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December 9th, 2005, 05:41 PM | #16 | |
Inner Circle
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
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I find your reactions and those others who have expressed similar opinions to be very disconcerting to say the least. In truth I would have expected the majority opinion to be 180 degrees opposite. Perhaps you can explain to me why you seem to find business practices that are both illegal and harmful to the profession and to other artists to be examples of the way people ought to act, practices that are to be applauded, encouraged, and rewarded? Do you similarly hold software and movie pirates to be cultural heros to be applauded when it happens that they are very very good at what they do? Or should we have a moral compass in our business life that is guided by a higher standard than expediency?
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December 9th, 2005, 06:13 PM | #17 | ||
Still Motion
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Toronto, Canada
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While your intentions may be morally guided, you also have to consider the net effect of your actions. Those who will no longer share clips have not changed there practices because of you, they are simply not sharing them. You have not made things better, or more legal, you have simply tainted something that is an excellent resource ofr many of us. There are much better tactics to present your point of view, perhaps you could consider some of those next time. |
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December 10th, 2005, 10:55 AM | #18 | |
Inner Circle
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Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams! |
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December 10th, 2005, 11:01 AM | #19 |
Still Motion
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Toronto, Canada
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Steve,
Let it go. |
December 10th, 2005, 02:59 PM | #20 |
Trustee
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 1,689
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Get real... quit acting like it is the same to put a minute of a song in a one-off wedding montage as it is to bootleg DVDs and sell them on the streets of Hong Kong as originals. I have recently completed a feature doc that has many famous songwriters, most I became friends with. I cant imagine ANY of them having a legal issue with someone putting a song on a wedding DVD or sharing a clip on a website.
The fact is, that more artists are taking back their own publishing in an effort to ENCOURAGE this kind of use and exposure. In the next 10 years you will see many artists making their new songs and catalog available, either for free or for a small standard fee with NO red tape, for independent film makers and videographers. ash =o) |
December 10th, 2005, 04:17 PM | #21 | |
Inner Circle
Join Date: Mar 2005
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I think it's great that some artists are making their work freely available and I heartily endorse those who choose to set up new and reasonable licensing arrangements. But in that case it is the artist and copyright owners that are choosing to do that. You simply cannot ethically justify someone coming along and simply taking the work from them whether the artist wants them to use it or not. It is for them to initiate the process and give, not for us to take without permission until we get caught. Just because someone feels that artists *should* give away their work doesn't justify taking it. There's a boatload of music available free or at very affordable licensing right now. What is wrong with restricting oneself to using the work of the artists who are presently making their work available under the arrangements you suggest or using buy-out and needle drop libraries, creating one's own music with software such as Acid, or collaborating with a musician to develop your own? The appeal of using popular and classic music is the fact that is popular and classic and that's why people want to use it. It's unlikely a tune as popular as "Theme from Titanic" will ever be included in the no-fee or low-fee catalogs such as you see on the horizon any more than you'll find it in a buy-out library today. But if artistic merit is the criteria, I'm sure there are hundreds of songs available at affordable prices that are musically of as good ln quality or better without the need to wait for new licensing models to evolve - why not use them? If many of the famous songwriters in your documentary have no problem with someone using their work in a wedding video, how about simply obtaining a license from them and being legal about it? If they truly are willing and they haven't yet sold their rights, it could be accomplished in matter of moments for the effort of a couple of emails. Think you can't do quality wedding video without using popular music? Take a look at the sample clips on San Francisco's Big Pookiehead Productions website. Speaking of famous songwriters and performers, our own forum here has several Grammy and Emmy winners participating. Pop up into the audio forum and ask Doug Spotted Eagle or Ty Ford how they'd feel about you using using some of their work in your next wedding video.
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Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams! |
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December 10th, 2005, 09:35 PM | #22 | |
Major Player
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: DuPont, Wa
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Easy.. It's on the owner to track down the infringing user and ask nicely for some payment for the use. If I had a manager or label I would expect them to do that for me and if not, it is up to me to get my payment or stop the infringment. Just because you have a copyright doesn't mean jack unless you the owner enforce it or choose to enforce it. AND since we all know nobody seems to be doing anything about it.. I figure they know when they want their money and when they want to do something about it. I mean I think it's pretty evident enough of us have done the leg work trying the legal way and we all get the standard response from the big labels and publishers in that 4th grade teach tone "Oh that's so cute for your little wedding video. Well we don't have anything in place to do that but just don't make a bunch of copies and I hope the video turns out for you. " As in my work I suppose if another videographer rips it. Well it's fair game I mean I can't really copyright it since I am using "THE BAD MUSIC". So if they rip it good.. Now I can advertise even more and show how others like it so much they use my work as well..:) Then again in court I could say, "Oh I didn't create that So and So did, check out his site I just downloaded it to watch it".. Now if I did all original and someone ripped it. Then I would send a nice letter asking for a monetary amount in exchange for the use. Again, it would be on me to do that.. I personally feel at this time the only musicians to benefit from a lengthly highly publized trial against the videographer community would be Enya and Celine Dion since every darn demo seems to use their music..ROFL! (Yes Steve I know multiple muscians under one label, yadda yadda) P.S. The only thing I am worried about his David Bonner kicking my butt for over using his DVD Cover design and using some of his techniques.. Dave tell me where to send the check..:) |
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December 10th, 2005, 09:51 PM | #23 | |
Major Player
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: DuPont, Wa
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Smartsound Maximum Action: Texas Rock or Smartsound Fashion Dictates. I'm kinda partial to Fashion Dictates over the Texas Rock. Copyright music threads are useless. Some people choose to drink and drive, some choose to load software to friends, some choose to not yeild on arterials and some smokers toss lit cigarettes out their car window, some people don't report that $300 slot machine win, some people murder people, some people rob people, some people speed, some people use trial software pass the trial period, some people take other peoples land and force them to live on reservations, some people read these forums, some people don't read these forums and some people have nothing better to do than do the work of the RIAA for free.. In all fairness to Steve he is doing and saying the right thing and if he were to apply with the RIAA he could have some good reference material. But I have to ask the question. Does he even do wedding videos and I can't imagine a Bride going with Smart Sound or Dewolfe over say Shania Twain per say.. Well let me be honest. "HI. My name is Pat and I'm a license Abuser" |
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December 10th, 2005, 10:22 PM | #24 | |
Obstreperous Rex
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(for Glen, I'm closing this thread; let's chat by email. thanks -- CH) |
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