AVI Troubles at DVinfo.net

Rob Gregory-Browne · September 27th, 2007, 11:42 AM

Maybe someone with more brains about this stuff than me can explain why this happens:

When I open Vegas and preview a clip in the Explorer tab, the preview looks clean, pristine, quite nice. What I'm previewing, by the way, is a Camtasia style screen capture of Sound Forge.

But as soon as I drag the clip onto the timeline, the resolution looks crappy, there's trailing on the mouse and what looks like interlacing problems. This all happens right in the timeline before I render, with preview set on Best.

I've changed settings on the clip in the properties, trying various combinations, but nothing I do seems to make the clip look as nice as it did when I simply previewed it in the Explorer tab.

So again, can someone explain why this happens and what I might do to remedy the problem?

P.S. I just now tried disabling resampling in the clip and while that improves it somewhat -- getting rid of artifacts, interlacing, etc. -- it's not nearly as sharp as the Explorer preview version. Any suggestions?

Bill Ravens · September 27th, 2007, 02:41 PM

some formats convert well to other formats, some don't. I would try different intermediate formats until I found one that gave a nice conversion.

Rob Gregory-Browne · September 27th, 2007, 02:59 PM

I'm using the standard Microsoft codec. Not the greatest, I know, but about the only choice I have, unfortunately.

Emre Safak · September 27th, 2007, 03:03 PM

How was the video acquired? What version of the WM of the codec are you using? What is the resolution? What is the bit rate? Is there interlacing? etc. etc.

Rob Gregory-Browne · September 27th, 2007, 05:28 PM

CamStudio screen capture. Standard Microsoft Video 1. Set for 100% quality. Temporal Quality Ratio: 1.00.

As I said, it plays great when previewing the native file, but once I drag it to the timeline, the quality erodes.

Emre Safak · September 27th, 2007, 06:38 PM

Microsoft Video 1...wow! That is so old I had never even heard of it. If you can post a brief I'll look into it.

Seth Bloombaum · September 27th, 2007, 07:38 PM

I've had excellent results with Camtasia's own TSCC codec. Capture in Camtasia in TSCC, you can also render to TSCC from Vegas. It's way better than MS Video 1.

An alternative is to render to the Screen codec that came with the Windows Media 7 release. Avoid Video 1 - that goes back to Windows 3.1 and was a 235 color codec, as I recall.

Final thought - ***match*** the project settings to the media type for this kind of work. This gives the best timeline and render results. You gotta' decide what resolution you're going to deliver in, then capture in that rez, and set your project up in that rez.

Rob Gregory-Browne · September 28th, 2007, 07:05 AM

Unfortunately, I'm not using Camtasia, but CamStudio, an open source clone. It does a wonderful job, but the Camtasia codec can't be used with it. I get a "no license" warning.

CamStudio has its own lossless codec, but I get major artifacts in Vegas when I use it, as I do when I try the wmv codecs, divx, xvid, etc.

The Video 1 codec is ancient, yes, but it's the only one at all that works in the timeline. I've been able to tweak it now with some success, but it's still not quite as pristine as the raw footage.

Seth Bloombaum · September 28th, 2007, 11:15 AM

If "free" has to be the price of the software...

I've not done this, but, you might try the screen capture capabilities of the freeware Windows Media Encoder. That should give you access to the MS Screen codec, much better than the Video 1 codec.

Rob Gregory-Browne · September 28th, 2007, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seth Bloombaum

If "free" has to be the price of the software...

I thank you for your advice, but with all due respect I'm not quite sure what you mean by this.

In my estimation price has nothing to do with the quality of software. I use several open source applications that are superior to their pricey counterparts. For example, I use OpenOffice Writer which is a much better word processor than Word, which, frankly, sucks balls.

Granted, I have yet to find an NLE or Compositing software that can compete, so I use Vegas and After Effects, but CamStudio is quite a wonderful piece of software and I have no first hand evidence that Camtasia, which isn't cheap, will play any nicer with Vegas than CamStudio does.

That said, again, thank you for your advice.

rgb

Rob Gregory-Browne · September 28th, 2007, 03:06 PM

Simple solutions sure make me feel dumb.

I discovered that if I go to Preview Device Preferences and uncheck "Simulate device aspect ratio," all looks fine in the timeline preview and the mystery has been solved.

Thanks to all for your responses.

rgb

Seth Bloombaum · September 28th, 2007, 06:15 PM

Rob, glad it's all sorted out.

Nothing prejudicial meant by "free", and I certainly agree that in many cases open source, shareware or freeware is a very reasonable choice (and I choose it whenever possible!). My only thought was to share my positive experience with the Camtasia TSCC codec and offer the possibility of MS WM Encoder if you were still experiencing problems with Camstudio and weren't ready to shell out the bucks for Camtasia.

I'll check into CamStudio. Camtasia does come rather dearly.

