New Bridal Prep

Glen Elliott · June 27th, 2005, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

Hey Glen,
I was of the understanding that you had been converting your 60i footage? Sorry mate.

As for the slow mo, im running WM9 (heard about some issues with WM10)
the monitors im using are 12ms mitsubishi flat panels at 1152x864.
The jittery bit i was refering to was right at the end when the bride turns her head to the left (from memory) Its not that noticable, but after having afew slowmotion issues myself, i thought id mention that fix.
But like i said, its a gorgeous piece, and im sure the bride would love it..

cheers
P

Yeah that shot you described is a bit "stroby". It was slowed to 25% via the ctrl+drag then added a velocity envelope to slow it down even further.

I find that it starts to look like this when Vegas has to interpolate a large amount of frames due to extreme slow motion. Thanks for the input Peter.

Glen Elliott · June 27th, 2005, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralph Longo

Just as I start to feel good about my stuff again you post something new :) Your stuff is awesome I hope to get even remotely in your ballpark someday as a videographer.

Thank you kindly Ralph. Just watch as much work from the videographers you enjoy and you'll start to learn styles and techniques. I find that I make the most progress when I:
1. Experiment (through sheer experience)
and
2. Draw inspiration from other Videographers (studying work of videographers I find particularly talented)

Take care.

Peter Jefferson · June 28th, 2005, 12:55 AM

Hey Glen,
I find that when i need to slow things down to those extremes, i usually bring it down to 50%, render, replace, then slow it down aagain to 50% then render and replace. Also forcing a resample makes vegas draw an interpolation for a "simpler" algorythm, in therory keeping things on an even figure to the master frame rate, you can literally draw in fake frames (with time and multiple passes)

dude you really have some good material out there, I really do find inspiration from talented people, but im loathe to imitate (even though its the purest form of flattery)
Im yet to post afew clips for public viewing simply due to the market out here is so finite, that what one person may think is nice, another wont like the music etc which may then stop them from even contacting me.
My music and style choices are very different to what is regularly seen on this site.

Maybe ill throw something up with a hidden url for this site only.. i'll ask my web dude and see what he thinks. I dont think ive ever posted anything for viewing actually..

but one thing, i really do hope you charge these clients accordingly!!
with the amount of hours put into these projects, some people just dont appreciate the bigger picture and the work that it involves.

Glen Elliott · June 28th, 2005, 08:04 AM

Hey Glen,
I find that when i need to slow things down to those extremes, i usually bring it down to 50%, render, replace, then slow it down aagain to 50% then render and replace. Also forcing a resample makes vegas draw an interpolation for a "simpler" algorythm, in therory keeping things on an even figure to the master frame rate, you can literally draw in fake frames (with time and multiple passes)
Very interesting technique...I'll have to give that as shot. Another thing I haven't experimented with is super-sampling. Have you found that it can improve slow motion interpolation?

dude you really have some good material out there, I really do find inspiration from talented people, but im loathe to imitate (even though its the purest form of flattery)
Thank you kindly. I learned a lot of what I know through "imitation". Even my artwork- as a kid I used to draw images from comic books. Even though your copying your also teaching yourself as you go through the motions. In time I was able to draw very similarly to the artwork in the comics I copied.

Im yet to post afew clips for public viewing simply due to the market out here is so finite, that what one person may think is nice, another wont like the music etc which may then stop them from even contacting me.
My music and style choices are very different to what is regularly seen on this site.
Sounds great- I'd love to see some of your work.

Maybe ill throw something up with a hidden url for this site only.. i'll ask my web dude and see what he thinks. I dont think ive ever posted anything for viewing actually..

but one thing, i really do hope you charge these clients accordingly!!
with the amount of hours put into these projects, some people just dont appreciate the bigger picture and the work that it involves.
I'm getting there- I'm still around 2-2.5k behind some of the videographers in my region.

Leonardo Silva Jr. · June 28th, 2005, 09:40 PM

Hello to all, I am new to this industry, I am from philippines. would like to learn as much as possible from this site, will be using a gl2 for wedding shoots, any from you guys any advise from where i could start? and techniques in shooting wedding videos?

to glenn...from the post of other guys your video is good but i can not download the file...it would be great if you can send it to me via email...leonardosky77@yahoo.com if you don't mind...thanks ;)

Ralph Longo · June 28th, 2005, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen Elliott

Thank you kindly Ralph. Just watch as much work from the videographers you enjoy and you'll start to learn styles and techniques. I find that I make the most progress when I:
1. Experiment (through sheer experience)
and
2. Draw inspiration from other Videographers (studying work of videographers I find particularly talented)

Take care.

