantime, you can do it in 2 ways.

the first is by creating a variety of Title sets (clips) and importing each as u go along and set the end action to go back to the menu.

or

U can create one long movie with chapters, and set up your chapters within that.

This would be a better way to present the "concert" as it would allow for a smooth flow and not have breaks every 3 minutes.

but like i said, wait till DVDA3 comes it will streamline this whole process (ill explain when i get the go ahead :) ))

[Peter Jefferson]

the questin is, why install xp2 if u dont need to??

u can get most of the pathes thru a windows update anyway.. .

Im still on SP1 and i dont have any issues.. i dont understand what the fuss is about.. now if XP2 streamlined XP as an OS.. THATS when id consider it..