My First Wedding Video Demo at DVinfo.net

Michael Y Wong · August 23rd, 2006, 05:22 PM

Hello Guys

I'm new on this forum, but it definately seems to be the place to be.

Anyways, having attended film school & realizing that most of my friends and people approximately my age are getting married, I decided to give the wedding videography business a try.

I put up a QUICK & SLOPPY wedding video demo quickly together as some prospective clients have been asking.

You should use the latest version of windows media player to view this.

720p hd version with fake 24p (ull notice the jerkiness)
http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.ph...3E6C8761D43FAA

heavily downconverted sd version in smooth 30p
http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.ph...in@hotmail.com

if u dont have a yousendit account and/or too lazy to do so just use mine

myauyin@yahoo.com/videoenabled are the login credentials.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

Michael

Mike F Smith · August 23rd, 2006, 05:36 PM

File would not play on my computer. Just got herky jerkey still images.

Mike

Armin DeFiesta · August 23rd, 2006, 06:24 PM

Looks great! Good luck with your work.

Terry Esslinger · August 23rd, 2006, 11:09 PM

Video has some great ideas and shots But...
* Did not play well on my computer -jerky and many blurred shots
* Sound seemed overdriven and distorted

HD camera?

Michael Y Wong · August 24th, 2006, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terry Esslinger

Video has some great ideas and shots But...
* Did not play well on my computer -jerky and many blurred shots
* Sound seemed overdriven and distorted

HD camera?

sorry about that guys!

Yes i shot it in 1080i and did a quickdownconvert to 720p+fake stuttery 24p in PPro 2.0. So unless your system has the latest version of windows media player+relatively new setup the play back will not be optimal.

I've uploaded a heavily downconverted sd version in smooth 30p
http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.ph...in@hotmail.com

Login credentials are once again: myauyin@yahoo.com/videoenabled

The SD Version should play fine on anyones computer.

Eric Gan · August 24th, 2006, 04:45 PM

Michael, I enjoyed that very much. It's an excellent demo video. Most of the scenes had great colors, and you have a good eye for framing. Also, good use of shallow depth-of-field in various shots.

I'll give some constructive criticism, but take it for what it's worth because I'm also just starting out.

It looks like you can benefit from a better fluid tripod head. What are you currently using? Some of the starts and stops were a little too abrupt. For example, there is one brief shot at 1:41 where the camera jerks on the movement. I would suggest taking this shot out of the demo completely as one of the things that I expect a potential client to look for is smoothness of camera motion. I'm a bit puzzled here because some of your other pans/tilts were very smooth. Perhaps just a little bit more practice is needed when shooting on longer focal lengths?

At 1:17, you lost focus on the couple walking down the aisle. I would try to avoid this shot in the demo as well. An out-of-focus shot is the one enemy that we cannot fix in post.

Other than that, everything looks very professional. The good looking brides and bridesmaids always help a demo video! The dancing couple cracks me up. Well done, and I wish you the best in your business.

Eric

p.s. What camera are you using?

Mike F Smith · August 24th, 2006, 07:18 PM

You have some really good shots, your skill shows there. I don't think every transition being a fade to black is a good way to tell this couples story however. that really breaks the flow for me. There are times when you pan the subject and when you get to their head you make the cut too soon. If you are going to pan a human when you get to the face I need to see it some.

It's good solid work but the cuts need some fixing.

Mike

Ken Diewert · August 25th, 2006, 01:09 PM

Michael,

I don't normally venture into this forum because I vowed never to do another wedding video, but it turns out my wife signed me up for a family wedding next week in Calgary, so I came over to see what's going on.

I thought you're demo was very cool especially for 'quick & sloppy'. There's a couple of really great shots and a couple of scenes that I'd delete.

I like the use of the slo-mo, which NLE are you using?

All in all, nice job.

Good Luck

Peter Jefferson · August 27th, 2006, 09:45 PM

i noticed this was in sydney????

im looking for skilled shooter/editors.. drop me ur email, n ill get back 2u....

