Does Vegas Play Nice With After Effects?

Edward Troxel · December 18th, 2003, 10:59 AM

In that case, yes I would use AE! It's hard to beat "already own". And the two will work fine together - just not integrated.

Brian Standing · December 23rd, 2003, 04:02 PM

Another workflow option:

1. Frameserve from Vegas to After Effects using Satish's free Plug-in Pac (www.debugmode.com)

2. Build composition in After Effects

3. Render out as uncompressed (or lossless codec like HUFFYUV) video.

4. Reopen rendered video file in Vegas as needed for final cut.

Unfortunately, there's no way to frameserve OUT of After Effects, and Vegas DV Codec is not accessible to any program other than Vegas.

But I've used this method quite successfully with Vegas and AE.

Lorinda Norton · December 28th, 2003, 11:22 PM

I just read an article on the Watchdog pages by Daniel Broadway about simulating a 35mm motion picture clarity signature. Given your knowledge of Boris Red, I wondered if you could answer some questions for me.

Do you know if the "formula" he used in After Effects would be pretty much the same in Boris Red? It sure would be nice accessing BR from the Vegas timeline.

Here's the link to the article if you need it: http://www.dvinfo.net/articles/filmlook/broadway1.php

This is veering off-topic, but I've also read a little about Magic Bullet and seen some great footage on the Web (though we're looking at output to DVD). Could the end result of Mr. Broadway's technique and Magic Bullet be similar?

Thank you, in advance, for your help!

Glenn Chan · December 29th, 2003, 02:31 AM

I've been doing some messing around in Vegas, and it looks like it has a strong set of tools to give you control over your image.

The typical brightness, saturation and contrast filters in just about every NLE and image editing program aren't that good. The curves filter in Vegas and the saturation adjustment filters offer much better control!

Getting more "contrast" out of your image:
Use the curve filters and look through the presets. The "contrast" preset gives the same effect as the normal contrast filters in every program. You can do better. Make the curves look like an "s" (it's in the "Simulating 35mm Motion Picture Color Saturation" article you mentioned). This simulates the "soft shoulders" inherent in film, and also happens to make your image look more contrasty.

Saturation:
Use the saturation adjustment filter instead. It's like curves except for saturation. Try boosting up the lower end more than the highs. Some films have this characteristic (colours get more saturated in underexposure).

White balance:
Film white balanced for daylight will turn out yellow indoors. I forget the exact way of getting this effect with curves. If you know how to use curves in Photoshop you know Vegas' curves. Boosting yellow involves boosting the red+green channels so they are concave and look like a hill. You want to boost the red+green channels because red + green = yellow.

You can get great results once you master Vegas' color correction tools. The most useful ones seem to be curves, saturation adjustment, 3-way color corrector, and the secondary color corrector.

Effects:

You can also apply soft focus and film grain (not to be confused with video noise!) with Vegas. Vegas' film grain filter is good for film grain (I don't know any better ones). Soft focus you achieve by duplicating the video onto itself, blurring the top with gaussian blur, and lowering the opacity of the top clip. There are a whole bunch of other things you can do with the duplicating video onto itself trick.

Lorinda Norton · December 29th, 2003, 03:06 AM

Thanks, Glenn--that's a lot of good info! I had read the trick about soft focus before but forgotten it, so this time I'll print what you wrote and start practicing.

Appreciate you taking the time to give detailed tips/explanations. They'll help a lot.

Glenn Chan · December 29th, 2003, 10:01 PM

http://www.freewebs.com/vegas4/vegas4.htm
More ideas there :)

Lorinda Norton · December 29th, 2003, 11:06 PM

Gosh, I'd forgotten how much I miss Alex K. (haven't *seen* him around here in quite a while). Quite the talented young man, plus good for a laugh. Loved that quip at the bottom. :)

Thanks; I'll practice from that tutorial as well.

Glen Elliott · December 30th, 2003, 10:47 AM

Where is the best place to read up about Boris Red? Also do all new versions automatically support Vegas or is there a specific version made for Vegas?

Oh yeah- I was wondering where Alex has been myself. Haven't seen him post in quite some time. Think the last post was around Sept. Guess school is keeping him really *busy*.

Edward Troxel · December 30th, 2003, 11:40 AM

Only the latest version supports Vegas. I suppose the BEST place would be at BorisFX.com and/or the manuals.

