First VP9 & PA1.0 Impressions Here at DVinfo.net

Nicholas de Kock · May 12th, 2009, 08:20 PM

Installed Vegas Pro 9 (32/64) with Production Assistant today and can't say I'm overly excited about this release, very little has changed, except for the color. Production Assistant seems all but useless compared to Excalibur, VASST didn't even take the trouble to match up the color of PA1.0 with the new VP9 look. The new visual plug-ins are really nothing special if you already use Magic Bullet Looks. I don't work with RED or EX formats no benefits for me either, IMO Sony has done it again - released another substandard upgrade, should have been called 8.5. Half priced Vegas Pro 8 is a great deal if you can still find a sale. All that excitement for nothing.

Jeff Harper · May 12th, 2009, 09:20 PM

Well Nick, I agree that 32 bit version is unexciting, but I am loving 64 bit version so far. Preview is much better so far, and it renders quickly. 8.1 didn't work satisfactorily for me, and I am sticking with Ultimate S, in fact I just upgraded to 4.1 as Production Assistant seemed to sketchy to me.

I can't argue your feelings, as I was damning this release before it came out, and I feel somewhat justified.

However in my case I've been waiting for a 64 bit version that worked this well for a long time, and I feel this is it. Edit: see post below for update!

Jeff Harper · May 12th, 2009, 09:55 PM

Well, well, well. This really hurts to say. Very painful.

I have been raving about the 64 bit version of this new upgrade all day, how great the playback is, etc. etc.

Lo and behold, I decided to switch to it to finish a current project which is heavy with photos mixed with video.

Guess what Nicholas? Playback is not so good now. Not as good as the old 8.0c.

I restarted it, etc., but to no avail. I let it play, and when it gets to a section with photos playback becomes jerky. Since this project was created in 8.0c, I suppose that could be the cause, don't know.

I do have Ultimate S installed, and it is in demo mode, so that could be a cause, but I highly doubt it, as I've never had issues with Ultimate S before.

I have downloaded Windows 7 recently, so I might reinstall everything, try the new Windows while I'm at it, then see how this upgrade works, but I'll have to wait for a couple of days till I get a couple of projects done.

Suddenly I'm feeling more sympathy for the others experiencing disappointment with the upgrade. Ouch.

Yang Wen · May 12th, 2009, 10:46 PM

How does a company screw up something so basic? Did they by sheer coincidence utilize only testing platforms that are completely different than the systems used by its customers? How was this product deemed robust enough to be released to the public?

With Version 9, it certainly looks like SCS lacks the talent to product industry leading software. Or in the case of V9, software with average level of performance. Version 9 could very well could be the end of the Vegas path for me.. At this point, it might be worthwhile to put up with the shortcomings of the other NLEs, if only it means not having to put up with annoying bugs.

Jeff Harper · May 12th, 2009, 11:11 PM

What is funny is I just tried the project in question above in the 32 bit version of Vegas 9 and playback was comparable to 8.0c again.

I really want to reinstall windows and give the 64 bit version another chance on a clean installation of windows. As it is the 64 bit version is too jerky for me at this point, as my current project gets even heavier with photos from this point on. Its actually photos on top of other photos being used as backgrounds.

I'm not going to talk about jumping ship, Yang. I do like Vegas a lot, and I haven't paid for the upgrade yet, so I cannot really yell about it much.

I do believe that Sony makes it very easy to test these upgrades. Demos of PP are are a real pain, especially since you cannot even burn a DVD with it.

Nicholas de Kock · May 13th, 2009, 03:10 AM

Although disappointed I wont jump ship just yet, I do feel like Sony is not listening to us though. I have put effort into switching to CS4 in my workflow however after much cursing & frustration decided Vegas is the platform for me. I would like to edit in 64bit however because I color correct almost every clip with Magic Bullets / AAV ColorLabs I'm forced to work in 32bit. Looking forward to Vegas 30 :P

John Estcourt · May 13th, 2009, 05:50 AM

I have to say that this is the first upgrade I am going to skip because as an HDV user I can see no benefit whatsoever in upgrading from vegas 8, slightly better preview at full best with cineform files...sorry not worth it
64 bit vegas is even more pointless as non of my plug ins will or are likely to ever work..
vegas 8 is working fine for me and has always done so, so no thanks.

Jeff Harper · May 13th, 2009, 08:43 AM

I agree Nicholas that Sony is holding back. There is so much potential that is not being realized..

Ron Evans · May 13th, 2009, 08:58 AM

My main use for Vegas is as an audio editor and in this respect it hasn't changed much since Vegas Audio!!!( switching of frame sync is about it ) My main video editor is Edius which in my mind is much better and faster. Vegas has the advantage in editing AVCHD files from my Sony SR11 and XR500 native though, so that is also how I use it for family single track, multicam is done in Edius HQ. I also prepare output for DVD Architect in Vegas with chapter markers etc from a file from Edius. This release has no improvements for me in my work flow so will wait for the next one.

