To go with Vegas at DVinfo.net

Kristine Noud · January 7th, 2004, 04:12 PM

Hello,

I am setting up my system and am placing my order this week (by Friday, hopefully). Please comment if you have knowledge I may be able to use:

1. I will order Vegas plus DVD from Videoguys (now, if only I could go back to last month and order it!!!)

2. I need a computer. I see that Videoguys recommends Dell workstation 340. I assume the new model, 360, is also okay with them. They also recommend the HP xw 4100/6000/8000. With Vegas, does either dell or HP work better?

3. I also will order 2 mics, each in the $140 range. I really would like two wireless lapel mics, but I cannot drop sound. What experiences do you all have with dropping sound and different mics?

4. If it matters, I have the Panasonic 953.

Thank you for your feedback.

Kristine

Edward Troxel · January 7th, 2004, 04:22 PM

Vegas works well on virtually any PC. Any current PC with plenty of drive space (preferably a seperate drive for video), RAM, and CPU speed should be fine. The other requirement is an OHCI compliant firewire connection. Don't get too hung up on a specific machine.

I guess the mics depend on what you are going to do. We have a wireless mic and don't worry about dropouts. A good wireless system should perform well in most instances. However, there's nothing wrong with using wired mics either (if the situation allows).

Glenn Chan · January 8th, 2004, 12:54 AM

Wireless mics can be disrupted if someone else is using your frequency. Audio-oriented forums have lots of discussion on them. From what I gather, higher end mic systems like the Sennheiser Evolution series will let you choose from a wider range of channels which is good in areas where people are using most of them.

Scout out the location beforehand (at the exact time of day) and monitor your audio on headphones. Those will help you prevent audio disasters. And wired is better (hard to get interference) but not always practical.

Check audio forums like the one on dvinfo.net or dv.com to get the scoop on how to connect the mics you are using to your camera. XLR and miniplugs operate at different levels.

2- Dell has some nice deals on computers sometimes. They always have promotions on and you have to wait for the right combination of promos. Free shipping and free RAM are good ones I believe.

You can also save money by installing stuff yourself. RAM is pretty easy to install while Dell charges a lot for it. 1GB is usually enough for every program you want to run. Vegas doesn't actually need all that much RAM. I think you can get away with 256MB. If you run other apps or multitask you probably want at least 512MB.

Dell computers are nice and quiet. Their customer service has suffered a lot though since they outsourced to India. If you have a large contract with them their service is great. I have no experience with HP.

Glenn Chan · January 8th, 2004, 01:20 AM

Took a look at the Dell website. The Dimension 4600 looks like a good deal if you don't add on any of the options. $450+shipping You have to get there through the small business section --> desktops.

Need to add:
Monitor - Dual monitors are nice. I highly suggest this, and it's cheaper than 1 big monitor. Not sure about recommendations. NEC seems to make good flat CRTs. With the Dell deal you can get a 17" LCD for $350 (not sure if this is a hot deal, I think it is though). Get that and a nice flat CRT monitor. That one doesn't have to be too big.

mouse- logitech, microsoft, whatever

keyboard- Vegas keys keyboard, whatever keyboard is comfortable for you are good choices

?RAM? (it already has 512MB) crucial.com for RAM if you want 1GB. Just get 2X512MB and sell the old RAM on eBay or something. You may not need to upgrade. RAM is really easy to install.

software - Vegas, productivity software, tsunami, excalibur, etc.

dual head video card- I think a $35 transcend ATI Radeon 7000 from newegg.com will work. It can only do DVI + VGA though (not 2XVGA). If running one monitor then on-board graphics will work fine.

speakers/monitors (and headphones) - (Sony MDR V-6s, 7506s, AKG 24_ <--certain models)

Hard drives- the bigger the better. Seagate, IBM, and Western Digital are good brands. newegg.com is one place to buy. You can also wait for a deal online and grab em for even less I think. Check hot deals sites like fatwallet.com.

