Clients Very Disappointed...

Chris Harding · April 3rd, 2011, 06:21 PM

Hey Steve

I do feel for you!! I had the complete opposite last year where an ethnic bride wanted CCTV style coverage for 6 hours non-stop!!!

I honestly don't think that most brides are ready for cinematic/creative video (and never will be!!) Most seem to want you to make sure you cover the essentials and as long as you do that they are happy!!!

That's why I shoot in documentary style...not 10 hours with an unmanned camera but usually around 2- 2.5 hours of footage edited down to just over an hour. Want some creative stuff??? Just circle the bride and groom at the photoshoot and slow down the footage and they are over the moon..yeah, I know it's real corny and done many times before but it keeps clients happy!!

If your contract states that they have one week to contact you for changes then you are covered...however from the sound of things you did a really polished job and they didn't appreciate it..and whatever you change (if you still had the footage) still wouldn't be good enough!!

Chris

Christian Brown · April 4th, 2011, 09:38 AM

Given how we love video, it can be a mental hurdle to do something simply. We want bells and whistles and a video that makes our clients look like movie stars.

How many of us stop to ask what the client is expecting? If the client wants 8 hours of video, I'm happy to provide it to them. We are in a service industry, and we should be servicing our clients, not servicing ourselves. And from a business perspective, I can do it in less time, meaning greater profit. It's win-win.

Having simple footage of the whole day (yes, even if it's a camera set up in the corner at the reception) is wonderful. In "CCTV" style, the video isn't the memory. The video is the cue for all the memories that the couple already has.

Stephen J. Williams · April 4th, 2011, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christian Brown

How many of us stop to ask what the client is expecting?

This post sounds like your saying that I'm unfamiliar with the needs of my clients. Which couldn't be further from the truth. All I'm saying is that you either want product A or product B. Most clients want my product, but this particular person would have been happier with a less expensive, simpler video. There's nothing I can do, as I will not change my shooting or editing style to appease someone. As this is the reason I thought one would book me to begin with
This is my first client that isn't happy with the final video, which is unsettling for me.... The complaints were well out of my control... Regardless of which shooting/editing style.

Steve

Michael Simons · April 4th, 2011, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen J. Williams

This post sounds like your saying that I'm unfamiliar with the needs of my clients. Which couldn't be further from the truth. All I'm saying is that you either want product A or product B. Most clients want my product, but this particular person would have been happier with a less expensive, simpler video. There's nothing I can do, as I will not change my shooting or editing style to appease someone. As this is the reason I thought one would book me to begin with
This is my first client that isn't happy with the final video, which is unsettling for me.... The complaints were well out of my control... Regardless of which shooting/editing style.

Steve

Steve, don't take it personally. No doubt this bride complained about her photographer, entertainment, florists, makeup etc etc..

Jim Snow · April 4th, 2011, 05:23 PM

If it's any consolation, think about the poor guy who is going to have to live with her.

Jeff Wallace · April 15th, 2011, 05:23 PM

After 10 years in this business, there a few things I learned quickly.

1. Never accept a wedding conducted in a foreign language - unless you speak the language!

2. Three-day Indian weddings are nightmares. Period.

3. If your clients were born in India or the Middle East, chances are they love to haggle and will never be satisfied with anything you give them. This has definitely been my experience.

I stopped accepting these types of weddings after my 2nd year in business, and in the process I avoided 8 years of headaches and nightmares.

Chris Harding · April 15th, 2011, 06:42 PM

Hey Jeff

Those are probably the 3 most important things to remember if a bride calls you on the phone in broken English asking if you are available!!

No disrespect whatsoever meant to couples that are not Western but communication is important with any supplier and I actually have a section on my website suggesting that if a wedding is indeed in a language other than English then it would be far wiser for the bride to find someone who both understands the language and the culture and traditions so they end up with a better end product.

I can safely say that 99.9% of my issues with brides happened during the time I was first doing these weddings...after I stopped accepting them all problems also ceased!!

