HD Experience without BluRay?? at DVinfo.net

Chris Harding · February 12th, 2010, 06:21 AM

Hi All

I would really like to be able to offer my couples their ceremony video (at least) in HD but almost every couple has an HDTV but no BluRay player!!

Has anyone else offered "non BD" brides HD in another format???? I was thinking of maybe a disk with HD WMV clips on it so they can watch it on their laptop and if it has an HDMI output, on their TV in HD!! I would say that most young people with have a recent laptop, none seem to have a BD player, PS3 or a media Player.

Any ideas for people without BluRay to be able to get an HD version of their wedding (or even part of it???)

Chris

Peter Manojlovic · February 12th, 2010, 08:44 AM

Honestly???
I wouldn't waste my time with other formats....
Unless it's a labour of love, and unless the customers are demanding this, you're probably going to lose out....

You can always archive the final product in HD, or keep the project files and assest, and when they're ready for BD, create the discs...

Forrest Burger · February 12th, 2010, 08:57 AM

I don't do weddings, but with the cost of Blu-ray players coming down, would it be possible to roll the cost of a Blu-ray player into your package price? Then, of course, the couple would have to have an HDTV...which a lot of people do.

Just a thought.

Forrest

Travis Cossel · February 12th, 2010, 01:03 PM

Chris, look at this situation in two ways.

First, if none of your customers have BluRay capability, then it's just not a priority for them yet. If they haven't purchased a player they probably aren't going to jump through hoops and hook up their laptop to their TV. So to me, it seems like a waste of time (and time is money) to provide them with extra formats they'll likely never use.

Second, if you CAN get them to watch the other HD formats then you stand to educate them a little on the advantages. Perhaps the next referral they send your way will mention that they saw their friend's wedding in HD and it was awesome. Still, I think this is a stretch considering where your market is at currently.

Bottom line .. I probably wouldn't pursue additional formats until you start getting some demand for HD content.

Chris Davis · February 12th, 2010, 01:48 PM

I don't know about weddings, but an option I have used for corporate customers is to include an HD media player in the package cost. The WD TV player is a good option - it will play 1080p from a USB thumb drive. I just saw a pile of them at my local Best Buy on clearance for $71 each. My clients like them for trade shows since they're compact and solid state and will play on repeat for days on end. A similar option would be an Apple TV or other media player with a built-in hard drive.

Chris Harding · February 12th, 2010, 06:27 PM

Hi Guys

Thanks for all the input. Yeah, I guess it would be a rather waste of time! I was looking for maybe a 'sweetener' for packages but there to way too much work or cost if it were to be done correctly!!
When they are ready for HD it will appear and then I can offer either BD or other media

Chris

Alex Khachatryan · February 12th, 2010, 06:47 PM

Many people do not even have HDTV sets, but things going to change soon, since everyone upgrades TVs once in 3-4 years and prices go down quick.
I am in the process of designing packages for my service, and since I shoot and edit in HDV I have figured that it'll be cool to include a basic hard drive (in $70-80 range) with final product in HD.
For people who have HDTVs but no blu-ray players this could be the best solution (player and reliable storage)
LaCie | 320GB LaCinema Rugged Multimedia Hard Drive | 301460KUA

Andy B. Turner · February 13th, 2010, 12:09 AM

I am wanting to give clients their videos in HD as MP4 HD files. This is very quick and easy to give to them on a flash drive, DVD etc. I play these back all the time on my Western Digital HD player and a lot of clients have something like this (AppleTV etc.). To me, blu-ray is a dying format. The problem is copy protection. Not sure if there is a way to keep clients from making their own copies?

Philip Howells · February 13th, 2010, 12:44 AM

Chris

My guess is that for your market HD, and specifically, Blu-ray, is the future so my recommendation would be to remind them that buying your HD service they're buying the future ie have a sparkling DVD for now and know that they can come back to you in future when they've made the jump to HD and Blu-ray (or whatever!) and get from you (at a price of course) their wedding video in the HD format.

We're treating 3D in just that way. We've just introduced a 3D section in all our programmes. We record the key 15 minutes (the file limit of the system) on a locked off 3D camera and show that on a 3D screen at the reception. Because the system doesn't require glasses, it is a real "blow your socks off" experience.