The hardest things to install are the video card and the hard drive, which IMO isn't that hard. Everything else isn't very difficult at all.

Graham Bernard · January 8th, 2004, 03:34 AM

Well, Vegas does make use of RAM for the building of RAM previews. I've found this valuable. I've got 2gb and it certainly makes life more comfortable.

Senni Evolution Wireless system for my Canon XM2 works very well. I've recorded in a very noisy retail warehouse. Had the lapel mic fixed to the subject and the rx XLRed to one channel and my other senni shotgun mic on the other channel. Very clean from subject and I have the ambient sound on the other. Excelllent in post. The Evolution even recoded out of line of sight AND around corners too!

Definately have a separate video drive. I've got 2 x 120 gbs. I was gonna go with one 200gb video drive. But expereince has told me to split the risks - yeah? I've also got 4 x external f/w drives plugged into an ASUS motherboard and my actual video pathways going via a Canopus ACEDVio board. The mobo runs at 3.2ghtz.

I got my pc from a firm here in the UK that specialises in constructing video editing decks. I did this on purpose because they can and do understand the rigours of video editing and will move heaven and earth to fix issues . . . you might want to consider this amongst your preferences as an after sales necessary option.

Regards,

Grazie

Tor Salomonsen · January 8th, 2004, 04:38 AM

Maybe Kristine, if you would tell us about your recording tasks you'd get even better advise on the mic thing.

For general work I have found that a small shotgun like the Sennheiser MK 300 comes in very handy on top of the camera. But being very directional, it changes the background noise or atmosphere characteristic very much if you turn it. (I would worry about that if I were you, Grazie. But then you didn't say you had fixed the shotgun on your camera.)

If you want to safeguard against dropouts you could attach a small recorder to the person carrying the wireless lapel mic, split the signal and use the minidisk as a backup. That way you wouldn't have to worry about sync because you'd only be using it to cover the drops.

Graham Bernard · January 8th, 2004, 05:23 AM

Torsie - Happy New Year!

As always very good value. Yes the characteristic would change . . . and yes I'd keep an "ear" out for that one.

Grazie

Don Donatello · January 8th, 2004, 01:49 PM

if you are looking at the dell 4600 take a very close look at it .
we have the 4500 ( & 8200) and it does not have the room inside the case that the 8200 does. if i remember correctly it has 1 or 2 less PCI slots then 8200 ... the 4600 and 8300 are updates on the 4500/8200 so i'm not up to spec's on them but i can assure you there is a difference between them - could be slower ram , slower front side bus etc ...

also when buying from DELL always check out the prices on same model computer under consumer/office and small business.
every time i've bought from DELL i always have found a better deal under small business ..also under business you have the option of not having to order a modem , speakers and some others that come packaged with consumers computers ... to buy under small business you need a buisiness name - you can use your NAME as the busness name ...

Kristine Noud · January 10th, 2004, 02:33 PM

Wow. Edward, Glenn, Graham, Tor, and Don, thank you all very much for the helpful information.
Tor, I am making small-time training videos.

Don, Thanks for the head up about the space. My husband is going to install a lot on whatever computer I get - he’ll install the second drive, the DVD writer, and extra RAM, so we need the extra space!

Kristine

Tor Salomonsen · January 11th, 2004, 04:28 PM

Training videos, OK. I was thinking what is it that makes you say you cannot drop sound? Have you no way of repeating performances or parts of them if something fails? Because if you do, your choice of microphone is one of sound quality vs convenience. If you don't, well that might call for a different approach. Most likely a double system like the one I suggested.

(Graham, Happy new year to you, too. I wish I could be there in February, but I'll have to make do with the South of France :-))

Kristine Noud · January 12th, 2004, 01:25 PM

I don't want to drop sound when I'm interviewing someone as a one-shot deal.

I like the back up idea.

How often do wireless mics drop sound (the cheap kind), provided no major interference is going on?

You all are great. I hope once I'm up and running with Vegas, I can return all the great advice!