Chris

Noa Put · April 16th, 2011, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Wallace

3. If your clients were born in India or the Middle East, chances are they love to haggle and will never be satisfied with anything you give them. This has definitely been my experience.

Same experience here, I also stopped accepting these type of weddings, my last Indian wedding was also a nightmare with the client asking for things that were never agreed upon like free of charge editing changes.

Ryan Czaplinski · April 17th, 2011, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Hurd

No matter what else happens, stand firm on this one.

What's wrong with giving encoded to DVD format of the raw footage? I do this with my highlights package.

Noel Lising · May 31st, 2011, 08:44 AM

Rather than post a new thread, let me share an experience I had last Sunday. I think it is very important to review line items of your agreement with Bride & Groom. Four things came up that had red flags written all over them.

1. We want copyright, we don't want to have our photos/videos used for any promotional purposes. Fine with me.

2. Creative control during the day. They want inputs on how videos are shot and how they want to be posed during the day. But we like your work, feel free to do what you like but we want to have a say during the photo shoot.

3. They want 25% downpayment, 25 % on the day rather than the full payment. They want to view the footage 2 days after to check if the quality is up to their standard. " They don't want the headache of going to small claims court", were their exact words.

4. 12 hour day does that mean we get 12 hours of footage? Thanks to Travis for this, I told them it means 12 hour presence.

Having said all of that, he wants me to revise the agreement then he'll issue me a check for the downpayment.

I politely declined the gig, it's the only Saturday available for me in August. I think I'd rather go camping.

Jeff Harper · May 31st, 2011, 08:59 AM

Noel, I've had a couple of similar contacts in the past such as yours. I remember my jaw dropped and I was almost speechless. I was able to recover my presence of mind enough to send them to another videographer whom I disliked.

Dave Blackhurst · May 31st, 2011, 09:33 AM

Yoinks!

Red flags? Sounds more like 10 foot tall, red flashing neon letters... "RUN AWAY!!!"... they'll want to review that footage quick, I see an annullment not long after the video is shot...

Better to go on a camping trip to a mosquito infested swamp... with alligators... and snakes...

Noel Lising · May 31st, 2011, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Harper

Noel, I've had a couple of similar contacts in the past such as yours. I remember my jaw dropped and I was almost speechless. I was able to recover my presence of mind enough to send them to another videographer whom I disliked.

I had my share but this one ranks up there!

Noel Lising · May 31st, 2011, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Blackhurst

Yoinks!

Red flags? Sounds more like 10 foot tall, red flashing neon letters... "RUN AWAY!!!"... they'll want to review that footage quick, I see an annullment not long after the video is shot...

Better to go on a camping trip to a mosquito infested swamp... with alligators... and snakes...

To be honest I saw my life flashing in front of me if I do sign the couple up.LOL

Jeff Harper · May 31st, 2011, 09:58 AM

I had one that sent me a list via email that outlined terms, such as yours did. I truly wondered what fool would take the guy on.

April 3rd, 2011, 06:21 PM	#61
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... Hey Steve I do feel for you!! I had the complete opposite last year where an ethnic bride wanted CCTV style coverage for 6 hours non-stop!!! I honestly don't think that most brides are ready for cinematic/creative video (and never will be!!) Most seem to want you to make sure you cover the essentials and as long as you do that they are happy!!! That's why I shoot in documentary style...not 10 hours with an unmanned camera but usually around 2- 2.5 hours of footage edited down to just over an hour. Want some creative stuff??? Just circle the bride and groom at the photoshoot and slow down the footage and they are over the moon..yeah, I know it's real corny and done many times before but it keeps clients happy!! If your contract states that they have one week to contact you for changes then you are covered...however from the sound of things you did a really polished job and they didn't appreciate it..and whatever you change (if you still had the footage) still wouldn't be good enough!! Chris