Currenlty, Vegas is supported by:
Red 3GL
Graffiti 3
FX 7

December 28th, 2003, 11:22 PM	#18
Lorinda Norton Wrangler Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southwest Idaho, USA Posts: 3,066	for Edward Troxel I just read an article on the Watchdog pages by Daniel Broadway about simulating a 35mm motion picture clarity signature. Given your knowledge of Boris Red, I wondered if you could answer some questions for me. Do you know if the "formula" he used in After Effects would be pretty much the same in Boris Red? It sure would be nice accessing BR from the Vegas timeline. Here's the link to the article if you need it: http://www.dvinfo.net/articles/filmlook/broadway1.php This is veering off-topic, but I've also read a little about Magic Bullet and seen some great footage on the Web (though we're looking at output to DVD). Could the end result of Mr. Broadway's technique and Magic Bullet be similar? Thank you, in advance, for your help!

December 29th, 2003, 03:06 AM	#20
Lorinda Norton Wrangler Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southwest Idaho, USA Posts: 3,066	Thanks, Glenn--that's a lot of good info! I had read the trick about soft focus before but forgotten it, so this time I'll print what you wrote and start practicing. Appreciate you taking the time to give detailed tips/explanations. They'll help a lot. __________________ Lorinda

December 29th, 2003, 11:06 PM	#22
Lorinda Norton Wrangler Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southwest Idaho, USA Posts: 3,066	Gosh, I'd forgotten how much I miss Alex K. (haven't seen him around here in quite a while). Quite the talented young man, plus good for a laugh. Loved that quip at the bottom. :) Thanks; I'll practice from that tutorial as well. __________________ Lorinda

December 18th, 2003, 10:59 AM	#16
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	In that case, yes I would use AE! It's hard to beat "already own". And the two will work fine together - just not integrated.

December 23rd, 2003, 04:02 PM	#17
Brian Standing Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Madison, Wisconsin Posts: 621	Another workflow option: 1. Frameserve from Vegas to After Effects using Satish's free Plug-in Pac (www.debugmode.com) 2. Build composition in After Effects 3. Render out as uncompressed (or lossless codec like HUFFYUV) video. 4. Reopen rendered video file in Vegas as needed for final cut. Unfortunately, there's no way to frameserve OUT of After Effects, and Vegas DV Codec is not accessible to any program other than Vegas. But I've used this method quite successfully with Vegas and AE.

December 29th, 2003, 02:31 AM	#19
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	I've been doing some messing around in Vegas, and it looks like it has a strong set of tools to give you control over your image. The typical brightness, saturation and contrast filters in just about every NLE and image editing program aren't that good. The curves filter in Vegas and the saturation adjustment filters offer much better control! Getting more "contrast" out of your image: Use the curve filters and look through the presets. The "contrast" preset gives the same effect as the normal contrast filters in every program. You can do better. Make the curves look like an "s" (it's in the "Simulating 35mm Motion Picture Color Saturation" article you mentioned). This simulates the "soft shoulders" inherent in film, and also happens to make your image look more contrasty. Saturation: Use the saturation adjustment filter instead. It's like curves except for saturation. Try boosting up the lower end more than the highs. Some films have this characteristic (colours get more saturated in underexposure). White balance: Film white balanced for daylight will turn out yellow indoors. I forget the exact way of getting this effect with curves. If you know how to use curves in Photoshop you know Vegas' curves. Boosting yellow involves boosting the red+green channels so they are concave and look like a hill. You want to boost the red+green channels because red + green = yellow. You can get great results once you master Vegas' color correction tools. The most useful ones seem to be curves, saturation adjustment, 3-way color corrector, and the secondary color corrector. Effects: You can also apply soft focus and film grain (not to be confused with video noise!) with Vegas. Vegas' film grain filter is good for film grain (I don't know any better ones). Soft focus you achieve by duplicating the video onto itself, blurring the top with gaussian blur, and lowering the opacity of the top clip. There are a whole bunch of other things you can do with the duplicating video onto itself trick.

December 29th, 2003, 10:01 PM	#21
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	http://www.freewebs.com/vegas4/vegas4.htm More ideas there :)

December 30th, 2003, 10:47 AM	#23
Glen Elliott Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 2,898	Where is the best place to read up about Boris Red? Also do all new versions automatically support Vegas or is there a specific version made for Vegas? Oh yeah- I was wondering where Alex has been myself. Haven't seen him post in quite some time. Think the last post was around Sept. Guess school is keeping him really busy.

December 30th, 2003, 11:40 AM	#24
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Only the latest version supports Vegas. I suppose the BEST place would be at BorisFX.com and/or the manuals. Currenlty, Vegas is supported by: Red 3GL Graffiti 3 FX 7