Ron Evans

David Hadden · May 13th, 2009, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicholas de Kock

Installed Vegas Pro 9 (32/64) with Production Assistant today and can't say I'm overly excited about this release, very little has changed, except for the color. Production Assistant seems all but useless compared to Excalibur, VASST didn't even take the trouble to match up the color of PA1.0 with the new VP9 look. The new visual plug-ins are really nothing special if you already use Magic Bullet Looks. I don't work with RED or EX formats no benefits for me either, IMO Sony has done it again - released another substandard upgrade, should have been called 8.5. Half priced Vegas Pro 8 is a great deal if you can still find a sale. All that excitement for nothing.

Hi Nicholas, PA is compatible with 8.0 and 8.1 as well, so whether it was set as darker UI or lighter it would have looked weird for someone :).

Also, PA is not something that should be compared to Excalibur IMO, Ultimate S should be compared to Excalibur, PA is designed with a whole different purpose in mind, it's all about Batch Processing large amounts of tasks etc... for many projects, or files, with total hands free operation. It's also designed to work as a project template tool, where doing repetative projects can be sped up dramatically. Granted these things are not for everyone, but I just think that it should be clarified that PA is not aimed at being Ultimate S or Excalibur, (even though it has the montage tool, the reelpak capability, Moto Foto tool, and the lower thirds tool from Ultimate S not to mention some handy quick split buttons etc...).

Also, I have to say that for those that do all their CC in Bullet and can't get into Vegas 9 64 because of it, tossing an unsharp mask at -.3 amount, and radius in the .4-.7 range lay a vingette over your footage, and use ReelPaks for your presets, and you've got basically all the tools that I ever use in Magic Bullet, and I can work in Vegas 64 bit and get all the juice from the added overhead, and my render times/speeds are just fine ( MB almost always gets me about 20FPS on my 24P SD footage, but ReelPaks, and my own settings, and I can sometimes beat that with a modest quadcore proc. I get more or less the same look, except that Vegas handles the highlights better than MB (MB has a tendency to introduce flickers in the highlights when you put a limiter on inside of MB in my experience).

Just my input, and I should be clear that while I do work for VASST as a contractor doing various work, these opinions are my own, and I am not speaking on their behalf.

Dave

Jeff Harper · May 13th, 2009, 02:51 PM

Thanks Dave, I am finding ways around MB, and you are right, there are some advantages to using adjusted reelpaks looks, etc over it, not the least of which is better playback and render speed.

Bob Thieda · May 13th, 2009, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Harper

Well, well, well. This really hurts to say. Very painful.

I have been raving about the 64 bit version of this new upgrade all day, how great the playback is, etc. etc.

Lo and behold, I decided to switch to it to finish a current project which is heavy with photos mixed with video.

Guess what Nicholas? Playback is not so good now. Not as good as the old 8.0c.

I restarted it, etc., but to no avail. I let it play, and when it gets to a section with photos playback becomes jerky. Since this project was created in 8.0c, I suppose that could be the cause, don't know.

I do have Ultimate S installed, and it is in demo mode, so that could be a cause, but I highly doubt it, as I've never had issues with Ultimate S before.

I have downloaded Windows 7 recently, so I might reinstall everything, try the new Windows while I'm at it, then see how this upgrade works, but I'll have to wait for a couple of days till I get a couple of projects done.

Suddenly I'm feeling more sympathy for the others experiencing disappointment with the upgrade. Ouch.

That's what I was talkin' about in the other thread, Jeff. I get smoother playback in 8.0c than I do in 9.0 64bit...
And BTW, I just did a clean install of Windows 7 a week ago...

Jeff Harper · May 13th, 2009, 03:15 PM

Thanks Bob. That is NOT what I wanted to hear!

Jeff Harper · May 13th, 2009, 03:24 PM

Bob, have you tried that trick some people are using to up the # of threads used for playback? It just occurred to me that could help. I'm on my way out the door, but I might try it later.

Bob Thieda · May 13th, 2009, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Harper

Bob, have you tried that trick some people are using to up the # of threads used for playback? It just occurred to me that could help. I'm on my way out the door, but I might try it later.

You mean enabling multicore playback in the secret internal options list?

When I checked mine it was already set to "TRUE"...

I thought about turning it off...maybe later...

May 12th, 2009, 08:20 PM	#1
Nicholas de Kock Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: KLD, South Africa Posts: 983	First VP9 & PA1.0 Impressions Here Installed Vegas Pro 9 (32/64) with Production Assistant today and can't say I'm overly excited about this release, very little has changed, except for the color. Production Assistant seems all but useless compared to Excalibur, VASST didn't even take the trouble to match up the color of PA1.0 with the new VP9 look. The new visual plug-ins are really nothing special if you already use Magic Bullet Looks. I don't work with RED or EX formats no benefits for me either, IMO Sony has done it again - released another substandard upgrade, should have been called 8.5. Half priced Vegas Pro 8 is a great deal if you can still find a sale. All that excitement for nothing.

