Vintage wedding video looks -market? at DVinfo.net

Jeff Harper · January 12th, 2010, 02:49 AM

I'm considering marketing wedding videos with a vintage look. If you've studied the market or are doing this I'm interested to know a few things if you can advise.

1. The level of consumer interest for such a look.
2. What particular looks are most popular (for example sepia with borders and some scratches and jitter, etc.
3. What segment of the market has the keenest interest...or do all segments have an interest.

My current thought is to offer the look as an option only, as I am certain there are many who don't care for it at all.

Any thoughts?

Danny O'Neill · January 12th, 2010, 03:36 AM

From what ive seen over in the states there is a huge market for genuine film. Not video with effects but genuine, 8-16mm cinefilm.

Here in the UK though they seem to be all about having the best HD clarity they can.

Dimitris Mantalias · January 12th, 2010, 04:18 AM

As Danny said, in the US there is a big market for this. In Greece, this market is absolutely in zero demand. To be sincere, I never understood what the fuzz is all about the vintage look. Today with all the great 24p camcorders and DSLRs you can provide clients with almost real film-look videos with big-screen picture quality. Ok, the clients always like a bit of a vintage look for short parts in the videos, but here they would never accept a complete vintage. Maybe they are too right, maybe they are too wrong.

Chris Harding · January 12th, 2010, 05:44 AM

Hi All

This clip was in the Sony HV1000 forum but I really don't think my brides would go for it at all!! They expect sharp images and bright colours!! I guess the 8mm movie look might be OK for part of a show reel but I know I would dare not do a wedding like this one!!

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-hvr...-8mm-look.html

However it there is a market then grab it!! A niche market can reap huge rewards!! I guess it could be classified at "cinematic wedding video" ..we do have a guy on our East Coast that does real 8mm footage at your wedding for huge prices and he does very well out of it!! Might be the sorta thing the nouveau rich trendsetters might like???

Chris

Philip Howells · January 12th, 2010, 07:39 AM

My first observation is how all the respondents so far are outside the US but that may be the time zones.

Although I've not experienced it I can well understand why people might like to have their wedding documented in real film as Danny suggests - at least until they get fed up with getting out the projector, raising the screen and drawing the curtains every time they want to watch their programme.

Beyond that it puzzles me why anybody would want to have a lower quality image and poorer sound merely to give a false antiquity to their programme. If they'd dressed in period costumes and driven automobiles of the time it might have been justified but even then it feels like a gimmick to me.

My 1928 Pathé Baby is hand wound, two revolutions per sec; I think I stick with my Z1s!

Martin Mayer · January 12th, 2010, 08:12 AM

Have to agree with Philip - I can't imagine there's a real demand for this from "real, ordinary" customers (i.e. NON-film freaks).

Jeff, what makes you think there is such a demand? Maybe it's a U.S. thing I just don't get.

Would you take it further: with the audio quality being massively distorted/bandwidth-reduced for the "authentic 1920s telephone sound"? and distort the playback frame rate for that "18fps played back at 24fps" Keystone Kops galloping look? Seesh.

The product is of lower quality, more expensive, more hassle to view, loses the opportunity for a high quality record, etc., etc., ... Hard to think the lure of "real film" will attract anyone except a tiny number of (with respect) oddballs.

However, if I'm proved wrong, and this is the next big move in weddings in 2010+, I'll happily apologise.

Joel Peregrine · January 12th, 2010, 09:23 AM

Hi Jeff,

I currently use super8-looking vignettes within the full edit to break up the flow. My initial inspiration for this was a travel show I caught on PBS years ago - Globe Trekker:

The official Globe Trekker website

I shoot for these segments with faster camerawork. I also give the wedding party a camera to use all day. This footage becomes becomes the film segments also.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Harper

I'm considering marketing wedding videos with a vintage look. If you've studied the market or are doing this I'm interested to know a few things if you can advise.

1. The level of consumer interest for such a look.
2. What particular looks are most popular (for example sepia with borders and some scratches and jitter, etc.
3. What segment of the market has the keenest interest...or do all segments have an interest.

My current thought is to offer the look as an option only, as I am certain there are many who don't care for it at all.

Any thoughts?

Ken Diewert · January 12th, 2010, 09:27 AM

Feedback rolls in from around the globe...

The beautiful thing about shooting clean images is that you can post it so many ways. It's easy enough to but a sample on your site and call it 'vintage style'. Some people might like it - but the problem I see is - it's not unique enough to market aggressively because it's a relatively easy look to achieve.

Jeff Harper · January 12th, 2010, 10:13 AM

Thanks for the replies. What I'm doing at this point is refining the look, and offering as an option.

Dimitris Mantalias · January 12th, 2010, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Mayer

However, if I'm proved wrong, and this is the next big move in weddings in 2010+, I'll happily apologise.