Michael Y Wong · August 28th, 2006, 03:49 PM

Hi guys,

thanks for the constructive criticisms, I will answer your questions to the best I can.

Eric, the shaky shots in the wedding you are refering to was when I was using a Manfrotto 745B+701RC2 setup.

Ive used 501/503s with heavier Arri 16mm cameras but for that specific wedding, I just borrowed the 745B+701RC2 from school the day before and for the first time used a fluid head setup with my camera.

It was pretty simple to use, but it did take time to get better with it. I can't recall if i had a telephoto lens on for that shot but I probably did, which would further explain the jerk motion.

I also do agree that out of focus is bad, but in my personal preference only, it does appear more filmic/magical @ times to have the subject out of focus, but it is situational. However, i 100% understand what you are saying.

Since that wedding I've purchased the 755B+501 (the shots at the really nice park are all 501), but having used it once, I immediately returned it and purchased the 503 instead.

I plan on getting a Z1/FX1 or one of the new Canon HDV cameras next year depending on the number of bookings I get for the upcoming season, in addition to purchasing a RedRock M2 adapter+supports rods etc. for my own personal film projects, so the 503 was a fair futureproof solution.

This year, I've shot everything using the little bro of your FX1, the HC1. My setup currently includes:
-Sony Wide/Telephoto lenses, ND filter, polarizer (dont ask why I bought both), 10/20watt light, 2 91-D 6 hour batteries (that videolight DRAINS and the HC1 is terrible in low light)
-Rode VideoMic.
-HC1-PROAT & Bescor VB-50 from DM-Accessories (to combat the fact that my camera is bottom loading and has NO cold shoe adapter-ridiculous!)

Also Eric & Armin, your Merlin/Glidecam footage is INCREDIBLE. And I am tired of how immobile a tripod is @ times so I am going to likely pick up a Merlin b4 my next wedding shoot. But that also means that I'll need to pick up the AIS-FLAT from DM-Accessories so that I can mount the Rode Mic directly to my camera to aid in balancing.

Mike I also agree with the poor cuts and just simply using fade to blacks. But I had realized this after I sent my demo to the potential client (just got the booking), but was too lazy/busy to make the fixes @ the time. Furthermore, for this sloppy demo, it didn't even occur to me to try to tell a story, I just picked a couple nice moments and shots, and just randomly threw them together. However when I get my website up and compile my real demo reel (including footage from a a few weddings I havent even cracked open yet) I will definately remember your advice!

Ken, i'm using Premier Pro 2.0. I got used to using FCP @ school for a few years, but I am a programmer during the day & am just tooo entrenched into PC to make the switch yet. So Premier Pro 2.0 it is for now, as I find it to be the closest thing to FCP on PC.

Finally Peter, nope I wish it was Sydney, I am in Toronto Canada, where all the locations you see are, but I would LOVE to shoot in Sydney one day! I've PM'd you my email address nonetheless.

Again, THANKS for the comments and criticisms, as no doubt they are invaluable to this never ending process.

Michael.

Ps Eric i showed your highlight reel to some collegues and they were very IMPRESSED.

Eric Gan · August 28th, 2006, 08:39 PM

Michael,

Nice choice with the 503 head. I think it's an excellent performer for its price. I was shooting a concert last night with someone's else's 501 head and I can definitely feel a difference compared to the 503. We also had an HC1 as a 3rd cam, and yeah, I would say low-light isn't one of its strengths.

I'm surprised at the prices of the new Canon HDV cams. It's quite a big jump up from the GL2. Seems to me like they've left a gap there, which means there's nothing on the horizon to directly compete with the FX1. But who knows, products are coming out so fast these days...

Did you shoot 16mm in film school? If so, where did you go? Or did you mean you shot 16mm at that wedding? That would be high-end! I was in Toronto in June working on an indie feature. Fun city...definitely more alive than Vancouver. I went to film school for the last couple of years in Sydney, Australia, and I'm not sure if I can survive this upcoming Canadian winter. Which leads me to this question - do people get married in Toronto in the winter? Is that even possible in minus 30 degree weather?

