Wedding couple wants "no release" of footage... at DVinfo.net

Silas Barker · March 15th, 2010, 11:33 PM

Quite honestly I am thinking about not taking the job.
I would like to either use a few still images or 2-5 second video clips of their wedding but they dont want it. In 5 years, this has never happened before to me.
The wedding is in a really nice place 250 miles away, and I only take on a certain number of weddings so I can trying to decide whether to take it or not.

Also, their is no first dance, no cake, and just the ceremony and toasts basically.

Any ideas?

Oh yeah, they want my smallest package too.

Dimitris Mantalias · March 16th, 2010, 12:35 AM

Simple. In our contract we always have a term that saying that we can use the material for advertising reasons (internet or anything else). If they don't want such a thing, they should pay something like 30% more! So they take it or they leave it.

It makes me wonder though. When we had such issues, it was always from the very rich clients. But all the rest, they always like the publicity! -:)

Silas Barker · March 16th, 2010, 12:39 AM

I never had anyone oppose using the footage before. I have a part in the contract that says I use all the footage for promotional purposes and that they agree to that.

This couple did not agree to it, but I am not sure if I can ask for a larger amount of money or not.

Do you think I could just say, well hey its 20% (or whatever) more if I cant use the footage?

I do happen to know that they have a larger budget for video then they are paying me for, and they also did not put down the budget information in the wedding application (we dont take every wedding that comes down the river)

Silas Barker · March 16th, 2010, 12:44 AM

I never had anyone oppose using the footage before. I have a part in the contract that says I use all the footage for promotional purposes and that they agree to that.

This couple did not agree to it, but I am not sure if I can ask for a larger amount of money or not.

Do you think I could just say, well hey its 20% (or whatever) more if I cant use the footage?

I do happen to know that they have a larger budget for video then they are paying me for, and they also did not put down the budget information in the wedding application (we dont take every wedding that comes down the river)

Alan Craig · March 16th, 2010, 12:52 AM

You say you are not sure wether to take the job or not then I would tell the client that it will cost them whatever % more if they do not sign a release for you to use the footage in whatever way you choose to. The % being what would make the job worth while doing and if they do not agree then they have made your mind up for you wether to do the job.

Alan

Silas Barker · March 16th, 2010, 12:55 AM

Yes, I think about 25% is fair.

They may go ahead go for that since they have a bit more money for the video budget.
I hate to lose a job just because of their querkyness after I ve already taken the time to meet them in person and everything and they are ready to hire me.

Chris Harding · March 16th, 2010, 01:26 AM

Funny, it's always the people who want to pay the least that have the greatest demands!!

If you take the job then there will be more hassles and more demands and conditions so unless I was down to my last few cents, I'd rather just take the day off !!

My contact too states that I reserve the right to use their footage as promotional material and brides have never contested it!!

Rather let some other sucker do the job and live with the worries... especially since they want the lowest rate too!!

Chris

Alec Moreno · March 16th, 2010, 02:45 AM

We talk of how personal and touching the moments of a wedding film can be and yet, from this thread, it seems to be the norm that people charge clients extra for the right to keep those moments private. If I were the client, I would not hire any videographer who charged me for this.

I do not charge for this myself. Plenty of couples give me permission to use their footage for advertising, and the others get to keep their films to themselves.

Alec Moreno
http://www.1Day1ShotProductions.com

Philip Howells · March 16th, 2010, 02:52 AM

Sorry to be out of step with most colleagues here but, like Alec, I understand why clients would not want unlimited use of their video.

Apart from anything else, that would permit the unscrupulous to edit in such a way as to make them look foolish, mean, in fact anything short of defamatory. For example, one FOB declared in his speech that he'd been present at his daughter's conception. It was a mistake for he meant her birth and whilst it is no doubt a favourite "blooper" in the family, it would be inappropriate to publish it. We believe clients should not have any doubt about that.

Accordingly in our terms we promise clients that we will not release, ie lend or sell the full (complete) wedding videos to anyone but them and people they specifically authorise, though we reserve the right to play them under our control to prospective clients; we do reserve the right to play in public on our stands and in our demo disk their "Dream" wedding video (summary); we promise never to release any part to the Internet without their specific permission.