Kristine

Tor Salomonsen · January 12th, 2004, 01:39 PM

Interviewing: If you work alone, you may consider putting a headset on your ears. You'd hear any problems and repeat the question right away.

If you have someone with you, that other person might carry the headset.

If interviews are a main feature you'd be quite safe with cabled lapel mics - I mean if the ability to move around is not needed. But then again - in a static shot it would be fairly easy to rig a "normal" mic, too.

Kristine Noud · January 12th, 2004, 02:04 PM

Thank you very much!

Cameron Stainton · January 23rd, 2004, 10:04 PM

Kristine,
I run a Dell 8100. Unfortunately their customer service has gone down hill...as I found out the hard way.
A piece of advice...make sure you work out any bugs in the system right away before your 30 day free service contract expires. The online Dell forums are pretty good as well....although you shouldn't have any troubles with the models you are thinking of purchasing.
Have fun
CS

Don Parrish · January 27th, 2004, 08:53 AM

The Sennheiser evolution serious is cost effective but high quality, the only time I have ever heard any noise with sennheiser was when I was 100 ft from a UHF communications tower for a 911 center. Other than that Sennheiser evolution 100 series is good stuff, the only draw back is that these are the lower end units and do not have the battery life indicators so you will end up changing batteries more often just to make sure. If this still worries you then don't go wireless, string out a mic!! A word of caution though, wires have a tendancy to go bad more than anything else!!

My position on the computer thing is to watch out for low frills systems, you will need someway to get your video into the computer and that may need to be a firewire port. Editing video chews up resources real quick, so as to not get frustrated or spend money that you will have to respend later, take your time and make the computer the right decision, it is almost as important as the camera. By the time you take a low end computer and pump it up to video editing specs you could have just bought or built an oustanding one.

January 7th, 2004, 04:12 PM	#1
Kristine Noud Tourist Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Columbia MD Posts: 4	To go with Vegas Hello, I am setting up my system and am placing my order this week (by Friday, hopefully). Please comment if you have knowledge I may be able to use: 1. I will order Vegas plus DVD from Videoguys (now, if only I could go back to last month and order it!!!) 2. I need a computer. I see that Videoguys recommends Dell workstation 340. I assume the new model, 360, is also okay with them. They also recommend the HP xw 4100/6000/8000. With Vegas, does either dell or HP work better? 3. I also will order 2 mics, each in the $140 range. I really would like two wireless lapel mics, but I cannot drop sound. What experiences do you all have with dropping sound and different mics? 4. If it matters, I have the Panasonic 953. Thank you for your feedback. Kristine __________________ Kristine

January 8th, 2004, 05:23 AM	#7
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	. . wanna another beer?? Torsie - Happy New Year! As always very good value. Yes the characteristic would change . . . and yes I'd keep an "ear" out for that one. Grazie

January 10th, 2004, 02:33 PM	#9
Kristine Noud Tourist Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Columbia MD Posts: 4	Wow. Edward, Glenn, Graham, Tor, and Don, thank you all very much for the helpful information. Tor, I am making small-time training videos. Don, Thanks for the head up about the space. My husband is going to install a lot on whatever computer I get - he’ll install the second drive, the DVD writer, and extra RAM, so we need the extra space! Kristine __________________ Kristine

January 12th, 2004, 01:25 PM	#11
Kristine Noud Tourist Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Columbia MD Posts: 4	I don't want to drop sound when I'm interviewing someone as a one-shot deal. I like the back up idea. How often do wireless mics drop sound (the cheap kind), provided no major interference is going on? You all are great. I hope once I'm up and running with Vegas, I can return all the great advice! Kristine __________________ Kristine

January 12th, 2004, 02:04 PM	#13
Kristine Noud Tourist Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Columbia MD Posts: 4	Thank you very much! __________________ Kristine

January 7th, 2004, 04:22 PM	#2
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Vegas works well on virtually any PC. Any current PC with plenty of drive space (preferably a seperate drive for video), RAM, and CPU speed should be fine. The other requirement is an OHCI compliant firewire connection. Don't get too hung up on a specific machine. I guess the mics depend on what you are going to do. We have a wireless mic and don't worry about dropouts. A good wireless system should perform well in most instances. However, there's nothing wrong with using wired mics either (if the situation allows).