Peter, I wish I'd met you when I was down in Sydney. I was shooting weddings on the side while going to film school. I really miss that city.

Man, I need to move down to California soon!

Peter Jefferson · August 28th, 2006, 10:17 PM

"I plan on getting a Z1/FX1 or one of the new Canon HDV cameras next year depending on the number of bookings I get for the upcoming season, in addition to purchasing a RedRock M2 adapter+supports rods etc. for my own personal film projects, so the 503 was a fair futureproof solution."

IMO, i would hold back until you can get 2 Canon A1's (not the sony A1) if you can... having 2 iedntical cameras makes a HUGE difference.. trust me on that..

Michael Y Wong · September 4th, 2006, 11:57 PM

Hi Eric,

Yeap HC1 is crap in lowlight, but with enough light I believe it still provides excellent picture quality/price, not to mention the fact that its size makes it the most mobile and easiest to 'throw around' and experiment (ordering the Merlin this week!)

I never shot 16mm film weddings, I can't even see how that would be even physciallly possible, but i guess if there was enough manpower (ie. $$$) it could be pulled off. On a funny note, I was on a diff video forum and once read about a guy suggesting using hte hvx200+redrock m2+35mm lenses for a wedding, i thought it was very silly and incredibly impractical!

I went to Ryerson University for film school part time for 2 years while working full time as a Programmer. It was busy but for fun, I'd throw in acting classes here and there @ York university to better myself as an 'aspiring' filmmaker, in addition to some professional (and COSTLY) cinematogrpahy courses/workshops on weekends.

It's funny how u say Toronto is more fun then Van, here I always hear the reverse! And yes people do get married during the winter (mostly to save money of cousre) and indeed I've been to a friends wedding during hte winter and let me tell you it was ridiculously cold...

As for Cali I'm going to Arizona in Feb for a freinds beach wedding!!! I can't wait and definatley can't wait to shoot beautiful footage there. I'll be making the drive to Santa Barbara too and visit good 'ol hollywood along the way.

Peter/Eric, as of right now my eye is set on the XH-A1, hte Z1 if the XH-A1 is a poor low light performer. Both cameras fall into my price range (the hvx200, XL-H1 are wayyyy out of my range) and @ my stage, that is pretty much the main deciding factor. But Eric you say the A1 is not a direct competitor to the FX1? I quickly skimmed the specs and thougth that it was.

Anyways I had to re-upload my shard demos for another client, and for some reason I can't seem to edit my original post, so I figure I'll put them up one last time.

720p hd version with fake 24p (ull notice the jerkiness)
https://wa-01.yousendit.com/login.ph...4FA73C09DE63DF

heavily downconverted sd version in smooth 30p
http://wa-01.yousendit.com/transfer....uyin@yahoo.com

username: myauyin@yahoo.com
password: videoenabled

Bill Rankin · September 5th, 2006, 05:30 AM

When I try to view it, I get a an "invalid login" using your email address and "videoenabled" or "/videoenabled"

NEVERMIND...works now....

Peter Jefferson · September 5th, 2006, 07:19 AM

Peter/Eric, as of right now my eye is set on the XH-A1,

((good boy... ))

hte Z1 if the XH-A1 is a poor low light performer.

((yup))

Both cameras fall into my price range (the hvx200, XL-H1 are wayyyy out of my range)
((the HVX is a totally different kettle of fish and shooting weddings would actaully be incredibel with this comaera consideirng the frame rate and codec. IMO DVCProHD poos on HDV... also the camera (IMO) has the widest DR of the bunch with a richer colour gradation which is more from the codec than the camera's CCD. BUT alas, the format and P2 ssytem is nto designed for longform.. ))

and @ my stage, that is pretty much the main deciding factor. But Eric you say the A1 is not a direct competitor to the FX1? I quickly skimmed the specs and thougth that it was.

((The Canon A1, is a direct comeptitor to teh Z1... due to the pr grade configuration of audio, XLRs etc etc. IMO, i think it will be the most intense bang for teh buck HDV cam on the market. With a 20x optical zoom, and 24/25f frame, plus teh canon Digic2 processors, it will be a tough nut to beat.. pity the recording format sux so bad...