Incidentally our demos all carry equally clear restrictions on use.

Having said all that, if Silas feels that this request is symptomatic of a difficult client, in his place, and as long as I could afford to do so, I'd decline the job.

Joe Allen Rosenberger · March 16th, 2010, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alec Moreno

We talk of how personal and touching the moments of a wedding film can be and yet, from this thread, it seems to be the norm that people charge clients extra for the right to keep those moments private. If I were the client, I would not hire any videographer who charged me for this.

I do not charge for this myself. Plenty of couples give me permission to use their footage for advertising, and the others get to keep their films to themselves.

Alec Moreno
http://www.1Day1ShotProductions.com

I agree with Alec.

My contract states that I have permission to use the images/audio for promotional use but I receive my share of clients who request to exclude it from the contract. I never question them, and I always honor their request.

In all the celebrity events/weddings I've shot...not one client was ok with me using their footage for promotional use.

If you get upset that a potential client is only interested in your smallest package then it may be time to exclude that package from your services.

I can understand you wanting the footage for demo purposes IF you really need the footy and have little to a few weddings under your belt but I don't think it's worth losing the client over. You shoot their wedding, it turns out great, they tell their friends...you shoot friend's wedding with permission to use the footage for promotional use.
You win.

Dimitris Mantalias · March 16th, 2010, 05:16 AM

I still think that in the contract, it should be clear that the videographer may use the material for promotional reasons. Truth is, we never show publicly a whole wedding (too many things that shouldn't be good to go public), but regarding a highlights video or an edited preparation, we don't hesitate. It should be clear on the client or the client should pay an amount of money or hire another videographer.

Last August we shot this big event. It was so big, that it had members of many European royal families, businessmen and tycoons. The house where everything happened (it had a church inside!) was beyond description. Still, we had agreed from the beginning (we didn't know then about what we'd see there) and we shot and edited some breathtaking stuff that we can never use for promotional reasons.

Another one was a recent wedding of the daughter of one of the wealthiest men in Greece. She didn't want the wedding video to go to the Net, so we didn't book the job. Simple as that. When these things are clear from the beginning, there can't be any later trouble or misunderstanding.

Thing is, that most of our bookings are done through Internet. When I can't use the medium to show some very grand stuff, then I am losing potential customers that should be impressed by a huge event. It only makes sense that I will either turn the job down or I will ask for more money, because to get paid for a job is good but using the footage to bring more clients in is even better. And after all, yes, I love my job, but it's business too and I have to make a business model that works good for me. I am sure that many will disagree with the above but since all these are explained from the beginning to the client, it is 100% honest to my eyes. We don't sell a basic survival product like food or water, we sell something that if they don't want to take it from us, they'll take it from somebody else, probably with the terms of the clients. I am fine with this. It's cynical but at least it's honest.

Scott Hayes · March 16th, 2010, 05:18 AM

In this economy, turn down nothing.

Noel Lising · March 16th, 2010, 06:50 AM

I had a couple who signed an agreement with me, later they asked me if I would be kind enough not to post their videos on-line. It is a one off anyway so I happily obliged. Maybe they have their reasons for not wanting to, I overheard them talking that they are not sharing their DVDs either, one each for their parents that's it. They are even concerned that relatives might borrow their video and make copies of it without their consent. I guess some couples wants privacy.

My 2 cents.

Noel Lising · March 16th, 2010, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimitris Mantalias

Another one was a recent wedding of the daughter of one of the wealthiest men in Greece. She didn't want the wedding video to go to the Net, so we didn't book the job. Simple as that. When these things are clear from the beginning, there can't be any later trouble or misunderstanding.

I admire you for this Dimitris. I don't have on-line booking but this wedding that you have turned down is a Gold mine in face to face demos. I can live without the online video for this one.

I have been thinking of Hollywood celebrity weddings, I assume their legal team would make you sign an iron clad agreement that the wedding video should never go public. Pay you tons of money but you have nothing to show for it. If I ever do one I'll ask for a letter signed by the Celebrity saying it was a job well done.