I think that the next big thing (not of 2010 but of the near future) MAYBE will be the 3d shooting. It sounds like sci-fi now, but with the tremendous sucess of "Avatar" (what a movie!), the 3DTVs on their way and with Sony to prepare a 3D bluray version, we may have to re-consider our gear in the next 4-5 years. Panasonic releases a 3D camera at 20.000 dollars. Expensive but in a couple of years, it may cost around 8000, which makes sense. We'll wait and see what happens (I'd love to get my hands on a 3D camera though)!

Sorry for the off-topic though! :)

Dave Blackhurst · January 12th, 2010, 11:26 AM

IF 3D takes off (a big IF, IMO), it'll probably be an option in the future (I think someone in the 3D section of DVi posted a wedding short in 3D).

It'll be interesting to see if 3D has a perceived value that makes it more than a flash in the pan... HD acceptance is still mixed - I think more people than not are watching "SD broadcast" on their "aich vee tee vees" (most likely images with HD acquisition/processing, broadcast for SD display, but it will still look "better because of the HD in the chain).

3D has to have some quality that makes it suit the material - I can see it for video games, and some movies, but other than a bouquet being tossed "through the screen", what are the possible uses in wedding video?? This might make for a great discussion:

Presuming you could go grab a 3D camera off the shelf today, what do y'all see you'd use it for??

I think I'll start a new thread, don't want to hijack this one!

Jim Snow · January 12th, 2010, 08:16 PM

An interesting thought - videos shot today with "modern" techniques and equipment will be vintage some years from now. Imagine what the video scene will look like by the time a couple's silver or golden anniversary rolls around. Imagine how quaint a HD video will look when the future standard is holographic life-like resolution at umpteen gazillion dpi complete with ultra-smell or whatever. I suppose video creators at that time will be using 1920x1080 and 4K filters in an attempt to give their work the vintage look as well.

Steve Zugelter · January 12th, 2010, 08:33 PM

There simply is no substitute for the real thing. A few years ago I bought a digital hotcakes disc that had loads of filters on it including the 'film' fx. I used it a few times until I started shooting real film and its so easy to see the difference. The filter version looks as if its digital video with a filter applied to it. Real film doesn't have all those ridiculous scratches and infinite 'hairs' though it, but it does have a true organic nature to it that simply cannot be replicated. Just my thoughts.

Joel Peregrine · January 12th, 2010, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Zugelter

There simply is no substitute for the real thing. A few years ago I bought a digital hotcakes disc that had loads of filters on it including the 'film' fx. I used it a few times until I started shooting real film and its so easy to see the difference. The filter version looks as if its digital video with a filter applied to it. Real film doesn't have all those ridiculous scratches and infinite 'hairs' though it, but it does have a true organic nature to it that simply cannot be replicated. Just my thoughts.

I agree about the scratches, hair and dirt - to me they are distracting. And video is just too sharp - its just a strange situation that we tout high definition and then can't grunge it up enough to look like film. I do find that subtle grain, flicker, gamma, saturation, toning and vignettes can in the ballpark of a nostalgic film-look. I think too many times we base our creative judgements on peers rather than our own intuition and our target audience. It would be an interesting test to have a panel of brides-to-be view real film and film-looked video and record their gut reactions.

Chad Nickle · January 12th, 2010, 11:07 PM

I am glad Steve chimed in, there is simply no substitute for the real thing, IMHO these "Film Look" filters look like video with a filter applied, also, nobody is watching these on a film projector, we send our super 8 film to a lab called Cinelicious and they transfer it to HD quality files.

Sure, it is a niche market, but some people are willing to pay a premium price for a unique product you don't see every day.

January 12th, 2010, 02:49 AM	#1
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Vintage wedding video looks -market? I'm considering marketing wedding videos with a vintage look. If you've studied the market or are doing this I'm interested to know a few things if you can advise. 1. The level of consumer interest for such a look. 2. What particular looks are most popular (for example sepia with borders and some scratches and jitter, etc. 3. What segment of the market has the keenest interest...or do all segments have an interest. My current thought is to offer the look as an option only, as I am certain there are many who don't care for it at all. Any thoughts?

January 12th, 2010, 03:36 AM	#2
Danny O'Neill Major Player Join Date: May 2008 Location: Northampton, UK Posts: 915	From what ive seen over in the states there is a huge market for genuine film. Not video with effects but genuine, 8-16mm cinefilm. Here in the UK though they seem to be all about having the best HD clarity they can. __________________ mintyslippers.com

January 12th, 2010, 04:18 AM	#3
Dimitris Mantalias Major Player Join Date: May 2009 Location: Arta, Greece Posts: 342	As Danny said, in the US there is a big market for this. In Greece, this market is absolutely in zero demand. To be sincere, I never understood what the fuzz is all about the vintage look. Today with all the great 24p camcorders and DSLRs you can provide clients with almost real film-look videos with big-screen picture quality. Ok, the clients always like a bit of a vintage look for short parts in the videos, but here they would never accept a complete vintage. Maybe they are too right, maybe they are too wrong. __________________ "A successful wedding videographer is the one that offers for viewing some excellent videos and some boring videos, and gets positive reviews for both".