Of course the technology's still in its infancy and the industry doesn't have a standard as yet - and for now it's full of drawbacks, eg the image quality is SD, the screen's 8inches etc, but the one key element for us is that we can keep the two streams archived so that when the industry decides what the standard will be we can offer today's clients the opportunity to spend a little more money with us buying the key moments of their wedding in 3D. (If you'll pardon the allusion, we're applying to our business the philosophy of the world's oldest profession - you've got it, you sell it, you've still got it).

Because it's new and still developing, and because the investment is modest in comparison to our main equipment, we simply add this as a free extra. It takes minutes to set up at the ceremony, one moment to initiate and a few minutes to set up the screen (which we've mounted into a large picture frame with explanatory information and our logo etc of course) around it at the reception and it loops automatically. It gets us publicity, kudos and notice and separates us from the rest.

In your shoes I'd treat HD the same way - just another marketing tool.

Philip Howells · February 13th, 2010, 12:49 AM

Chris

My guess is that for your market HD, and specifically, Blu-ray, is the future so my recommendation would be to remind them that buying your HD service they're buying the future ie have a sparkling DVD for now and know that they can come back to you in future when they've made the jump to HD and Blu-ray (or whatever!) and get from you (at a price of course) their wedding video in the HD format.

We're treating 3D in just that way. We've just introduced a 3D section in all our programmes. We record the key 15 minutes (the file limit of the system) on a locked off 3D camera and show that on a 3D screen at the reception. Because the system doesn't require glasses, it is a real "blow your socks off" experience.

Of course the technology's still in its infancy and the industry doesn't have a standard as yet - and for now it's full of drawbacks, eg the image quality is SD, the screen's 8inches etc, but the one key element for us is that we can keep the two streams archived so that when the industry decides what the standard will be we can offer today's clients the opportunity to spend a little more money with us buying the key moments of their wedding in 3D. (If you'll pardon the allusion, we're applying to our business the philosophy of the world's oldest profession - you've got it, you sell it, you've still got it).

Because it's new and still developing, and because the investment is modest in comparison to our main equipment, we simply add this as a free extra. It takes minutes to set up at the ceremony, one moment to initiate and a few minutes to set up the screen (which we've mounted into a large picture frame with explanatory information and our logo etc of course) around it at the reception and it loops automatically. It gets us publicity, kudos and notice and separates us from the rest.

In your shoes I'd treat HD the same way - just another marketing tool.

Chris Harding · February 13th, 2010, 01:09 AM

Hi Phillip

Great idea and much appreciated. Of course I do have the HD source as well for each wedding to future proof the bride.

I gave up trying to look at doing HD ..a 2 minute clip rendered to HD-WMV at 6mps takes around 20 minutes to render!!! Don't want to tie up the 'puter even for a 20 minute ceremony video!!

Now, I had no idea that you can do 3D without glasses???? The brand new Panasonic 3D TV system still has glasses with 100fps electronic shutters in them.

How does your system work without glasses???

Chris

Philip Howells · February 13th, 2010, 01:51 AM

Chris, it's the Fujifilm 3d w1 and v1. It uses what I believe is known as the Philip's system (not mine - the Dutch giant) and involves an updated version of the lenticular screen.

I have serious reservations about any television system involving glasses. They're fine in the cinema where everyone's wearing them - and where the experience is essentially "two-person" between the viewer and the film - very similar to radio. But television is a group experience. People talk over and about it and some in the room won't even be watching it. In those circumstances glasses are an impediment.

Having said that, the glasses-less option has a long way to go before it reaches the same quality as the cinema.

Chris Harding · February 13th, 2010, 04:02 AM

Hi Phillip

Ta!! I wasn't aware that the Fuji 3D W1 did video??? I thought it was just a stills camera???

That's a great idea though and will draw potential clients to the display and the company too!!!

On an 8" screen the video would still be sharp enough to look really good even if it is SD!!

