Need some opinions at DVinfo.net

Andrew Khalil · December 22nd, 2005, 11:49 PM

Hi everyone,
I just finished shooting a Christmas production and editing has been going really well (gotta love FCP's Multicam capabilities:))
Now, during the scene changes, there is obviously a blackout along with the orchestra playing some music. I didn't have access to enough cameras to aim them at the orchestra which was is sort of oddly positioned at the far right of the auditorium. I also felt they would look out of place in the video because they aren't really related to the story, which I guess is the case for most productions anyway, but now I have sections of black, sometimes over a minute in length.
So, in your opinions, should I just let the music play with a black screen for around a minute, or should I do something else with the situation? I'm just wondering how to make it more interesting and wishing that I could have gotten two more cameras for the orchestra.
What do you guys think?

Matt Trubac · December 23rd, 2005, 01:11 AM

I have always omitted the scene changes and associated orchestral segues.

My viewpoint is, yes the orchestra was part of the show, but the music in between scenes suits the live performance, but not a screen version. It is there to help the audience pass time while scenes are changed, keep the energy from the previous scene, or I guess set up the next scene, but usually the video does better without it (in my opinion). A black screen will bore your viewer very quickly. Sorry if I'm rambling... I am going on day 2 of no sleep.

Happy Holidays,
Matt

Peter Jefferson · December 23rd, 2005, 04:36 AM

Andrew, ask the client what they want..
when i get this happening (quite often..) i usually ask before i shoot what they want me to do in this situation..

most of the time they let me use my discretion so i just cut it, but other times when theyre specific about it, i use some titling and create a brief intermission. This is where i get the artwork from the production and some credits and throw those on like a cinema ad while the music plays..

its tedious and boring but it pays the bills.. .

Steve House · December 23rd, 2005, 08:20 AM

I'd go with Matt and suggest replacing the scene changes with a brief dip to black, maybe with an "Act 2" title card overlay as you come up out of black, and cut the music.

Bob Costa · December 23rd, 2005, 09:38 AM

Pepsi commercials....

Andrew Khalil · December 23rd, 2005, 11:20 AM

The thought of adding text of some sort has crossed my mind, but the entire play is 2 acts, so there won't be anything to add in any scene changes before they change acts.
I think I'll see what the play's director wants me to do there. If he's fine with cutting, I'll have to find a good place in the score to fade the music in because the music they play during scene changes is actually continued into the actual scene.
Thanks for your help

Michael McGruder · December 23rd, 2005, 12:57 PM

I agree with Peter that if there's no other useable footage, then cutting may be the only choice.

Having said that - and having performed in the orchestra pit for a number of years in my youth -- if you want to include the musical background, how about editing a brief "re-cap" of the previous scene in slo-mo, a capturing "highlight" if you will with pans of the audience or if you had footage of the "behind the scenes," that may be an option as well.

Let us know what you ultimately did -- I'll be curious!
Good luck!
-Michael

Mike F Smith · January 17th, 2006, 10:13 PM

I don't know what the show is but in some ballets and such it may work to discribe what will occur in words. Your problem is this deal wasn't staged very well. It's just as bad to leave the patrons in the dark for over a minute as it is to have it on the dvd. The idea of recaping some of the powerful scenes maybe at about 50% disolve over the curtain might work well too.

Mike

Andrew Khalil · January 18th, 2006, 12:16 AM

I actually decided to just cut them out. I slowly faded the music out then brought it back up at the right moment just before I faded in - it looks great.

December 22nd, 2005, 11:49 PM	#1
Andrew Khalil Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 424	Need some opinions Hi everyone, I just finished shooting a Christmas production and editing has been going really well (gotta love FCP's Multicam capabilities:)) Now, during the scene changes, there is obviously a blackout along with the orchestra playing some music. I didn't have access to enough cameras to aim them at the orchestra which was is sort of oddly positioned at the far right of the auditorium. I also felt they would look out of place in the video because they aren't really related to the story, which I guess is the case for most productions anyway, but now I have sections of black, sometimes over a minute in length. So, in your opinions, should I just let the music play with a black screen for around a minute, or should I do something else with the situation? I'm just wondering how to make it more interesting and wishing that I could have gotten two more cameras for the orchestra. What do you guys think?

December 23rd, 2005, 01:11 AM	#2
Matt Trubac Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 286	I have always omitted the scene changes and associated orchestral segues. My viewpoint is, yes the orchestra was part of the show, but the music in between scenes suits the live performance, but not a screen version. It is there to help the audience pass time while scenes are changed, keep the energy from the previous scene, or I guess set up the next scene, but usually the video does better without it (in my opinion). A black screen will bore your viewer very quickly. Sorry if I'm rambling... I am going on day 2 of no sleep. Happy Holidays, Matt __________________ Matt Trubac

December 23rd, 2005, 08:20 AM	#4
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	I'd go with Matt and suggest replacing the scene changes with a brief dip to black, maybe with an "Act 2" title card overlay as you come up out of black, and cut the music. __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!

December 23rd, 2005, 09:38 AM	#5
Bob Costa Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Venice, FL Posts: 850	Pepsi commercials.... __________________ You are either growing or dying.

January 17th, 2006, 10:13 PM	#8
Mike F Smith Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 156	Maybe I don't know what the show is but in some ballets and such it may work to discribe what will occur in words. Your problem is this deal wasn't staged very well. It's just as bad to leave the patrons in the dark for over a minute as it is to have it on the dvd. The idea of recaping some of the powerful scenes maybe at about 50% disolve over the curtain might work well too. Mike

December 23rd, 2005, 04:36 AM	#3
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Andrew, ask the client what they want.. when i get this happening (quite often..) i usually ask before i shoot what they want me to do in this situation.. most of the time they let me use my discretion so i just cut it, but other times when theyre specific about it, i use some titling and create a brief intermission. This is where i get the artwork from the production and some credits and throw those on like a cinema ad while the music plays.. its tedious and boring but it pays the bills.. .

December 23rd, 2005, 11:20 AM	#6
Andrew Khalil Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 424	The thought of adding text of some sort has crossed my mind, but the entire play is 2 acts, so there won't be anything to add in any scene changes before they change acts. I think I'll see what the play's director wants me to do there. If he's fine with cutting, I'll have to find a good place in the score to fade the music in because the music they play during scene changes is actually continued into the actual scene. Thanks for your help

December 23rd, 2005, 12:57 PM	#7
Michael McGruder Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Grand Junction, CO Posts: 61	I agree with Peter that if there's no other useable footage, then cutting may be the only choice. Having said that - and having performed in the orchestra pit for a number of years in my youth -- if you want to include the musical background, how about editing a brief "re-cap" of the previous scene in slo-mo, a capturing "highlight" if you will with pans of the audience or if you had footage of the "behind the scenes," that may be an option as well. Let us know what you ultimately did -- I'll be curious! Good luck! -Michael

January 18th, 2006, 12:16 AM	#9
Andrew Khalil Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 424	I actually decided to just cut them out. I slowly faded the music out then brought it back up at the right moment just before I faded in - it looks great.