Steve Shovlar · March 16th, 2010, 08:40 AM

I get clients asking for us not to use any of their footage all the time. It's no big deal. In fact I am happy for that to happen. I film a lot of police officers weddings and they don'e want their wedding online, as they might be acting in some inappropriate way not in keeping with their job.

No extra charge, no nothing. Happy to take the booking as I have many more weddings that i can use for samples.

March 15th, 2010, 11:33 PM	#1
Silas Barker Major Player Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Sacramento, California Posts: 577	Wedding couple wants "no release" of footage... Quite honestly I am thinking about not taking the job. I would like to either use a few still images or 2-5 second video clips of their wedding but they dont want it. In 5 years, this has never happened before to me. The wedding is in a really nice place 250 miles away, and I only take on a certain number of weddings so I can trying to decide whether to take it or not. Also, their is no first dance, no cake, and just the ceremony and toasts basically. Any ideas? Oh yeah, they want my smallest package too.

March 16th, 2010, 12:35 AM	#2
Dimitris Mantalias Major Player Join Date: May 2009 Location: Arta, Greece Posts: 342	Simple. In our contract we always have a term that saying that we can use the material for advertising reasons (internet or anything else). If they don't want such a thing, they should pay something like 30% more! So they take it or they leave it. It makes me wonder though. When we had such issues, it was always from the very rich clients. But all the rest, they always like the publicity! -:) __________________ "A successful wedding videographer is the one that offers for viewing some excellent videos and some boring videos, and gets positive reviews for both".

March 16th, 2010, 12:39 AM	#3
Silas Barker Major Player Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Sacramento, California Posts: 577	I never had anyone oppose using the footage before. I have a part in the contract that says I use all the footage for promotional purposes and that they agree to that. This couple did not agree to it, but I am not sure if I can ask for a larger amount of money or not. Do you think I could just say, well hey its 20% (or whatever) more if I cant use the footage? I do happen to know that they have a larger budget for video then they are paying me for, and they also did not put down the budget information in the wedding application (we dont take every wedding that comes down the river) Last edited by Silas Barker; March 16th, 2010 at 12:44 AM. Reason: I never had anyone oppose using the footage BEFORE

March 16th, 2010, 05:16 AM	#11
Dimitris Mantalias Major Player Join Date: May 2009 Location: Arta, Greece Posts: 342	I still think that in the contract, it should be clear that the videographer may use the material for promotional reasons. Truth is, we never show publicly a whole wedding (too many things that shouldn't be good to go public), but regarding a highlights video or an edited preparation, we don't hesitate. It should be clear on the client or the client should pay an amount of money or hire another videographer. Last August we shot this big event. It was so big, that it had members of many European royal families, businessmen and tycoons. The house where everything happened (it had a church inside!) was beyond description. Still, we had agreed from the beginning (we didn't know then about what we'd see there) and we shot and edited some breathtaking stuff that we can never use for promotional reasons. Another one was a recent wedding of the daughter of one of the wealthiest men in Greece. She didn't want the wedding video to go to the Net, so we didn't book the job. Simple as that. When these things are clear from the beginning, there can't be any later trouble or misunderstanding. Thing is, that most of our bookings are done through Internet. When I can't use the medium to show some very grand stuff, then I am losing potential customers that should be impressed by a huge event. It only makes sense that I will either turn the job down or I will ask for more money, because to get paid for a job is good but using the footage to bring more clients in is even better. And after all, yes, I love my job, but it's business too and I have to make a business model that works good for me. I am sure that many will disagree with the above but since all these are explained from the beginning to the client, it is 100% honest to my eyes. We don't sell a basic survival product like food or water, we sell something that if they don't want to take it from us, they'll take it from somebody else, probably with the terms of the clients. I am fine with this. It's cynical but at least it's honest. __________________ "A successful wedding videographer is the one that offers for viewing some excellent videos and some boring videos, and gets positive reviews for both".