Chris

February 12th, 2010, 06:21 AM	#1
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	HD Experience without BluRay?? Hi All I would really like to be able to offer my couples their ceremony video (at least) in HD but almost every couple has an HDTV but no BluRay player!! Has anyone else offered "non BD" brides HD in another format???? I was thinking of maybe a disk with HD WMV clips on it so they can watch it on their laptop and if it has an HDMI output, on their TV in HD!! I would say that most young people with have a recent laptop, none seem to have a BD player, PS3 or a media Player. Any ideas for people without BluRay to be able to get an HD version of their wedding (or even part of it???) Chris

February 12th, 2010, 01:03 PM	#4
Travis Cossel Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 2,933	Chris, look at this situation in two ways. First, if none of your customers have BluRay capability, then it's just not a priority for them yet. If they haven't purchased a player they probably aren't going to jump through hoops and hook up their laptop to their TV. So to me, it seems like a waste of time (and time is money) to provide them with extra formats they'll likely never use. Second, if you CAN get them to watch the other HD formats then you stand to educate them a little on the advantages. Perhaps the next referral they send your way will mention that they saw their friend's wedding in HD and it was awesome. Still, I think this is a stretch considering where your market is at currently. Bottom line .. I probably wouldn't pursue additional formats until you start getting some demand for HD content. __________________ Black Label Films www.blacklabelweddingfilms.com

February 12th, 2010, 08:44 AM	#2
Peter Manojlovic Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Hamilton Ontario Posts: 769	Honestly??? I wouldn't waste my time with other formats.... Unless it's a labour of love, and unless the customers are demanding this, you're probably going to lose out.... You can always archive the final product in HD, or keep the project files and assest, and when they're ready for BD, create the discs...

February 12th, 2010, 08:57 AM	#3
Forrest Burger Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Vancouver, WA Posts: 86	I don't do weddings, but with the cost of Blu-ray players coming down, would it be possible to roll the cost of a Blu-ray player into your package price? Then, of course, the couple would have to have an HDTV...which a lot of people do. Just a thought. Forrest

February 12th, 2010, 01:48 PM	#5
Chris Davis Trustee Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Willmar, MN Posts: 1,400	I don't know about weddings, but an option I have used for corporate customers is to include an HD media player in the package cost. The WD TV player is a good option - it will play 1080p from a USB thumb drive. I just saw a pile of them at my local Best Buy on clearance for $71 each. My clients like them for trade shows since they're compact and solid state and will play on repeat for days on end. A similar option would be an Apple TV or other media player with a built-in hard drive.

February 12th, 2010, 06:27 PM	#6
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Guys Thanks for all the input. Yeah, I guess it would be a rather waste of time! I was looking for maybe a 'sweetener' for packages but there to way too much work or cost if it were to be done correctly!! When they are ready for HD it will appear and then I can offer either BD or other media Chris

February 12th, 2010, 06:47 PM	#7
Alex Khachatryan Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 134	Many people do not even have HDTV sets, but things going to change soon, since everyone upgrades TVs once in 3-4 years and prices go down quick. I am in the process of designing packages for my service, and since I shoot and edit in HDV I have figured that it'll be cool to include a basic hard drive (in $70-80 range) with final product in HD. For people who have HDTVs but no blu-ray players this could be the best solution (player and reliable storage) LaCie \| 320GB LaCinema Rugged Multimedia Hard Drive \| 301460KUA

February 13th, 2010, 12:09 AM	#8
Andy B. Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: O'Fallon, MO Posts: 47	I am wanting to give clients their videos in HD as MP4 HD files. This is very quick and easy to give to them on a flash drive, DVD etc. I play these back all the time on my Western Digital HD player and a lot of clients have something like this (AppleTV etc.). To me, blu-ray is a dying format. The problem is copy protection. Not sure if there is a way to keep clients from making their own copies?