August 23rd, 2006, 05:22 PM	#1
Michael Y Wong Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Toronto Ontario Canada! Posts: 353	My First Wedding Video Demo Hello Guys I'm new on this forum, but it definately seems to be the place to be. Anyways, having attended film school & realizing that most of my friends and people approximately my age are getting married, I decided to give the wedding videography business a try. I put up a QUICK & SLOPPY wedding video demo quickly together as some prospective clients have been asking. You should use the latest version of windows media player to view this. 720p hd version with fake 24p (ull notice the jerkiness) http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.ph...3E6C8761D43FAA heavily downconverted sd version in smooth 30p http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.ph...in@hotmail.com if u dont have a yousendit account and/or too lazy to do so just use mine myauyin@yahoo.com/videoenabled are the login credentials. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Thank you! Michael Last edited by Michael Y Wong; August 24th, 2006 at 03:03 PM.

August 23rd, 2006, 11:09 PM	#4
Terry Esslinger Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sacramento, Elk Grove. Calif Posts: 306	Video has some great ideas and shots But... * Did not play well on my computer -jerky and many blurred shots * Sound seemed overdriven and distorted HD camera? __________________ Puttin the wet stuff on the red stuff!

August 25th, 2006, 01:09 PM	#8
Ken Diewert Trustee Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Vancouver Island, Canada Posts: 1,200	Michael, I don't normally venture into this forum because I vowed never to do another wedding video, but it turns out my wife signed me up for a family wedding next week in Calgary, so I came over to see what's going on. I thought you're demo was very cool especially for 'quick & sloppy'. There's a couple of really great shots and a couple of scenes that I'd delete. I like the use of the slo-mo, which NLE are you using? All in all, nice job. Good Luck __________________ C100, 5DMk2, FCPX

September 4th, 2006, 11:57 PM	#13
Michael Y Wong Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Toronto Ontario Canada! Posts: 353	Hi Eric, Yeap HC1 is crap in lowlight, but with enough light I believe it still provides excellent picture quality/price, not to mention the fact that its size makes it the most mobile and easiest to 'throw around' and experiment (ordering the Merlin this week!) I never shot 16mm film weddings, I can't even see how that would be even physciallly possible, but i guess if there was enough manpower (ie. $$$) it could be pulled off. On a funny note, I was on a diff video forum and once read about a guy suggesting using hte hvx200+redrock m2+35mm lenses for a wedding, i thought it was very silly and incredibly impractical! I went to Ryerson University for film school part time for 2 years while working full time as a Programmer. It was busy but for fun, I'd throw in acting classes here and there @ York university to better myself as an 'aspiring' filmmaker, in addition to some professional (and COSTLY) cinematogrpahy courses/workshops on weekends. It's funny how u say Toronto is more fun then Van, here I always hear the reverse! And yes people do get married during the winter (mostly to save money of cousre) and indeed I've been to a friends wedding during hte winter and let me tell you it was ridiculously cold... As for Cali I'm going to Arizona in Feb for a freinds beach wedding!!! I can't wait and definatley can't wait to shoot beautiful footage there. I'll be making the drive to Santa Barbara too and visit good 'ol hollywood along the way. Peter/Eric, as of right now my eye is set on the XH-A1, hte Z1 if the XH-A1 is a poor low light performer. Both cameras fall into my price range (the hvx200, XL-H1 are wayyyy out of my range) and @ my stage, that is pretty much the main deciding factor. But Eric you say the A1 is not a direct competitor to the FX1? I quickly skimmed the specs and thougth that it was. Anyways I had to re-upload my shard demos for another client, and for some reason I can't seem to edit my original post, so I figure I'll put them up one last time. 720p hd version with fake 24p (ull notice the jerkiness) https://wa-01.yousendit.com/login.ph...4FA73C09DE63DF heavily downconverted sd version in smooth 30p http://wa-01.yousendit.com/transfer....uyin@yahoo.com username: myauyin@yahoo.com password: videoenabled __________________ dreaming hobbyist + storyteller www.michaelywong.com

September 5th, 2006, 05:30 AM	#14
Bill Rankin Major Player Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 433	invalid login When I try to view it, I get a an "invalid login" using your email address and "videoenabled" or "/videoenabled" NEVERMIND...works now.... __________________ Bill Rankin

August 23rd, 2006, 05:36 PM	#2
Mike F Smith Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 156	File would not play on my computer. Just got herky jerkey still images. Mike

August 23rd, 2006, 06:24 PM	#3
Armin DeFiesta Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bowie, MD Posts: 74	Looks great! Good luck with your work.

