Recommend A Good Projector? at DVinfo.net

Chris Dumlao · June 18th, 2006, 10:16 PM

I'm planning on buying a projector but I have no idea which one is good to get. I'll be using it for weddings, when showing montages and video presentations. I figure a 2500 lumen projector should work just fine.

But, is there anything else I should look for? And is there one brand that is better than the other?

I appreciate any advice.

David Avedikian · June 18th, 2006, 11:06 PM

As with anything, it depends on how much you want to spend. You should be able to get a quality 2500 lumens projector between $1300 and $1600. I wouldn't go below that unless you cut it to 2000 lumens (which wouldn't be bad). The brands I recommend are Sharp and NEC. They may cost a little more then some, but they are work horses. Don't buy a consumer model, go to the web site and look for a "classroom" or "conference" type.

The next main thing to decide is whether you want to go with an LCD or DLP projector. DLPs are superior to LCDs in all ways but 1, they do not represent accurate colors like an LCD. Your yellows mainly will be off. Now, if you want to spend $25,000 and get a 3-chip DLP, then you can get your colors back, but a 1-chip is probably what you are looking for. A DLP will smoke an LCD in terms of heat, cleaning, lamp life, and quality image. Most manufaturers only keep an LCD model in their line up to deal with those needing exact colors. One option on a DLP to get correct color is to run it in svga mode which will cut your brightness in half. Not a good idea.

Other than that, there really isn't much discrepancy in features. Mainly you get into how many and what type of connections there are. For weddings, you'll just need a db-15 and RCA video in. Most have audio in if you want to do that, but it's not recommended either unless you are in a small room.

Hope that helps.

Peter Jefferson · June 19th, 2006, 12:12 AM

I dunno where u got ur infor for projectors David, but i beg to differ...

DLPs are notorious for colour shifting, slow latency, fluctuating luminance, not to mention the fact that its a colour wheel which, on fast motion, one can actually see the colour shifting, and to some, is headache inducing... then there is the issue of colour itself..
Dont get me wrong, they have their uses, but DLP will never compare to a high end LCD projector.

If u want an example of what im talking about, just put a Panasonic AE700 or an AE900 side by side to a high end DLP (such as a BenQ which is almost twice the price) and you WILL notice the difference in image quality...
The Panas wipe the floor with them

David Avedikian · June 19th, 2006, 06:46 AM

I consult and purchase projectors for a major corporation here in the US. I have gone through several standard projectors to find the right one. I also just retuned from InfoComm in Orlando, which is the largest AV show, and witnessed myself the differences that I mentioned.

Now, if you want to comapare specific models, that's another question entirely. But the DLPs overall are better projectors.

Peter Jefferson · June 19th, 2006, 07:26 AM

i guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder ... lets agree to disagree, as i supply this stuff to fellow professionals and studios, so exposure to this gear on a day by day basis is required considering i have to make a living from it.. lol
Im sure we'd be arguing till our faces go blue about which is better in what areas.. lol

Each have their merits, each have their limitations. however the only true way to know what is right for you is go out and see for oneself. Bear in mind that some units are not configured correctly, or may just be running default settings. In the case of Panasonic 700/900's and hi end Sony LCD's, calibrating black is recomended, in the case of DLP's, again, colour shifting needs to be considered so ensuring that u get ur hands on the remote and have a chance to tweak, then you'll know what the unit can and cant do.
However most stores have no clue about what theyre selling and they will tell you thinkg they think u want to hear. In addition to this, some stores have ties with certain companies, so be aware that some image devices may be deliberately dumbed down to look dull to sell a surplus of the opposing device

David Avedikian · June 19th, 2006, 11:18 AM

Peter's right. Do some research. Talk to the manufacturers. It probably shouldn't be this dfficult and you'll have likes and dislikes no matter what brand or model you get. There are thousands out there. For me, my recommendation would be the Sharp P-MB55X (2500 lumen) or the NEC LT35 (3000 lumen).