February 13th, 2010, 12:44 AM	#9
Philip Howells Trustee Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 1,212	Chris My guess is that for your market HD, and specifically, Blu-ray, is the future so my recommendation would be to remind them that buying your HD service they're buying the future ie have a sparkling DVD for now and know that they can come back to you in future when they've made the jump to HD and Blu-ray (or whatever!) and get from you (at a price of course) their wedding video in the HD format. We're treating 3D in just that way. We've just introduced a 3D section in all our programmes. We record the key 15 minutes (the file limit of the system) on a locked off 3D camera and show that on a 3D screen at the reception. Because the system doesn't require glasses, it is a real "blow your socks off" experience. Of course the technology's still in its infancy and the industry doesn't have a standard as yet - and for now it's full of drawbacks, eg the image quality is SD, the screen's 8inches etc, but the one key element for us is that we can keep the two streams archived so that when the industry decides what the standard will be we can offer today's clients the opportunity to spend a little more money with us buying the key moments of their wedding in 3D. (If you'll pardon the allusion, we're applying to our business the philosophy of the world's oldest profession - you've got it, you sell it, you've still got it). Because it's new and still developing, and because the investment is modest in comparison to our main equipment, we simply add this as a free extra. It takes minutes to set up at the ceremony, one moment to initiate and a few minutes to set up the screen (which we've mounted into a large picture frame with explanatory information and our logo etc of course) around it at the reception and it loops automatically. It gets us publicity, kudos and notice and separates us from the rest. In your shoes I'd treat HD the same way - just another marketing tool.

February 13th, 2010, 12:49 AM	#10
Philip Howells Trustee Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 1,212	Chris My guess is that for your market HD, and specifically, Blu-ray, is the future so my recommendation would be to remind them that buying your HD service they're buying the future ie have a sparkling DVD for now and know that they can come back to you in future when they've made the jump to HD and Blu-ray (or whatever!) and get from you (at a price of course) their wedding video in the HD format. We're treating 3D in just that way. We've just introduced a 3D section in all our programmes. We record the key 15 minutes (the file limit of the system) on a locked off 3D camera and show that on a 3D screen at the reception. Because the system doesn't require glasses, it is a real "blow your socks off" experience. Of course the technology's still in its infancy and the industry doesn't have a standard as yet - and for now it's full of drawbacks, eg the image quality is SD, the screen's 8inches etc, but the one key element for us is that we can keep the two streams archived so that when the industry decides what the standard will be we can offer today's clients the opportunity to spend a little more money with us buying the key moments of their wedding in 3D. (If you'll pardon the allusion, we're applying to our business the philosophy of the world's oldest profession - you've got it, you sell it, you've still got it). Because it's new and still developing, and because the investment is modest in comparison to our main equipment, we simply add this as a free extra. It takes minutes to set up at the ceremony, one moment to initiate and a few minutes to set up the screen (which we've mounted into a large picture frame with explanatory information and our logo etc of course) around it at the reception and it loops automatically. It gets us publicity, kudos and notice and separates us from the rest. In your shoes I'd treat HD the same way - just another marketing tool.

February 13th, 2010, 01:09 AM	#11
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Phillip Great idea and much appreciated. Of course I do have the HD source as well for each wedding to future proof the bride. I gave up trying to look at doing HD ..a 2 minute clip rendered to HD-WMV at 6mps takes around 20 minutes to render!!! Don't want to tie up the 'puter even for a 20 minute ceremony video!! Now, I had no idea that you can do 3D without glasses???? The brand new Panasonic 3D TV system still has glasses with 100fps electronic shutters in them. How does your system work without glasses??? Chris

February 13th, 2010, 01:51 AM	#12
Philip Howells Trustee Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 1,212	Chris, it's the Fujifilm 3d w1 and v1. It uses what I believe is known as the Philip's system (not mine - the Dutch giant) and involves an updated version of the lenticular screen. I have serious reservations about any television system involving glasses. They're fine in the cinema where everyone's wearing them - and where the experience is essentially "two-person" between the viewer and the film - very similar to radio. But television is a group experience. People talk over and about it and some in the room won't even be watching it. In those circumstances glasses are an impediment. Having said that, the glasses-less option has a long way to go before it reaches the same quality as the cinema.

February 13th, 2010, 04:02 AM	#13
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Phillip Ta!! I wasn't aware that the Fuji 3D W1 did video??? I thought it was just a stills camera??? That's a great idea though and will draw potential clients to the display and the company too!!! On an 8" screen the video would still be sharp enough to look really good even if it is SD!! Chris