Delivering HDV

Jason Robinson · December 13th, 2006, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

h.264 blows wmv away, but its a codec which requires much more grunt.
IMO colour rendition of h264 (and divx for taht matter) is much more accurate than WMV..

LOTS of grunt. I downloaded some demo h264 footage when it came out and using my roommates tiBook we could NOT play the footage. too much computing power needed to decode the footage. Granted the compression was amazing. But that doesn't matter if a system can't play it.

So we switched over to my alienware (3ghz P4). :-) my system could play it and still occasionally had small glitches. I'm sure the core 2 duos won't have problems though.

jason

Kevin Shaw · December 13th, 2006, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

h.264 blows wmv away, but its a codec which requires much more grunt.

To me good WMV-HD looks fine and will play on many computers at the 720p resolution, so that's an option worth considering in some circumstances. Both WMV and H.264 take too long to encode with today's software-based solutions, and hardware encoders are expensive, so MPEG2-TS may also be useful for quick HD output.

The most practical way to deliver HD projects today is to downsample them to widescreen SD DVDs with high quality encoding, and leave the HD output for another day.

Peter Jefferson · December 14th, 2006, 12:12 AM

i agree Kevin, with many of todays clients not updating their machines for at least 3 years, 720p is usually the only HD format they can watch...

I agree with your views on the SW encoders.. for todays machines, the speed jsut doesnt cut it, and as time = money, the more time it takes to encide this stuff, the more time it takes us away from our work. So offering this content to clients IMO should be charged accordingly

Alastair Brown · December 14th, 2006, 07:05 AM

Am I right in saying WMV cannot be played back on commercial DVD Players?

I also read that Pinnacle Studio (can barely bring myself to say the name!!!!!) has a pseudo HD plug in available that will burn HD onto DVD. From what I can make out, it can just about burn 1hr onto a dual layer disc.

Anybody know what authoring programmes are in the pipeline.

My preferred choice would be Sony DVD Architect.

Timothy Harry · December 14th, 2006, 10:33 AM

when I used the pc to do all of my editing I loved DVD architect. it was simple to use, and extremely powerful.

I do know that DVD Studio Pro and iDVD HD have an HD workflow built into the program, but it will only play on a mac computer. It is fairly simple to use at least in iDVD, i havent tinkered in DVDSP yet, but that will be coming soon. I have seen the format used for demonstrating HD to clients, but I have never seen it used as a final delivery method.

Greg Quinn · December 14th, 2006, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alastair Brown

Am I right in saying WMV cannot be played back on commercial DVD Players?

I believe that there are several consumer DVD players
that will play WMV, e.g.;
http://www.ehomeupgrade.com/entry/1116/wmv_hd_dvd

Alastair Brown · December 14th, 2006, 03:17 PM

Nice one Greg! Now....all we need are loads of cheap DVD Players that play everything (therfore not made by any of the Big Brands!). If they are cheap enough, you can factor the price into your deal and give one away as part of the package.

Anybody aware of any other makes of player that can handle WMV?

For Info, if you want to see some WMV Samples go here:-

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/win...tshowcase.aspx

Michael Y Wong · December 14th, 2006, 09:09 PM

For those interested

I made it a point to finally put up a WMV-HD 720p example from a wedding footage shot in HDV. Mind you however I purposely ran it thru MB Editors to soften the image abit via various filters.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=81781

Alastair Brown · February 22nd, 2007, 06:05 AM

Anybody heard any further news on authoring software that will allow us mere mortals with limited means to author blu-ray or HD-DVD?

Chris Barcellos · February 22nd, 2007, 11:39 AM

Pinnalce Studio 10.7 is a mere mortal type program you might want to look at. From their website at www.pinnaclesys.com:

"Powerful new Studio 10.7 update now available Experience Studio 10 today
Download the Studio 10.7 patch and enjoy these great enhancements to your Studio software:

HD DVD Authoring Pack – burn HD DVD-format on standard DVD media discs using standard DVD burners. Play in new HD DVD players (purchase required to activate this feature) "

I haven't tried it because I don't have an HD player, but I do author regular DVD in this program all the time.

Rick Steele · February 22nd, 2007, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Barcellos

I haven't tried it because I don't have an HD player, but I do author regular DVD in this program all the time.

Wow Chris, you can actually use Studio 10 these days without it taking a dive into oblivion every 15 minutes?

Most unstable POS I ever used. Maybe it's better than the earlier version of 10 I used but the Studio forums don't seem to indicate much improvement.

Kevin Shaw · February 22nd, 2007, 06:07 PM

My wife and I have used Pinnacle Studio 9 for some photo montage projects and it's worked fine for us.

Marcus Marchesseault · February 22nd, 2007, 07:44 PM

I know someone on these forums uses Divx HD and includes a player with his wedding package. The players are about $250. A $350 model has wireless networking and can play video from your computer.

Kit Hannah · February 23rd, 2007, 02:38 AM

Well, even though you may not be able to put HD to DVD yet, at least the HDV footage converted down to SD looks 100 times better, sharper, etc. than recording in SD. HD will be available soon enough to the masses at affordable prices, but until then, you may as well have your current stuff look better than it did while still being ready for the explosion when it does happen.

It's all about the detail, baby!