Glenn Davidson · June 20th, 2006, 02:02 AM

I am also in the market for a LCD or DLP projector for legal seminars. I looked at the specs and reviews of the NEC LT35 that David recomends and am pretty impressed. I am concerned about the "rainbow" effect that DLP projectors produce. I am now thinking that maybe I should go with LCD. Has anyone had any experience with this effect and should it be a factor in purchasing?

Peter Jefferson · June 20th, 2006, 04:24 AM

Glenn, this "rainbow" effect is typical of 3gun and DLP units, as well as the old colourwheel rear pro tvs of yesteryear.

for corp, if your actually shooting the seminar, AND wanting to shoot the screen as its in use, then youll need to set up a syncro scan of ur camera to the projector, else u might get a horizontal rolling (much like filming a TV) some of the newer faster units dont have this, but most do.

Also bear in mind that during a seminar, your running under fluoro or par can tungsten lights, so this too will affect teh image.

Ive never had a problem using my ae700 in any given lighting situation, save from direct light on the screen. In many cases, im hiring out my filming and projection services as one package to 2/3rds of my corp clients

Joel Peregrine · June 20th, 2006, 03:01 PM

Hi Peter,

Just a personal experience: Just this past Saturday I produced a same-day edit that was shown in a theater built in 1927, which was where the reception was held.

http://orpheumtheatre.net/photos.html

I knew it was going to be projected on to the main screen and was worried that the SD footage wouldn't hold up. Was I wrong. It was amazing. Stunning actually. Clear, sharp, vibrant and huge. All from the composite out of a VX2000. I can't imagine what it would have looked like with a higher res source and a better data path. The A/V personnel handling the booth didn't know the model number of the projector (it was bolted to the underside of the mezzanine level), only that it was a Panasonic LCD and cost a bundle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

I dunno where u got ur infor for projectors David, but i beg to differ...

DLPs are notorious for colour shifting, slow latency, fluctuating luminance, not to mention the fact that its a colour wheel which, on fast motion, one can actually see the colour shifting, and to some, is headache inducing... then there is the issue of colour itself..
Dont get me wrong, they have their uses, but DLP will never compare to a high end LCD projector.

If u want an example of what im talking about, just put a Panasonic AE700 or an AE900 side by side to a high end DLP (such as a BenQ which is almost twice the price) and you WILL notice the difference in image quality...
The Panas wipe the floor with them

Chris Dumlao · June 22nd, 2006, 02:25 AM

Thanks Peter and David for your input. I will take both of your advice in to consideration. The set up I wanted was something that is low maintenance, can be easily set up and broken down quickly, and have excellent picture quality. I'm definitely concerned about the color-shifting on the DLPs.

Until now, I have been renting a projector from a local Audio/Video rental place, and I have always used their Christie LX25 (XGA 2500 Lumen LCD). And I have always been happy with it's results. Unfortunately, this model has been discontinued, so I need to find one that is at least comparable to it.

I'll do some more research on the Sharp, NEC, and Panasonic models. Thanks again!

Ray Saavedra · June 22nd, 2006, 03:48 AM

Chris, I'm also in the market for a projector. I'm looking at this right now since it's so portable, http://www.projectorcentral.com/viewsonic_pj458d.htm. But I don't know if anyone has use this before.

JR

Steven Davis · June 22nd, 2006, 06:27 AM

Here's what I did a couple of years ago, First I did some research on brand names. There are sites that do testing. I then contacted a couple of reputable dealers with a couple of choices that each dealer carried. Eventually through talking with them, we narrowed it down to a projector made by Mitsubichi, Mitsubishi, or how ever you spell it. Since we bought the projector for a specific purpose, the A,B,C's of what it could do were very specific.

And here's the other thing I learned, if you pit two dealers against each other, you may save some money. I like to call it, 'capatalistic wrestling.'

Waldemar Winkler · June 23rd, 2006, 05:10 PM

Well, here is my two cents:

I spent 25 years as an audio visual technician in the meetings and convention industry. Half of that time dealt with video projectors from CRT to LCD and DLP. I even knew about DLP two years before they were released because I managed media support for a Texas Instruments r&d conference which discussed that particular subject.