January 12th, 2010, 08:12 AM	#6
Martin Mayer Major Player Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Oxfordshire, UK Posts: 416	Have to agree with Philip - I can't imagine there's a real demand for this from "real, ordinary" customers (i.e. NON-film freaks). Jeff, what makes you think there is such a demand? Maybe it's a U.S. thing I just don't get. Would you take it further: with the audio quality being massively distorted/bandwidth-reduced for the "authentic 1920s telephone sound"? and distort the playback frame rate for that "18fps played back at 24fps" Keystone Kops galloping look? Seesh. The product is of lower quality, more expensive, more hassle to view, loses the opportunity for a high quality record, etc., etc., ... Hard to think the lure of "real film" will attract anyone except a tiny number of (with respect) oddballs. However, if I'm proved wrong, and this is the next big move in weddings in 2010+, I'll happily apologise. __________________ Martin at HeadSpin HD on Blu-ray

January 12th, 2010, 09:27 AM	#8
Ken Diewert Trustee Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Vancouver Island, Canada Posts: 1,200	Feedback rolls in from around the globe... The beautiful thing about shooting clean images is that you can post it so many ways. It's easy enough to but a sample on your site and call it 'vintage style'. Some people might like it - but the problem I see is - it's not unique enough to market aggressively because it's a relatively easy look to achieve. __________________ C100, 5DMk2, FCPX

January 12th, 2010, 05:44 AM	#4
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi All This clip was in the Sony HV1000 forum but I really don't think my brides would go for it at all!! They expect sharp images and bright colours!! I guess the 8mm movie look might be OK for part of a show reel but I know I would dare not do a wedding like this one!! http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-hvr...-8mm-look.html However it there is a market then grab it!! A niche market can reap huge rewards!! I guess it could be classified at "cinematic wedding video" ..we do have a guy on our East Coast that does real 8mm footage at your wedding for huge prices and he does very well out of it!! Might be the sorta thing the nouveau rich trendsetters might like??? Chris

January 12th, 2010, 07:39 AM	#5
Philip Howells Trustee Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 1,212	My first observation is how all the respondents so far are outside the US but that may be the time zones. Although I've not experienced it I can well understand why people might like to have their wedding documented in real film as Danny suggests - at least until they get fed up with getting out the projector, raising the screen and drawing the curtains every time they want to watch their programme. Beyond that it puzzles me why anybody would want to have a lower quality image and poorer sound merely to give a false antiquity to their programme. If they'd dressed in period costumes and driven automobiles of the time it might have been justified but even then it feels like a gimmick to me. My 1928 Pathé Baby is hand wound, two revolutions per sec; I think I stick with my Z1s!

January 12th, 2010, 10:13 AM	#9
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Thanks for the replies. What I'm doing at this point is refining the look, and offering as an option.

January 12th, 2010, 11:26 AM	#11
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	What would you use 3d for in a wedding video?? IF 3D takes off (a big IF, IMO), it'll probably be an option in the future (I think someone in the 3D section of DVi posted a wedding short in 3D). It'll be interesting to see if 3D has a perceived value that makes it more than a flash in the pan... HD acceptance is still mixed - I think more people than not are watching "SD broadcast" on their "aich vee tee vees" (most likely images with HD acquisition/processing, broadcast for SD display, but it will still look "better because of the HD in the chain). 3D has to have some quality that makes it suit the material - I can see it for video games, and some movies, but other than a bouquet being tossed "through the screen", what are the possible uses in wedding video?? This might make for a great discussion: Presuming you could go grab a 3D camera off the shelf today, what do y'all see you'd use it for?? I think I'll start a new thread, don't want to hijack this one!

January 12th, 2010, 08:16 PM	#12
Jim Snow Trustee Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Santa Clara, CA Posts: 1,104	An interesting thought - videos shot today with "modern" techniques and equipment will be vintage some years from now. Imagine what the video scene will look like by the time a couple's silver or golden anniversary rolls around. Imagine how quaint a HD video will look when the future standard is holographic life-like resolution at umpteen gazillion dpi complete with ultra-smell or whatever. I suppose video creators at that time will be using 1920x1080 and 4K filters in an attempt to give their work the vintage look as well.

January 12th, 2010, 08:33 PM	#13
Steve Zugelter Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 26	There simply is no substitute for the real thing. A few years ago I bought a digital hotcakes disc that had loads of filters on it including the 'film' fx. I used it a few times until I started shooting real film and its so easy to see the difference. The filter version looks as if its digital video with a filter applied to it. Real film doesn't have all those ridiculous scratches and infinite 'hairs' though it, but it does have a true organic nature to it that simply cannot be replicated. Just my thoughts.

January 12th, 2010, 11:07 PM	#15
Chad Nickle Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 84	I am glad Steve chimed in, there is simply no substitute for the real thing, IMHO these "Film Look" filters look like video with a filter applied, also, nobody is watching these on a film projector, we send our super 8 film to a lab called Cinelicious and they transfer it to HD quality files. Sure, it is a niche market, but some people are willing to pay a premium price for a unique product you don't see every day.