August 24th, 2006, 04:45 PM	#6
Eric Gan Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 187	Michael, I enjoyed that very much. It's an excellent demo video. Most of the scenes had great colors, and you have a good eye for framing. Also, good use of shallow depth-of-field in various shots. I'll give some constructive criticism, but take it for what it's worth because I'm also just starting out. It looks like you can benefit from a better fluid tripod head. What are you currently using? Some of the starts and stops were a little too abrupt. For example, there is one brief shot at 1:41 where the camera jerks on the movement. I would suggest taking this shot out of the demo completely as one of the things that I expect a potential client to look for is smoothness of camera motion. I'm a bit puzzled here because some of your other pans/tilts were very smooth. Perhaps just a little bit more practice is needed when shooting on longer focal lengths? At 1:17, you lost focus on the couple walking down the aisle. I would try to avoid this shot in the demo as well. An out-of-focus shot is the one enemy that we cannot fix in post. Other than that, everything looks very professional. The good looking brides and bridesmaids always help a demo video! The dancing couple cracks me up. Well done, and I wish you the best in your business. Eric p.s. What camera are you using?

August 24th, 2006, 07:18 PM	#7
Mike F Smith Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 156	You have some really good shots, your skill shows there. I don't think every transition being a fade to black is a good way to tell this couples story however. that really breaks the flow for me. There are times when you pan the subject and when you get to their head you make the cut too soon. If you are going to pan a human when you get to the face I need to see it some. It's good solid work but the cuts need some fixing. Mike

August 27th, 2006, 09:45 PM	#9
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	i noticed this was in sydney???? im looking for skilled shooter/editors.. drop me ur email, n ill get back 2u....

August 28th, 2006, 03:49 PM	#10
Michael Y Wong Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Toronto Ontario Canada! Posts: 353	Hi guys, thanks for the constructive criticisms, I will answer your questions to the best I can. Eric, the shaky shots in the wedding you are refering to was when I was using a Manfrotto 745B+701RC2 setup. Ive used 501/503s with heavier Arri 16mm cameras but for that specific wedding, I just borrowed the 745B+701RC2 from school the day before and for the first time used a fluid head setup with my camera. It was pretty simple to use, but it did take time to get better with it. I can't recall if i had a telephoto lens on for that shot but I probably did, which would further explain the jerk motion. I also do agree that out of focus is bad, but in my personal preference only, it does appear more filmic/magical @ times to have the subject out of focus, but it is situational. However, i 100% understand what you are saying. Since that wedding I've purchased the 755B+501 (the shots at the really nice park are all 501), but having used it once, I immediately returned it and purchased the 503 instead. I plan on getting a Z1/FX1 or one of the new Canon HDV cameras next year depending on the number of bookings I get for the upcoming season, in addition to purchasing a RedRock M2 adapter+supports rods etc. for my own personal film projects, so the 503 was a fair futureproof solution. This year, I've shot everything using the little bro of your FX1, the HC1. My setup currently includes: -Sony Wide/Telephoto lenses, ND filter, polarizer (dont ask why I bought both), 10/20watt light, 2 91-D 6 hour batteries (that videolight DRAINS and the HC1 is terrible in low light) -Rode VideoMic. -HC1-PROAT & Bescor VB-50 from DM-Accessories (to combat the fact that my camera is bottom loading and has NO cold shoe adapter-ridiculous!) Also Eric & Armin, your Merlin/Glidecam footage is INCREDIBLE. And I am tired of how immobile a tripod is @ times so I am going to likely pick up a Merlin b4 my next wedding shoot. But that also means that I'll need to pick up the AIS-FLAT from DM-Accessories so that I can mount the Rode Mic directly to my camera to aid in balancing. Mike I also agree with the poor cuts and just simply using fade to blacks. But I had realized this after I sent my demo to the potential client (just got the booking), but was too lazy/busy to make the fixes @ the time. Furthermore, for this sloppy demo, it didn't even occur to me to try to tell a story, I just picked a couple nice moments and shots, and just randomly threw them together. However when I get my website up and compile my real demo reel (including footage from a a few weddings I havent even cracked open yet) I will definately remember your advice! Ken, i'm using Premier Pro 2.0. I got used to using FCP @ school for a few years, but I am a programmer during the day & am just tooo entrenched into PC to make the switch yet. So Premier Pro 2.0 it is for now, as I find it to be the closest thing to FCP on PC. Finally Peter, nope I wish it was Sydney, I am in Toronto Canada, where all the locations you see are, but I would LOVE to shoot in Sydney one day! I've PM'd you my email address nonetheless. Again, THANKS for the comments and criticisms, as no doubt they are invaluable to this never ending process. Michael. Ps Eric i showed your highlight reel to some collegues and they were very IMPRESSED.