My advice would to first determine the screen size you expect to use the most. I've chosen the 6' x 8' because it fits so many different venues, takes up little floor space, and still presents a good sized image. Because any projected video image will have the same resolution regardless of screen size you need to find the best product for the screen sixe you expect to use the most.

Next, you must recognize the liabilities of LCD VS DLP. Very generally speaking LCD's will handle the subtle shifts in luminance, i.e., greyscale, better than DLP, but DLP will be both brighter and handle contrast better than LCD.

Then, consider the number of hours you expect your projector will be on. Both LCD and DLP projectors, in my opinion of experience, will slowly lose their ability to reproduce color accurately because of the fading of the internal imaging panels due to the high heat produced by the internal lamps. Most projector lamps are rated for a live of about 1000 hours, and significant loss of color begins to be apparent around 600 - 650 hours. My Epson Model 50 (something) has been in service for four years and is just beginning to approach 450 hours. It produces 1200 lumens with a native resolution of 800 x 600. It continues to project an OK image as it's native resolution is just above that of SD video (720x480). I feel the projector will become obsolete well before the color begins to significantly shift towars the unacceptable.

Lastly, how you transfer the video signal to the projector is the most important element. You want to send the best quality signal to the projector. Keep the primary colors on separate cables. Keeping signal information separated until combined internally in the monitor/projector is the best apporach. An RCA composite video cable bundles all signal information onto one cable. Great opportunities for crosstalk and muddying the image. S-Video, also known as Y/C, separates color from luminance (brightness). A significant improvement. The best connection is RGB, Horizontal & Vertical Sync. 5 separate cables. The latest entry of possibility is "progressive, YUV, P..something or other". (Hey, I'm semi retired, so keeping up isn't as important as it once used to be for me). The progressive connection is a separating essential signals on separate cables until the last possible moment. It is a prominent feature of most new TV's and DVD players, and the is the vehicle most responsible for image clarity.

One thing a lot of people miss is that the 15 pin VGA connection is essentially a RGB/horizontal-Vertical sync connection. It is not interlaced, but...it could be the kick in the pants your projector needs.

www.cablesforless.com sells RGB/RCA progressive to VGA connectors for way cheap...anf could be your magic bullet.

Make no mistake, DLP technology will always produce a brighter, crisper image. But is it the right one? The critical viewer (you) may or may not see the difference. The LCD technology is also astoundingly good.

Considering your audience, whatever makes the best sense to your particular presentation standards will work.

Differences in my expressed opinions are cordially invited to post. I know lot, but I am no expert. And I love to learn.

June 18th, 2006, 10:16 PM	#1
Chris Dumlao New Boot Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 7	Recommend A Good Projector? I'm planning on buying a projector but I have no idea which one is good to get. I'll be using it for weddings, when showing montages and video presentations. I figure a 2500 lumen projector should work just fine. But, is there anything else I should look for? And is there one brand that is better than the other? I appreciate any advice.

June 22nd, 2006, 03:48 AM	#11
Ray Saavedra Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: San Francisco Posts: 127	Chris, I'm also in the market for a projector. I'm looking at this right now since it's so portable, http://www.projectorcentral.com/viewsonic_pj458d.htm. But I don't know if anyone has use this before. JR __________________ junray@yahoo.com

June 22nd, 2006, 06:27 AM	#12
Steven Davis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 3,065	Here's what I did a couple of years ago, First I did some research on brand names. There are sites that do testing. I then contacted a couple of reputable dealers with a couple of choices that each dealer carried. Eventually through talking with them, we narrowed it down to a projector made by Mitsubichi, Mitsubishi, or how ever you spell it. Since we bought the projector for a specific purpose, the A,B,C's of what it could do were very specific. And here's the other thing I learned, if you pit two dealers against each other, you may save some money. I like to call it, 'capatalistic wrestling.' __________________ What happens if I push the 'Red' button?

