Another new clip- Photo Session montage

[Steve House]

Originally Posted by Matt Browning

C'mon guys. The creator of this thread, Glen, does NOT want to discuss musical rights in this thread. If you can't post related to the original subject, please refrain from doing so.

....

And I was remiss in not commenting that Glen's work is outstanding!

Glen, thanks very much for the post! Each one I review from you and others gives me valuable ideas and insights. Thanks for sharing.

[Glen Elliott]

Originally Posted by Matt Browning

Glen, I thought your clip was wonderful. It made me open up Premiere and look at the dance recital that I just finished to see if I could add a little spice! Two questions - 1, is there an effect in Premiere similar to Vegas to give you that suttle white glow? And 2, do you know of free or cheap compression software that I should get so I can post examples on here? And if there isn't one worth getting that's cheap, which bullet should I bite and go for the best quality?

Thanks Matt.

1) The effect in Vegas is called "glow". I'm not too familiar with Premiere but I do believe they have something similar- maybe called "diffusion glow" or "white diffusion".

2) You shouldn't have to purchase additional software for encoding- baring the fact your using Premiere 7+ (pro) you should have all templates to render out to any format from MPG2 to WMV. I personally prefer WMV for the web- it's a good balance of compression and quality. Usually my encoding bit-rate is between 512k to 900k.

If you are, indeed, running an earlier version of Premiere which doesn't have all the rendering codecs included- there are several free encoding programs on the web. TMPGEnc comes to mind- a really good free mpg encoder.

[Glen Elliott]

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

The work itself is in the usual class of what Glen offers. I only wish i had as much time to work on my own projects this way :)

Id also like to know what monopod is used as im currently looking for one which alows for quick release. I was shooting a wedding once and a guest actually bought an 8 foot long monopod with a bracing bracket of his own, and we used it to good effect, but he got too drunk b the time we gave it back to him so i didnt get that info lol

The monopod model I use is:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...goryNavigation

Along with the 3232 Swivel Tilt Head.

I add a q/r plate to the 3232 head to enable me to switch from handheld, to monopod, to tripod, to glidecam.

[Ralph Longo]

I was having a conversation Sat night with someone (a friend) who saw the first wedding I did (lot's of mistakes) and she said it was great. I tried to explain that it was okay but there were mistakes and I have tried to correct them but it is a learning process. She basically said hogwash (my fiance agreed) and we left it at that (I generally don't like to argue with people who tell me I'm doing things right). When on Sun my fiance and myself watched your clip I looked up and said "see" and her exact words were "that was really good...really, really good". So the reason for my story is I will now be watching your stuff, listening and following your advice in a dark room from now on so I don't risk people comparing me to you :) Great work as always and thank you for sharing this stuff with us.

[Glen Elliott]

Originally Posted by Ralph Longo

I was having a conversation Sat night with someone (a friend) who saw the first wedding I did (lot's of mistakes) and she said it was great. I tried to explain that it was okay but there were mistakes and I have tried to correct them but it is a learning process. She basically said hogwash (my fiance agreed) and we left it at that (I generally don't like to argue with people who tell me I'm doing things right). When on Sun my fiance and myself watched your clip I looked up and said "see" and her exact words were "that was really good...really, really good". So the reason for my story is I will now be watching your stuff, listening and following your advice in a dark room from now on so I don't risk people comparing me to you :) Great work as always and thank you for sharing this stuff with us.

Thank you for the kind words.

Well I don't think videography can always BE comparable. Like traditional art- it's very subjective. Granted, you can shoot in a style that a majority will find appealing but there are always people who might favor a different style.

What I do is study the works of the videographers I admire and try to pick out what I like about it. After watching it and soaking it all in, I'll go back and try to specifically hone in on certain aspects I felt made it favorable in my mind. I take these and try to apply them to my work.

Don't ever fret about "comparing" yourself to others- just produce the best work you possibly can and worry about keeping your clients happy.

Best of luck.

[Mike Cook]

Glen, I do have the extendo legs on my tripod, I am using the same ones you are (and von Lanken uses). I stick one of those legs under each armpit and hold the pole above my head.

I also use the Von Lanken method but for some reason I am more stable right now with the stinky legs method. Go figure.

Cheers

Mike

[K. Forman]

What filters and cam are you using Glenn?

[Glen Elliott]

Originally Posted by Keith Forman

What filters and cam are you using Glenn?

Cam- VX2100

Filters- Vegas...Levels, Color Corrector, and Glow

[K. Forman]

No diffusion filters on the cam? The footage looked pretty soft.

[Jesse Rosten]

Beautiful work Glen. Great composition, great filtering, sweet "boom" moves.

So I might be opening a can of worms here but did anyone else find it a bit on the boring side? Don't get me wrong. It is technically and aesthetically very well done. But, to me, it's BEEN done over and over and over. Slomo and pretty music are not enough to grab my emotions. I need back story. I want to know what the bride and groom are thinking/feeling. I want to hear the funny comments that were made during the photo-shoot.