Thank you, as far as my experience goes, I'm still new at this I'm sure with time I will get very good. As far as #2 I watch everything you put up :)

Glen Elliott · June 29th, 2005, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leonardo Silva Jr.

Hello to all, I am new to this industry, I am from philippines. would like to learn as much as possible from this site, will be using a gl2 for wedding shoots, any from you guys any advise from where i could start? and techniques in shooting wedding videos?

to glenn...from the post of other guys your video is good but i can not download the file...it would be great if you can send it to me via email...leonardosky77@yahoo.com if you don't mind...thanks ;)

You may have checked it when it was down for a day or two. It's back up now.

Peter Jefferson · July 1st, 2005, 10:34 AM

Very interesting technique...I'll have to give that as shot.

((it makes a big difference as the differential between frams is actaully far more accurate as Vegas only requires to generate half the frames throgh interpolation.
for eg
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII this is your full second worth of data @ 25fps

half that down ot 50% speed
IOIOIOIOIOIOIOIOIOIO

the zeros repesent the interpolated fill in frame. this is ok, as the two frams are literally drawn with perfect differences

BUT if u extend it beyond 50%
IOOIOOIOOIOOIOOIOO

youll notice that there will be less reference material for the interpolation
It still looks good, but not as accurate.

if you
IOIOIOIO
then render out to
II*II*II*II*

I* being the new frames

then slow down again, you are given more accurate reference material which isnt as stuttery simply due to the abundence of original material.

This usually gives a 2:1 reference figure, compared to doing a direct slowdown from 100% down to 25% which in turn would give you a 4:1 difference and look like this
IOOOIOOOIOOO
Youd end up with less reference data and more interpolated data which cannot physically be as accurate or smooth as the original. It can be close, but its not the same..

"Another thing I haven't experimented with is super-sampling. Have you found that it can improve slow motion interpolation?"
Definately. If you force a resample of data or a transcode, supersamplig does wonders. And running it at 2, wont change the speed of the render. Running at 8 will take forever to render but its worth it, U can use this instead of my multirender slow mo retouine and get similar results, as the resampling or "redraw" is doubled, basically overscanned or oversampled (as in music oversampling routines)
It works well If your transcoding data or changing frame rates for different regions or specific jobs (anything which changes the physical structure of the original, excpet filters. Changes such as such as progressive conversion, field swapping, transcoding for different regions etc etc)

Thank you kindly. I learned a lot of what I know through "imitation". Even my artwork- as a kid I used to draw images from comic books. Even though your copying your also teaching yourself as you go through the motions. In time I was able to draw very similarly to the artwork in the comics I copied.

((Groovy :) I too like to see what people do.. although i do imitate certain shots, in this game i guess its to be expected that things will look similar. Problem here in Aus is that the market is so stale that any new ideas are usually ripped off real fast, hence the lack of online demos))

Sounds great- I'd love to see some of your work.
(ID love to show it.. id really like some fedback.. maybe when i finish these 9 weddings, ill be able to throw something up!))

but one thing, i really do hope you charge these clients accordingly!!
with the amount of hours put into these projects, some people just dont appreciate the bigger picture and the work that it involves.
I'm getting there- I'm still around 2-2.5k behind some of the videographers in my region.

((same here, Im too cheap for what they get, but for me, at the moment, its about building a good client base, and reputation. I charge about half of what i shoudl and take much longer to deliver as im so damn pedantic.. lol

Being in sydney, competition is massive and some guys have been at it for years. Theyve got the experience and the skills, but from the work ive seen, they al follow the same formula which is nice, but is extremely unoriginal (i actually supply about 80% of videographers in sydney with their supplies.. ive even shot for a few of them, so ive seen alot of different demos)

Sometimes i get a lil depressed when i see how much some of these guys charge, but i think that by the time i get to that level with domestic clients, my broadcast stuff will still be there. By then, these guys would be wanting to get into the corporate market (where i come from) SO im wher ethey want to be and theyre were i want to be..
Some of these guys dont do half the stuff i do.. yet.
I just try to think happy thoughts until the day comes when i can charge a standard 3grand for a basic wedding job and people will pay without question.

until then, its practice practice practice..

dude i really do think you can justify a higher rate. I dont knwo what your ultimate $$ goal is, however, your work shows how much u care for what u do.