Peter Jefferson · February 24th, 2007, 07:33 AM

"HDV footage converted down to SD looks 100 times better, sharper, etc. than recording in SD"

err.. OK, if u think the home video look is schmick... go for it.. lol Persoanlly i DESPISE interlaced footage and of the progressive scan footage ive seen from many producers, over 90% dont know how to shoot it/handle it/edit it effectively...

Dont get me worng, but theres more to "video" than sharpness.. and by "better" that argument has gone on in this and other forums since the advent of HDV, lets not rekindle that fire..

"It's all about the detail, baby! "
hmm.. and motion, and colour, and sound, and edit and finally the compression.. keyword being compression... u might wanna look it up before you start throwing comments like the above around.

December 14th, 2006, 10:33 AM	#20
Timothy Harry Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Odessa, TX Posts: 93	when I used the pc to do all of my editing I loved DVD architect. it was simple to use, and extremely powerful. I do know that DVD Studio Pro and iDVD HD have an HD workflow built into the program, but it will only play on a mac computer. It is fairly simple to use at least in iDVD, i havent tinkered in DVDSP yet, but that will be coming soon. I have seen the format used for demonstrating HD to clients, but I have never seen it used as a final delivery method. __________________ Tim Harry Bandwagon Media Odessa, TX www.bandwagonhd.com

December 14th, 2006, 03:17 PM	#22
Alastair Brown Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Glasgow/Scotland Posts: 626	Nice one Greg! Now....all we need are loads of cheap DVD Players that play everything (therfore not made by any of the Big Brands!). If they are cheap enough, you can factor the price into your deal and give one away as part of the package. Anybody aware of any other makes of player that can handle WMV? For Info, if you want to see some WMV Samples go here:- http://www.microsoft.com/windows/win...tshowcase.aspx Last edited by Alastair Brown; December 14th, 2006 at 03:56 PM.

December 14th, 2006, 09:09 PM	#23
Michael Y Wong Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Toronto Ontario Canada! Posts: 353	For those interested I made it a point to finally put up a WMV-HD 720p example from a wedding footage shot in HDV. Mind you however I purposely ran it thru MB Editors to soften the image abit via various filters. http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=81781 __________________ dreaming hobbyist + storyteller www.michaelywong.com

February 22nd, 2007, 11:39 AM	#25
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Pinnalce Studio 10.7 is a mere mortal type program you might want to look at. From their website at www.pinnaclesys.com: "Powerful new Studio 10.7 update now available Experience Studio 10 today Download the Studio 10.7 patch and enjoy these great enhancements to your Studio software: HD DVD Authoring Pack – burn HD DVD-format on standard DVD media discs using standard DVD burners. Play in new HD DVD players (purchase required to activate this feature) " I haven't tried it because I don't have an HD player, but I do author regular DVD in this program all the time. __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

February 24th, 2007, 07:33 AM	#30
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	"HDV footage converted down to SD looks 100 times better, sharper, etc. than recording in SD" err.. OK, if u think the home video look is schmick... go for it.. lol Persoanlly i DESPISE interlaced footage and of the progressive scan footage ive seen from many producers, over 90% dont know how to shoot it/handle it/edit it effectively... Dont get me worng, but theres more to "video" than sharpness.. and by "better" that argument has gone on in this and other forums since the advent of HDV, lets not rekindle that fire.. "It's all about the detail, baby! " hmm.. and motion, and colour, and sound, and edit and finally the compression.. keyword being compression... u might wanna look it up before you start throwing comments like the above around. Last edited by Peter Jefferson; February 24th, 2007 at 09:23 AM.

December 14th, 2006, 12:12 AM	#18
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	i agree Kevin, with many of todays clients not updating their machines for at least 3 years, 720p is usually the only HD format they can watch... I agree with your views on the SW encoders.. for todays machines, the speed jsut doesnt cut it, and as time = money, the more time it takes to encide this stuff, the more time it takes us away from our work. So offering this content to clients IMO should be charged accordingly

December 14th, 2006, 07:05 AM	#19
Alastair Brown Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Glasgow/Scotland Posts: 626	Am I right in saying WMV cannot be played back on commercial DVD Players? I also read that Pinnacle Studio (can barely bring myself to say the name!!!!!) has a pseudo HD plug in available that will burn HD onto DVD. From what I can make out, it can just about burn 1hr onto a dual layer disc. Anybody know what authoring programmes are in the pipeline. My preferred choice would be Sony DVD Architect.

February 22nd, 2007, 06:05 AM	#24
Alastair Brown Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Glasgow/Scotland Posts: 626	Anybody heard any further news on authoring software that will allow us mere mortals with limited means to author blu-ray or HD-DVD?

February 22nd, 2007, 06:07 PM	#27
Kevin Shaw Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 2,488	My wife and I have used Pinnacle Studio 9 for some photo montage projects and it's worked fine for us.

February 22nd, 2007, 07:44 PM	#28
Marcus Marchesseault Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 1,961	I know someone on these forums uses Divx HD and includes a player with his wedding package. The players are about $250. A $350 model has wireless networking and can play video from your computer.

February 23rd, 2007, 02:38 AM	#29
Kit Hannah Major Player Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Fresno, California Posts: 528	Well, even though you may not be able to put HD to DVD yet, at least the HDV footage converted down to SD looks 100 times better, sharper, etc. than recording in SD. HD will be available soon enough to the masses at affordable prices, but until then, you may as well have your current stuff look better than it did while still being ready for the explosion when it does happen. It's all about the detail, baby!