June 23rd, 2006, 05:10 PM	#13
Waldemar Winkler Major Player Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Durango, Colorado, USA Posts: 711	Well, here is my two cents: I spent 25 years as an audio visual technician in the meetings and convention industry. Half of that time dealt with video projectors from CRT to LCD and DLP. I even knew about DLP two years before they were released because I managed media support for a Texas Instruments r&d conference which discussed that particular subject. My advice would to first determine the screen size you expect to use the most. I've chosen the 6' x 8' because it fits so many different venues, takes up little floor space, and still presents a good sized image. Because any projected video image will have the same resolution regardless of screen size you need to find the best product for the screen sixe you expect to use the most. Next, you must recognize the liabilities of LCD VS DLP. Very generally speaking LCD's will handle the subtle shifts in luminance, i.e., greyscale, better than DLP, but DLP will be both brighter and handle contrast better than LCD. Then, consider the number of hours you expect your projector will be on. Both LCD and DLP projectors, in my opinion of experience, will slowly lose their ability to reproduce color accurately because of the fading of the internal imaging panels due to the high heat produced by the internal lamps. Most projector lamps are rated for a live of about 1000 hours, and significant loss of color begins to be apparent around 600 - 650 hours. My Epson Model 50 (something) has been in service for four years and is just beginning to approach 450 hours. It produces 1200 lumens with a native resolution of 800 x 600. It continues to project an OK image as it's native resolution is just above that of SD video (720x480). I feel the projector will become obsolete well before the color begins to significantly shift towars the unacceptable. Lastly, how you transfer the video signal to the projector is the most important element. You want to send the best quality signal to the projector. Keep the primary colors on separate cables. Keeping signal information separated until combined internally in the monitor/projector is the best apporach. An RCA composite video cable bundles all signal information onto one cable. Great opportunities for crosstalk and muddying the image. S-Video, also known as Y/C, separates color from luminance (brightness). A significant improvement. The best connection is RGB, Horizontal & Vertical Sync. 5 separate cables. The latest entry of possibility is "progressive, YUV, P..something or other". (Hey, I'm semi retired, so keeping up isn't as important as it once used to be for me). The progressive connection is a separating essential signals on separate cables until the last possible moment. It is a prominent feature of most new TV's and DVD players, and the is the vehicle most responsible for image clarity. One thing a lot of people miss is that the 15 pin VGA connection is essentially a RGB/horizontal-Vertical sync connection. It is not interlaced, but...it could be the kick in the pants your projector needs. www.cablesforless.com sells RGB/RCA progressive to VGA connectors for way cheap...anf could be your magic bullet. Make no mistake, DLP technology will always produce a brighter, crisper image. But is it the right one? The critical viewer (you) may or may not see the difference. The LCD technology is also astoundingly good. Considering your audience, whatever makes the best sense to your particular presentation standards will work. Differences in my expressed opinions are cordially invited to post. I know lot, but I am no expert. And I love to learn. __________________ Waldemar

June 18th, 2006, 11:06 PM	#2
David Avedikian Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 35	As with anything, it depends on how much you want to spend. You should be able to get a quality 2500 lumens projector between $1300 and $1600. I wouldn't go below that unless you cut it to 2000 lumens (which wouldn't be bad). The brands I recommend are Sharp and NEC. They may cost a little more then some, but they are work horses. Don't buy a consumer model, go to the web site and look for a "classroom" or "conference" type. The next main thing to decide is whether you want to go with an LCD or DLP projector. DLPs are superior to LCDs in all ways but 1, they do not represent accurate colors like an LCD. Your yellows mainly will be off. Now, if you want to spend $25,000 and get a 3-chip DLP, then you can get your colors back, but a 1-chip is probably what you are looking for. A DLP will smoke an LCD in terms of heat, cleaning, lamp life, and quality image. Most manufaturers only keep an LCD model in their line up to deal with those needing exact colors. One option on a DLP to get correct color is to run it in svga mode which will cut your brightness in half. Not a good idea. Other than that, there really isn't much discrepancy in features. Mainly you get into how many and what type of connections there are. For weddings, you'll just need a db-15 and RCA video in. Most have audio in if you want to do that, but it's not recommended either unless you are in a small room. Hope that helps.