March 16th, 2010, 06:50 AM	#13
Noel Lising Major Player Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 789	I had a couple who signed an agreement with me, later they asked me if I would be kind enough not to post their videos on-line. It is a one off anyway so I happily obliged. Maybe they have their reasons for not wanting to, I overheard them talking that they are not sharing their DVDs either, one each for their parents that's it. They are even concerned that relatives might borrow their video and make copies of it without their consent. I guess some couples wants privacy. My 2 cents. __________________ Noel Lising

March 16th, 2010, 12:44 AM	#4
Silas Barker Major Player Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Sacramento, California Posts: 577	I never had anyone oppose using the footage before. I have a part in the contract that says I use all the footage for promotional purposes and that they agree to that. This couple did not agree to it, but I am not sure if I can ask for a larger amount of money or not. Do you think I could just say, well hey its 20% (or whatever) more if I cant use the footage? I do happen to know that they have a larger budget for video then they are paying me for, and they also did not put down the budget information in the wedding application (we dont take every wedding that comes down the river)

March 16th, 2010, 12:52 AM	#5
Alan Craig Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Warrington England Posts: 143	You say you are not sure wether to take the job or not then I would tell the client that it will cost them whatever % more if they do not sign a release for you to use the footage in whatever way you choose to. The % being what would make the job worth while doing and if they do not agree then they have made your mind up for you wether to do the job. Alan

March 16th, 2010, 12:55 AM	#6
Silas Barker Major Player Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Sacramento, California Posts: 577	Yes, I think about 25% is fair. They may go ahead go for that since they have a bit more money for the video budget. I hate to lose a job just because of their querkyness after I ve already taken the time to meet them in person and everything and they are ready to hire me.

March 16th, 2010, 01:26 AM	#7
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Funny, it's always the people who want to pay the least that have the greatest demands!! If you take the job then there will be more hassles and more demands and conditions so unless I was down to my last few cents, I'd rather just take the day off !! My contact too states that I reserve the right to use their footage as promotional material and brides have never contested it!! Rather let some other sucker do the job and live with the worries... especially since they want the lowest rate too!! Chris

March 16th, 2010, 02:45 AM	#8
Alec Moreno Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Glendora, CA Posts: 184	We talk of how personal and touching the moments of a wedding film can be and yet, from this thread, it seems to be the norm that people charge clients extra for the right to keep those moments private. If I were the client, I would not hire any videographer who charged me for this. I do not charge for this myself. Plenty of couples give me permission to use their footage for advertising, and the others get to keep their films to themselves. Alec Moreno http://www.1Day1ShotProductions.com

March 16th, 2010, 02:52 AM	#9
Philip Howells Trustee Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 1,212	Sorry to be out of step with most colleagues here but, like Alec, I understand why clients would not want unlimited use of their video. Apart from anything else, that would permit the unscrupulous to edit in such a way as to make them look foolish, mean, in fact anything short of defamatory. For example, one FOB declared in his speech that he'd been present at his daughter's conception. It was a mistake for he meant her birth and whilst it is no doubt a favourite "blooper" in the family, it would be inappropriate to publish it. We believe clients should not have any doubt about that. Accordingly in our terms we promise clients that we will not release, ie lend or sell the full (complete) wedding videos to anyone but them and people they specifically authorise, though we reserve the right to play them under our control to prospective clients; we do reserve the right to play in public on our stands and in our demo disk their "Dream" wedding video (summary); we promise never to release any part to the Internet without their specific permission. Incidentally our demos all carry equally clear restrictions on use. Having said all that, if Silas feels that this request is symptomatic of a difficult client, in his place, and as long as I could afford to do so, I'd decline the job.

March 16th, 2010, 05:18 AM	#12
Scott Hayes Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 692	In this economy, turn down nothing.

March 16th, 2010, 08:40 AM	#15
Steve Shovlar Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Dorset UK Posts: 697	I get clients asking for us not to use any of their footage all the time. It's no big deal. In fact I am happy for that to happen. I film a lot of police officers weddings and they don'e want their wedding online, as they might be acting in some inappropriate way not in keeping with their job. No extra charge, no nothing. Happy to take the booking as I have many more weddings that i can use for samples.