I think one of the biggest challenges of wedding videography is character development. I know what you're thinking - weddings aren't scripted. Yup. That's why it's such a challenge. How do we make these montages feel personal and not just generic? How do we get the viewer emotionally invested in the "characters" (bride and groom)?

rant over

(Nothing personal Glen just trying to stimulate discussion)

peace
jesse

[Glen Elliott]

Originally Posted by Jesse Rosten

Beautiful work Glen. Great composition, great filtering, sweet "boom" moves.

So I might be opening a can of worms here but did anyone else find it a bit on the boring side? Don't get me wrong. It is technically and aesthetically very well done. But, to me, it's BEEN done over and over and over. Slomo and pretty music are not enough to grab my emotions. I need back story. I want to know what the bride and groom are thinking/feeling. I want to hear the funny comments that were made during the photo-shoot.

I think one of the biggest challenges of wedding videography is character development. I know what you're thinking - weddings aren't scripted. Yup. That's why it's such a challenge. How do we make these montages feel personal and not just generic? How do we get the viewer emotionally invested in the "characters" (bride and groom)?

rant over

(Nothing personal Glen just trying to stimulate discussion)

peace
jesse

Not taken personal whatsoever. I understand your viewpoint and in some ways agree with you. When a piece is left with only the music to drive it- it loses something. It's less personal and charming and more generic and "commercial"esce. Keep in mind however the use of this piece in a finished production. It's serving as merely a seguay to the formal entrances at the reception. I'm saving all the juicy voice over's and natural audio sound bytes for the highlight vignette.

While I agree with you about the "character development" I can see both sides of the issue. You have to keep in mind who the target audience is...the couple and their family. The clients themselves and their family already "know" the lead characters thus I feel "character development" isn't always key as it would be in a short or otherwise- which has a script and characters that "need" to be developed. On the other hand- storytelling does play a part in wedding videography. Albiet the script we work with doesn't vary quite much- so you can focus on the thoughts and feelings of the bride and groom. Thus the reason I work on getting vo's from the couple during the day. I usually ask them some very informal questions to spawn conversation and verbal descriptives about their partner. These can then be used reflectively over footage to further emotionally charge a piece that would be somewhat "generic" and "distant" otherwise.

[Glen Elliott]

Originally Posted by Keith Forman

No diffusion filters on the cam? The footage looked pretty soft.

No diffusion filters on the cam. The softness all stems from the use of diffused highlights.

[Pete Wilie]

Originally Posted by Glen Elliott

... Keep in mind however the use of this piece in a finished production. It's serving as merely a seguay to the formal entrances at the reception. I'm saving all the juicy voice over's and natural audio sound bytes for the highlight vignette. ...

Glen, could you expand on this. Are you saying this is a chapter on the DVD, or that it will be included in another sequence? Would you mind sharing what you typically include on the DVD?

[Glen Elliott]

Originally Posted by Pete Wilie

Glen, could you expand on this. Are you saying this is a chapter on the DVD, or that it will be included in another sequence? Would you mind sharing what you typically include on the DVD?

After the recieving line I'll transition into this clip and out of this clip into the formal entrances/first dance. I have lots of standard, multi-cam, coverage but about 3 vignette style pieces breaking it up throughout. Opening (bridal prep), middle (photosession), and end (highlight vignette).

[Jesse Rosten]

Agreed Glen - we are seeing this clip out of its larger context. I too use musical montages to set the scene or transition from one context to the next. We're all in the same boat!

I have to disagree with you on the target audience. Yes, immediate family will be the first to watch the finished DVD, but they won't be the only ones. It's been my experience that as soon as the bride and groom have seen their DVD they want to show EVERYONE - friends, family, and even strangers. The wedding day is meant to be shared- that's why people invite hundreds of guests to the ceremony.

Even if the only people to ever watch a wedding DVD are the immediate family, they still don't know what the bride and groom are thinking/feeling. They may know the background of the characters, but that doesn't mean they know at any given moment on the wedding day what the bride&groom are feeling. For this reason I think it's great that you do informal interviews throughout the day.

One last rant: (not directed at you glen) It seems to be a trend in current wedding videography to gravitate towards "romantic," or "emotional" We tend to over-use slowmo because we think it instantly adds a certain feel to the footage. Unfortunately, this over use leads to the footage feeling sappy, cheezy, and forced.(IMO) I'm not saying don't use slowmo or try to make something look romantic. I think the key is building the characters and story at the beginning. Get the viewer emotionally involved with the characters and the story, so that when you hit them with the slomo, it REALLY hits them and it sticks- without feeling forced. Wouldn't that shot of the groom crying mean so much more if you (the viewer) had learned at the beginning of the film that he NEVER crys at weddings?

Good discussion


peace
jesse