June 19th, 2006, 12:12 AM	#3
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	I dunno where u got ur infor for projectors David, but i beg to differ... DLPs are notorious for colour shifting, slow latency, fluctuating luminance, not to mention the fact that its a colour wheel which, on fast motion, one can actually see the colour shifting, and to some, is headache inducing... then there is the issue of colour itself.. Dont get me wrong, they have their uses, but DLP will never compare to a high end LCD projector. If u want an example of what im talking about, just put a Panasonic AE700 or an AE900 side by side to a high end DLP (such as a BenQ which is almost twice the price) and you WILL notice the difference in image quality... The Panas wipe the floor with them

June 19th, 2006, 06:46 AM	#4
David Avedikian Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 35	I consult and purchase projectors for a major corporation here in the US. I have gone through several standard projectors to find the right one. I also just retuned from InfoComm in Orlando, which is the largest AV show, and witnessed myself the differences that I mentioned. Now, if you want to comapare specific models, that's another question entirely. But the DLPs overall are better projectors.

June 19th, 2006, 07:26 AM	#5
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	i guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder ... lets agree to disagree, as i supply this stuff to fellow professionals and studios, so exposure to this gear on a day by day basis is required considering i have to make a living from it.. lol Im sure we'd be arguing till our faces go blue about which is better in what areas.. lol Each have their merits, each have their limitations. however the only true way to know what is right for you is go out and see for oneself. Bear in mind that some units are not configured correctly, or may just be running default settings. In the case of Panasonic 700/900's and hi end Sony LCD's, calibrating black is recomended, in the case of DLP's, again, colour shifting needs to be considered so ensuring that u get ur hands on the remote and have a chance to tweak, then you'll know what the unit can and cant do. However most stores have no clue about what theyre selling and they will tell you thinkg they think u want to hear. In addition to this, some stores have ties with certain companies, so be aware that some image devices may be deliberately dumbed down to look dull to sell a surplus of the opposing device

June 19th, 2006, 11:18 AM	#6
David Avedikian Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 35	Peter's right. Do some research. Talk to the manufacturers. It probably shouldn't be this dfficult and you'll have likes and dislikes no matter what brand or model you get. There are thousands out there. For me, my recommendation would be the Sharp P-MB55X (2500 lumen) or the NEC LT35 (3000 lumen).

June 20th, 2006, 02:02 AM	#7
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	I am also in the market for a LCD or DLP projector for legal seminars. I looked at the specs and reviews of the NEC LT35 that David recomends and am pretty impressed. I am concerned about the "rainbow" effect that DLP projectors produce. I am now thinking that maybe I should go with LCD. Has anyone had any experience with this effect and should it be a factor in purchasing?

June 20th, 2006, 04:24 AM	#8
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Glenn, this "rainbow" effect is typical of 3gun and DLP units, as well as the old colourwheel rear pro tvs of yesteryear. for corp, if your actually shooting the seminar, AND wanting to shoot the screen as its in use, then youll need to set up a syncro scan of ur camera to the projector, else u might get a horizontal rolling (much like filming a TV) some of the newer faster units dont have this, but most do. Also bear in mind that during a seminar, your running under fluoro or par can tungsten lights, so this too will affect teh image. Ive never had a problem using my ae700 in any given lighting situation, save from direct light on the screen. In many cases, im hiring out my filming and projection services as one package to 2/3rds of my corp clients

June 22nd, 2006, 02:25 AM	#10
Chris Dumlao New Boot Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 7	Thanks Peter and David for your input. I will take both of your advice in to consideration. The set up I wanted was something that is low maintenance, can be easily set up and broken down quickly, and have excellent picture quality. I'm definitely concerned about the color-shifting on the DLPs. Until now, I have been renting a projector from a local Audio/Video rental place, and I have always used their Christie LX25 (XGA 2500 Lumen LCD). And I have always been happy with it's results. Unfortunately, this model has been discontinued, so I need to find one that is at least comparable to it. I'll do some more research on the Sharp, NEC, and Panasonic models. Thanks again!