January 8th, 2004, 12:54 AM	#3
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	Wireless mics can be disrupted if someone else is using your frequency. Audio-oriented forums have lots of discussion on them. From what I gather, higher end mic systems like the Sennheiser Evolution series will let you choose from a wider range of channels which is good in areas where people are using most of them. Scout out the location beforehand (at the exact time of day) and monitor your audio on headphones. Those will help you prevent audio disasters. And wired is better (hard to get interference) but not always practical. Check audio forums like the one on dvinfo.net or dv.com to get the scoop on how to connect the mics you are using to your camera. XLR and miniplugs operate at different levels. 2- Dell has some nice deals on computers sometimes. They always have promotions on and you have to wait for the right combination of promos. Free shipping and free RAM are good ones I believe. You can also save money by installing stuff yourself. RAM is pretty easy to install while Dell charges a lot for it. 1GB is usually enough for every program you want to run. Vegas doesn't actually need all that much RAM. I think you can get away with 256MB. If you run other apps or multitask you probably want at least 512MB. Dell computers are nice and quiet. Their customer service has suffered a lot though since they outsourced to India. If you have a large contract with them their service is great. I have no experience with HP.

January 8th, 2004, 01:20 AM	#4
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	Took a look at the Dell website. The Dimension 4600 looks like a good deal if you don't add on any of the options. $450+shipping You have to get there through the small business section --> desktops. Need to add: Monitor - Dual monitors are nice. I highly suggest this, and it's cheaper than 1 big monitor. Not sure about recommendations. NEC seems to make good flat CRTs. With the Dell deal you can get a 17" LCD for $350 (not sure if this is a hot deal, I think it is though). Get that and a nice flat CRT monitor. That one doesn't have to be too big. mouse- logitech, microsoft, whatever keyboard- Vegas keys keyboard, whatever keyboard is comfortable for you are good choices ?RAM? (it already has 512MB) crucial.com for RAM if you want 1GB. Just get 2X512MB and sell the old RAM on eBay or something. You may not need to upgrade. RAM is really easy to install. software - Vegas, productivity software, tsunami, excalibur, etc. dual head video card- I think a $35 transcend ATI Radeon 7000 from newegg.com will work. It can only do DVI + VGA though (not 2XVGA). If running one monitor then on-board graphics will work fine. speakers/monitors (and headphones) - (Sony MDR V-6s, 7506s, AKG 24_ <--certain models) Hard drives- the bigger the better. Seagate, IBM, and Western Digital are good brands. newegg.com is one place to buy. You can also wait for a deal online and grab em for even less I think. Check hot deals sites like fatwallet.com. The hardest things to install are the video card and the hard drive, which IMO isn't that hard. Everything else isn't very difficult at all.

January 8th, 2004, 03:34 AM	#5
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	Well, Vegas does make use of RAM for the building of RAM previews. I've found this valuable. I've got 2gb and it certainly makes life more comfortable. Senni Evolution Wireless system for my Canon XM2 works very well. I've recorded in a very noisy retail warehouse. Had the lapel mic fixed to the subject and the rx XLRed to one channel and my other senni shotgun mic on the other channel. Very clean from subject and I have the ambient sound on the other. Excelllent in post. The Evolution even recoded out of line of sight AND around corners too! Definately have a separate video drive. I've got 2 x 120 gbs. I was gonna go with one 200gb video drive. But expereince has told me to split the risks - yeah? I've also got 4 x external f/w drives plugged into an ASUS motherboard and my actual video pathways going via a Canopus ACEDVio board. The mobo runs at 3.2ghtz. I got my pc from a firm here in the UK that specialises in constructing video editing decks. I did this on purpose because they can and do understand the rigours of video editing and will move heaven and earth to fix issues . . . you might want to consider this amongst your preferences as an after sales necessary option. Regards, Grazie