Colby Knight · July 1st, 2005, 05:58 PM

Wow. I have something to aspire to on my next wedding! Great work!

What was the music used? Very, very nice. Excellent choice.

Glen Elliott · July 1st, 2005, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colby Knight

Wow. I have something to aspire to on my next wedding! Great work!

What was the music used? Very, very nice. Excellent choice.

Thank you. The song was from the How to Make an American Quilt soundtrack.

Joven OHara · July 5th, 2005, 04:29 PM

Hello Glenn- Just wanted to find out from you what kind of color correction do you do if any with Vegas? Your videos are so clear and color saturation is very good. Do you just eyeball it or do you have a preset that you use? plug-ins?
Thanks for the response!!! Great video as always and wish I can emulate your work even just a bit.
More power!!!!

Glen Elliott · July 6th, 2005, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joven OHara

Hello Glenn- Just wanted to find out from you what kind of color correction do you do if any with Vegas? Your videos are so clear and color saturation is very good. Do you just eyeball it or do you have a preset that you use? plug-ins?
Thanks for the response!!! Great video as always and wish I can emulate your work even just a bit.
More power!!!!

Thank you. Yes, all my vignette portions are artistically color corrected. Artistically meaning it wasn't mean to look 100% natural and neutral. I usually crush the blacks, push the saturation, and diffuse the highlights.

All effect I used are a combination of Levels, Color Corrector, and Glow.

Leonardo Silva Jr. · July 21st, 2005, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen Elliott

Thank you. Yes, all my vignette portions are artistically color corrected. Artistically meaning it wasn't mean to look 100% natural and neutral. I usually crush the blacks, push the saturation, and diffuse the highlights.

All effect I used are a combination of Levels, Color Corrector, and Glow.

these levels, color corrector and glow effects...do you use your eyes to correct them or do you use any monitoring instrument to do that? and if by eyes...i am very much interested on the basics how you do it by such. any points to look into when correcting? thanks, i keep on viewing the clip. ;)

Glen Elliott · July 22nd, 2005, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leonardo Silva Jr.

these levels, color corrector and glow effects...do you use your eyes to correct them or do you use any monitoring instrument to do that? and if by eyes...i am very much interested on the basics how you do it by such. any points to look into when correcting? thanks, i keep on viewing the clip. ;)

Both. I use an external studio monitor and use the visual aid of the Vegas histogram when I make changes to the exposure.

Regarding "pointers"- what are you referring to?...simple color correction or artistic filtering?

Leonardo Silva Jr. · July 22nd, 2005, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen Elliott

Both. I use an external studio monitor and use the visual aid of the Vegas histogram when I make changes to the exposure.

Regarding "pointers"- what are you referring to?...simple color correction or artistic filtering?

oh, visual aid of vegas' histogram? how is that done? pls bear with my ignaorance.

yup, pointers on how to do color correction and filtering? how the exposure is set to correct etc. thanks glen.

July 5th, 2005, 04:29 PM	#26
Joven OHara Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Fremont,CA. USA Posts: 50	Hello Glenn- Just wanted to find out from you what kind of color correction do you do if any with Vegas? Your videos are so clear and color saturation is very good. Do you just eyeball it or do you have a preset that you use? plug-ins? Thanks for the response!!! Great video as always and wish I can emulate your work even just a bit. More power!!!! __________________ To be.....or not to be

June 28th, 2005, 12:55 AM	#18
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Hey Glen, I find that when i need to slow things down to those extremes, i usually bring it down to 50%, render, replace, then slow it down aagain to 50% then render and replace. Also forcing a resample makes vegas draw an interpolation for a "simpler" algorythm, in therory keeping things on an even figure to the master frame rate, you can literally draw in fake frames (with time and multiple passes) dude you really have some good material out there, I really do find inspiration from talented people, but im loathe to imitate (even though its the purest form of flattery) Im yet to post afew clips for public viewing simply due to the market out here is so finite, that what one person may think is nice, another wont like the music etc which may then stop them from even contacting me. My music and style choices are very different to what is regularly seen on this site. Maybe ill throw something up with a hidden url for this site only.. i'll ask my web dude and see what he thinks. I dont think ive ever posted anything for viewing actually.. but one thing, i really do hope you charge these clients accordingly!! with the amount of hours put into these projects, some people just dont appreciate the bigger picture and the work that it involves.