May 12th, 2009, 09:20 PM	#2
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Well Nick, I agree that 32 bit version is unexciting, but I am loving 64 bit version so far. Preview is much better so far, and it renders quickly. 8.1 didn't work satisfactorily for me, and I am sticking with Ultimate S, in fact I just upgraded to 4.1 as Production Assistant seemed to sketchy to me. I can't argue your feelings, as I was damning this release before it came out, and I feel somewhat justified. However in my case I've been waiting for a 64 bit version that worked this well for a long time, and I feel this is it. Edit: see post below for update! Last edited by Jeff Harper; May 12th, 2009 at 09:56 PM.

May 13th, 2009, 05:50 AM	#7
John Estcourt Major Player Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Scotland, Ayr www.amour weddingvideos.co.uk Posts: 305	I have to say that this is the first upgrade I am going to skip because as an HDV user I can see no benefit whatsoever in upgrading from vegas 8, slightly better preview at full best with cineform files...sorry not worth it 64 bit vegas is even more pointless as non of my plug ins will or are likely to ever work.. vegas 8 is working fine for me and has always done so, so no thanks. __________________ john estcourt www.amourweddingvideos.co.uk

May 12th, 2009, 09:55 PM	#3
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Well, well, well. This really hurts to say. Very painful. I have been raving about the 64 bit version of this new upgrade all day, how great the playback is, etc. etc. Lo and behold, I decided to switch to it to finish a current project which is heavy with photos mixed with video. Guess what Nicholas? Playback is not so good now. Not as good as the old 8.0c. I restarted it, etc., but to no avail. I let it play, and when it gets to a section with photos playback becomes jerky. Since this project was created in 8.0c, I suppose that could be the cause, don't know. I do have Ultimate S installed, and it is in demo mode, so that could be a cause, but I highly doubt it, as I've never had issues with Ultimate S before. I have downloaded Windows 7 recently, so I might reinstall everything, try the new Windows while I'm at it, then see how this upgrade works, but I'll have to wait for a couple of days till I get a couple of projects done. Suddenly I'm feeling more sympathy for the others experiencing disappointment with the upgrade. Ouch.

May 12th, 2009, 10:46 PM	#4
Yang Wen Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 991	How does a company screw up something so basic? Did they by sheer coincidence utilize only testing platforms that are completely different than the systems used by its customers? How was this product deemed robust enough to be released to the public? With Version 9, it certainly looks like SCS lacks the talent to product industry leading software. Or in the case of V9, software with average level of performance. Version 9 could very well could be the end of the Vegas path for me.. At this point, it might be worthwhile to put up with the shortcomings of the other NLEs, if only it means not having to put up with annoying bugs.

May 12th, 2009, 11:11 PM	#5
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	What is funny is I just tried the project in question above in the 32 bit version of Vegas 9 and playback was comparable to 8.0c again. I really want to reinstall windows and give the 64 bit version another chance on a clean installation of windows. As it is the 64 bit version is too jerky for me at this point, as my current project gets even heavier with photos from this point on. Its actually photos on top of other photos being used as backgrounds. I'm not going to talk about jumping ship, Yang. I do like Vegas a lot, and I haven't paid for the upgrade yet, so I cannot really yell about it much. I do believe that Sony makes it very easy to test these upgrades. Demos of PP are are a real pain, especially since you cannot even burn a DVD with it.

May 13th, 2009, 03:10 AM	#6
Nicholas de Kock Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: KLD, South Africa Posts: 983	Although disappointed I wont jump ship just yet, I do feel like Sony is not listening to us though. I have put effort into switching to CS4 in my workflow however after much cursing & frustration decided Vegas is the platform for me. I would like to edit in 64bit however because I color correct almost every clip with Magic Bullets / AAV ColorLabs I'm forced to work in 32bit. Looking forward to Vegas 30 :P

May 13th, 2009, 08:43 AM	#8
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	I agree Nicholas that Sony is holding back. There is so much potential that is not being realized..

May 13th, 2009, 08:58 AM	#9
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,220	My main use for Vegas is as an audio editor and in this respect it hasn't changed much since Vegas Audio!!!( switching of frame sync is about it ) My main video editor is Edius which in my mind is much better and faster. Vegas has the advantage in editing AVCHD files from my Sony SR11 and XR500 native though, so that is also how I use it for family single track, multicam is done in Edius HQ. I also prepare output for DVD Architect in Vegas with chapter markers etc from a file from Edius. This release has no improvements for me in my work flow so will wait for the next one. Ron Evans

May 13th, 2009, 02:51 PM	#11
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Thanks Dave, I am finding ways around MB, and you are right, there are some advantages to using adjusted reelpaks looks, etc over it, not the least of which is better playback and render speed.

May 13th, 2009, 03:15 PM	#13
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Thanks Bob. That is NOT what I wanted to hear!

May 13th, 2009, 03:24 PM	#14
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Bob, have you tried that trick some people are using to up the # of threads used for playback? It just occurred to me that could help. I'm on my way out the door, but I might try it later.