August 28th, 2006, 08:39 PM	#11
Eric Gan Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 187	Michael, Nice choice with the 503 head. I think it's an excellent performer for its price. I was shooting a concert last night with someone's else's 501 head and I can definitely feel a difference compared to the 503. We also had an HC1 as a 3rd cam, and yeah, I would say low-light isn't one of its strengths. I'm surprised at the prices of the new Canon HDV cams. It's quite a big jump up from the GL2. Seems to me like they've left a gap there, which means there's nothing on the horizon to directly compete with the FX1. But who knows, products are coming out so fast these days... Did you shoot 16mm in film school? If so, where did you go? Or did you mean you shot 16mm at that wedding? That would be high-end! I was in Toronto in June working on an indie feature. Fun city...definitely more alive than Vancouver. I went to film school for the last couple of years in Sydney, Australia, and I'm not sure if I can survive this upcoming Canadian winter. Which leads me to this question - do people get married in Toronto in the winter? Is that even possible in minus 30 degree weather? Peter, I wish I'd met you when I was down in Sydney. I was shooting weddings on the side while going to film school. I really miss that city. Man, I need to move down to California soon!

August 28th, 2006, 10:17 PM	#12
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	"I plan on getting a Z1/FX1 or one of the new Canon HDV cameras next year depending on the number of bookings I get for the upcoming season, in addition to purchasing a RedRock M2 adapter+supports rods etc. for my own personal film projects, so the 503 was a fair futureproof solution." IMO, i would hold back until you can get 2 Canon A1's (not the sony A1) if you can... having 2 iedntical cameras makes a HUGE difference.. trust me on that..

September 5th, 2006, 07:19 AM	#15
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Peter/Eric, as of right now my eye is set on the XH-A1, ((good boy... )) hte Z1 if the XH-A1 is a poor low light performer. ((yup)) Both cameras fall into my price range (the hvx200, XL-H1 are wayyyy out of my range) ((the HVX is a totally different kettle of fish and shooting weddings would actaully be incredibel with this comaera consideirng the frame rate and codec. IMO DVCProHD poos on HDV... also the camera (IMO) has the widest DR of the bunch with a richer colour gradation which is more from the codec than the camera's CCD. BUT alas, the format and P2 ssytem is nto designed for longform.. )) and @ my stage, that is pretty much the main deciding factor. But Eric you say the A1 is not a direct competitor to the FX1? I quickly skimmed the specs and thougth that it was. ((The Canon A1, is a direct comeptitor to teh Z1... due to the pr grade configuration of audio, XLRs etc etc. IMO, i think it will be the most intense bang for teh buck HDV cam on the market. With a 20x optical zoom, and 24/25f frame, plus teh canon Digic2 processors, it will be a tough nut to beat.. pity the recording format sux so bad...