Rob Gregory-Browne · September 28th, 2007, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seth Bloombaum

Rob, glad it's all sorted out.

Nothing prejudicial meant by "free", and I certainly agree that in many cases open source, shareware or freeware is a very reasonable choice (and I choose it whenever possible!). My only thought was to share my positive experience with the Camtasia TSCC codec and offer the possibility of MS WM Encoder if you were still experiencing problems with Camstudio and weren't ready to shell out the bucks for Camtasia.

I'll check into CamStudio. Camtasia does come rather dearly.

No worries, Seth. Thanks again for your help.

September 27th, 2007, 11:42 AM	#1
Rob Gregory-Browne Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 107	AVI Troubles Maybe someone with more brains about this stuff than me can explain why this happens: When I open Vegas and preview a clip in the Explorer tab, the preview looks clean, pristine, quite nice. What I'm previewing, by the way, is a Camtasia style screen capture of Sound Forge. But as soon as I drag the clip onto the timeline, the resolution looks crappy, there's trailing on the mouse and what looks like interlacing problems. This all happens right in the timeline before I render, with preview set on Best. I've changed settings on the clip in the properties, trying various combinations, but nothing I do seems to make the clip look as nice as it did when I simply previewed it in the Explorer tab. So again, can someone explain why this happens and what I might do to remedy the problem? P.S. I just now tried disabling resampling in the clip and while that improves it somewhat -- getting rid of artifacts, interlacing, etc. -- it's not nearly as sharp as the Explorer preview version. Any suggestions?

September 27th, 2007, 02:41 PM	#2
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	some formats convert well to other formats, some don't. I would try different intermediate formats until I found one that gave a nice conversion.

September 27th, 2007, 02:59 PM	#3
Rob Gregory-Browne Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 107	I'm using the standard Microsoft codec. Not the greatest, I know, but about the only choice I have, unfortunately.

September 27th, 2007, 03:03 PM	#4
Emre Safak Trustee Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Brookline, MA Posts: 1,447	How was the video acquired? What version of the WM of the codec are you using? What is the resolution? What is the bit rate? Is there interlacing? etc. etc.

September 27th, 2007, 05:28 PM	#5
Rob Gregory-Browne Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 107	CamStudio screen capture. Standard Microsoft Video 1. Set for 100% quality. Temporal Quality Ratio: 1.00. As I said, it plays great when previewing the native file, but once I drag it to the timeline, the quality erodes.

September 27th, 2007, 06:38 PM	#6
Emre Safak Trustee Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Brookline, MA Posts: 1,447	Microsoft Video 1...wow! That is so old I had never even heard of it. If you can post a brief I'll look into it.

September 27th, 2007, 07:38 PM	#7
Seth Bloombaum Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,420	I've had excellent results with Camtasia's own TSCC codec. Capture in Camtasia in TSCC, you can also render to TSCC from Vegas. It's way better than MS Video 1. An alternative is to render to the Screen codec that came with the Windows Media 7 release. Avoid Video 1 - that goes back to Windows 3.1 and was a 235 color codec, as I recall. Final thought - *match* the project settings to the media type for this kind of work. This gives the best timeline and render results. You gotta' decide what resolution you're going to deliver in, then capture in that rez, and set your project up in that rez.

September 28th, 2007, 07:05 AM	#8
Rob Gregory-Browne Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 107	Unfortunately, I'm not using Camtasia, but CamStudio, an open source clone. It does a wonderful job, but the Camtasia codec can't be used with it. I get a "no license" warning. CamStudio has its own lossless codec, but I get major artifacts in Vegas when I use it, as I do when I try the wmv codecs, divx, xvid, etc. The Video 1 codec is ancient, yes, but it's the only one at all that works in the timeline. I've been able to tweak it now with some success, but it's still not quite as pristine as the raw footage.

September 28th, 2007, 11:15 AM	#9
Seth Bloombaum Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,420	If "free" has to be the price of the software... I've not done this, but, you might try the screen capture capabilities of the freeware Windows Media Encoder. That should give you access to the MS Screen codec, much better than the Video 1 codec.

September 28th, 2007, 03:06 PM	#11
Rob Gregory-Browne Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 107	Simple solutions sure make me feel dumb. I discovered that if I go to Preview Device Preferences and uncheck "Simulate device aspect ratio," all looks fine in the timeline preview and the mystery has been solved. Thanks to all for your responses. rgb

September 28th, 2007, 06:15 PM	#12
Seth Bloombaum Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,420	Rob, glad it's all sorted out. Nothing prejudicial meant by "free", and I certainly agree that in many cases open source, shareware or freeware is a very reasonable choice (and I choose it whenever possible!). My only thought was to share my positive experience with the Camtasia TSCC codec and offer the possibility of MS WM Encoder if you were still experiencing problems with Camstudio and weren't ready to shell out the bucks for Camtasia. I'll check into CamStudio. Camtasia does come rather dearly.