January 8th, 2004, 04:38 AM	#6
Tor Salomonsen Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Stavanger, Norway Posts: 265	Maybe Kristine, if you would tell us about your recording tasks you'd get even better advise on the mic thing. For general work I have found that a small shotgun like the Sennheiser MK 300 comes in very handy on top of the camera. But being very directional, it changes the background noise or atmosphere characteristic very much if you turn it. (I would worry about that if I were you, Grazie. But then you didn't say you had fixed the shotgun on your camera.) If you want to safeguard against dropouts you could attach a small recorder to the person carrying the wireless lapel mic, split the signal and use the minidisk as a backup. That way you wouldn't have to worry about sync because you'd only be using it to cover the drops.

January 8th, 2004, 01:49 PM	#8
Don Donatello Hawaiian Shirt Mogul Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: northern cailfornia Posts: 1,261	if you are looking at the dell 4600 take a very close look at it . we have the 4500 ( & 8200) and it does not have the room inside the case that the 8200 does. if i remember correctly it has 1 or 2 less PCI slots then 8200 ... the 4600 and 8300 are updates on the 4500/8200 so i'm not up to spec's on them but i can assure you there is a difference between them - could be slower ram , slower front side bus etc ... also when buying from DELL always check out the prices on same model computer under consumer/office and small business. every time i've bought from DELL i always have found a better deal under small business ..also under business you have the option of not having to order a modem , speakers and some others that come packaged with consumers computers ... to buy under small business you need a buisiness name - you can use your NAME as the busness name ...

January 11th, 2004, 04:28 PM	#10
Tor Salomonsen Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Stavanger, Norway Posts: 265	Training videos, OK. I was thinking what is it that makes you say you cannot drop sound? Have you no way of repeating performances or parts of them if something fails? Because if you do, your choice of microphone is one of sound quality vs convenience. If you don't, well that might call for a different approach. Most likely a double system like the one I suggested. (Graham, Happy new year to you, too. I wish I could be there in February, but I'll have to make do with the South of France :-))

January 12th, 2004, 01:39 PM	#12
Tor Salomonsen Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Stavanger, Norway Posts: 265	Interviewing: If you work alone, you may consider putting a headset on your ears. You'd hear any problems and repeat the question right away. If you have someone with you, that other person might carry the headset. If interviews are a main feature you'd be quite safe with cabled lapel mics - I mean if the ability to move around is not needed. But then again - in a static shot it would be fairly easy to rig a "normal" mic, too.

January 23rd, 2004, 10:04 PM	#14
Cameron Stainton New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Carbondale, CO Posts: 22	Kristine, I run a Dell 8100. Unfortunately their customer service has gone down hill...as I found out the hard way. A piece of advice...make sure you work out any bugs in the system right away before your 30 day free service contract expires. The online Dell forums are pretty good as well....although you shouldn't have any troubles with the models you are thinking of purchasing. Have fun CS

January 27th, 2004, 08:53 AM	#15
Don Parrish Major Player Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Tavares Fla Posts: 541	The Sennheiser evolution serious is cost effective but high quality, the only time I have ever heard any noise with sennheiser was when I was 100 ft from a UHF communications tower for a 911 center. Other than that Sennheiser evolution 100 series is good stuff, the only draw back is that these are the lower end units and do not have the battery life indicators so you will end up changing batteries more often just to make sure. If this still worries you then don't go wireless, string out a mic!! A word of caution though, wires have a tendancy to go bad more than anything else!! My position on the computer thing is to watch out for low frills systems, you will need someway to get your video into the computer and that may need to be a firewire port. Editing video chews up resources real quick, so as to not get frustrated or spend money that you will have to respend later, take your time and make the computer the right decision, it is almost as important as the camera. By the time you take a low end computer and pump it up to video editing specs you could have just bought or built an oustanding one.