April 4th, 2011, 09:38 AM	#62
Christian Brown Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 194	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... Given how we love video, it can be a mental hurdle to do something simply. We want bells and whistles and a video that makes our clients look like movie stars. How many of us stop to ask what the client is expecting? If the client wants 8 hours of video, I'm happy to provide it to them. We are in a service industry, and we should be servicing our clients, not servicing ourselves. And from a business perspective, I can do it in less time, meaning greater profit. It's win-win. Having simple footage of the whole day (yes, even if it's a camera set up in the corner at the reception) is wonderful. In "CCTV" style, the video isn't the memory. The video is the cue for all the memories that the couple already has. __________________ http://artslaureate.com/, http://facebook.com/ArtsLaureate http://www.christianamonson.com/

April 4th, 2011, 05:23 PM	#65
Jim Snow Trustee Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Santa Clara, CA Posts: 1,104	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... If it's any consolation, think about the poor guy who is going to have to live with her.

April 15th, 2011, 05:23 PM	#66
Jeff Wallace Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: San Mateo, CA Posts: 79	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... After 10 years in this business, there a few things I learned quickly. 1. Never accept a wedding conducted in a foreign language - unless you speak the language! 2. Three-day Indian weddings are nightmares. Period. 3. If your clients were born in India or the Middle East, chances are they love to haggle and will never be satisfied with anything you give them. This has definitely been my experience. I stopped accepting these types of weddings after my 2nd year in business, and in the process I avoided 8 years of headaches and nightmares.

April 15th, 2011, 06:42 PM	#67
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... Hey Jeff Those are probably the 3 most important things to remember if a bride calls you on the phone in broken English asking if you are available!! No disrespect whatsoever meant to couples that are not Western but communication is important with any supplier and I actually have a section on my website suggesting that if a wedding is indeed in a language other than English then it would be far wiser for the bride to find someone who both understands the language and the culture and traditions so they end up with a better end product. I can safely say that 99.9% of my issues with brides happened during the time I was first doing these weddings...after I stopped accepting them all problems also ceased!! Chris

May 31st, 2011, 08:44 AM	#70
Noel Lising Major Player Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 789	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... Rather than post a new thread, let me share an experience I had last Sunday. I think it is very important to review line items of your agreement with Bride & Groom. Four things came up that had red flags written all over them. 1. We want copyright, we don't want to have our photos/videos used for any promotional purposes. Fine with me. 2. Creative control during the day. They want inputs on how videos are shot and how they want to be posed during the day. But we like your work, feel free to do what you like but we want to have a say during the photo shoot. 3. They want 25% downpayment, 25 % on the day rather than the full payment. They want to view the footage 2 days after to check if the quality is up to their standard. " They don't want the headache of going to small claims court", were their exact words. 4. 12 hour day does that mean we get 12 hours of footage? Thanks to Travis for this, I told them it means 12 hour presence. Having said all of that, he wants me to revise the agreement then he'll issue me a check for the downpayment. I politely declined the gig, it's the only Saturday available for me in August. I think I'd rather go camping. __________________ Noel Lising

May 31st, 2011, 08:59 AM	#71
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... Noel, I've had a couple of similar contacts in the past such as yours. I remember my jaw dropped and I was almost speechless. I was able to recover my presence of mind enough to send them to another videographer whom I disliked. __________________ "The horror of what I saw on the timeline cannot be described."

May 31st, 2011, 09:33 AM	#72
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... Yoinks! Red flags? Sounds more like 10 foot tall, red flashing neon letters... "RUN AWAY!!!"... they'll want to review that footage quick, I see an annullment not long after the video is shot... Better to go on a camping trip to a mosquito infested swamp... with alligators... and snakes...

May 31st, 2011, 09:58 AM	#75
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Clients Very Disappointed... I had one that sent me a list via email that outlined terms, such as yours did. I truly wondered what fool would take the guy on. __________________ "The horror of what I saw on the timeline cannot be described."