June 28th, 2005, 08:04 AM	#19
Glen Elliott Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 2,898	Hey Glen, I find that when i need to slow things down to those extremes, i usually bring it down to 50%, render, replace, then slow it down aagain to 50% then render and replace. Also forcing a resample makes vegas draw an interpolation for a "simpler" algorythm, in therory keeping things on an even figure to the master frame rate, you can literally draw in fake frames (with time and multiple passes) Very interesting technique...I'll have to give that as shot. Another thing I haven't experimented with is super-sampling. Have you found that it can improve slow motion interpolation? dude you really have some good material out there, I really do find inspiration from talented people, but im loathe to imitate (even though its the purest form of flattery) Thank you kindly. I learned a lot of what I know through "imitation". Even my artwork- as a kid I used to draw images from comic books. Even though your copying your also teaching yourself as you go through the motions. In time I was able to draw very similarly to the artwork in the comics I copied. Im yet to post afew clips for public viewing simply due to the market out here is so finite, that what one person may think is nice, another wont like the music etc which may then stop them from even contacting me. My music and style choices are very different to what is regularly seen on this site. Sounds great- I'd love to see some of your work. Maybe ill throw something up with a hidden url for this site only.. i'll ask my web dude and see what he thinks. I dont think ive ever posted anything for viewing actually.. but one thing, i really do hope you charge these clients accordingly!! with the amount of hours put into these projects, some people just dont appreciate the bigger picture and the work that it involves. I'm getting there- I'm still around 2-2.5k behind some of the videographers in my region.

June 28th, 2005, 09:40 PM	#20
Leonardo Silva Jr. Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Manila, Philippines Posts: 124	Hello to all, I am new to this industry, I am from philippines. would like to learn as much as possible from this site, will be using a gl2 for wedding shoots, any from you guys any advise from where i could start? and techniques in shooting wedding videos? to glenn...from the post of other guys your video is good but i can not download the file...it would be great if you can send it to me via email...leonardosky77@yahoo.com if you don't mind...thanks ;)

July 1st, 2005, 10:34 AM	#23
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Very interesting technique...I'll have to give that as shot. ((it makes a big difference as the differential between frams is actaully far more accurate as Vegas only requires to generate half the frames throgh interpolation. for eg IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII this is your full second worth of data @ 25fps half that down ot 50% speed IOIOIOIOIOIOIOIOIOIO the zeros repesent the interpolated fill in frame. this is ok, as the two frams are literally drawn with perfect differences BUT if u extend it beyond 50% IOOIOOIOOIOOIOOIOO youll notice that there will be less reference material for the interpolation It still looks good, but not as accurate. if you IOIOIOIO then render out to IIIIIIII I* being the new frames then slow down again, you are given more accurate reference material which isnt as stuttery simply due to the abundence of original material. This usually gives a 2:1 reference figure, compared to doing a direct slowdown from 100% down to 25% which in turn would give you a 4:1 difference and look like this IOOOIOOOIOOO Youd end up with less reference data and more interpolated data which cannot physically be as accurate or smooth as the original. It can be close, but its not the same.. "Another thing I haven't experimented with is super-sampling. Have you found that it can improve slow motion interpolation?" Definately. If you force a resample of data or a transcode, supersamplig does wonders. And running it at 2, wont change the speed of the render. Running at 8 will take forever to render but its worth it, U can use this instead of my multirender slow mo retouine and get similar results, as the resampling or "redraw" is doubled, basically overscanned or oversampled (as in music oversampling routines) It works well If your transcoding data or changing frame rates for different regions or specific jobs (anything which changes the physical structure of the original, excpet filters. Changes such as such as progressive conversion, field swapping, transcoding for different regions etc etc) Thank you kindly. I learned a lot of what I know through "imitation". Even my artwork- as a kid I used to draw images from comic books. Even though your copying your also teaching yourself as you go through the motions. In time I was able to draw very similarly to the artwork in the comics I copied. ((Groovy :) I too like to see what people do.. although i do imitate certain shots, in this game i guess its to be expected that things will look similar. Problem here in Aus is that the market is so stale that any new ideas are usually ripped off real fast, hence the lack of online demos)) Sounds great- I'd love to see some of your work. (ID love to show it.. id really like some fedback.. maybe when i finish these 9 weddings, ill be able to throw something up!)) but one thing, i really do hope you charge these clients accordingly!! with the amount of hours put into these projects, some people just dont appreciate the bigger picture and the work that it involves. I'm getting there- I'm still around 2-2.5k behind some of the videographers in my region. ((same here, Im too cheap for what they get, but for me, at the moment, its about building a good client base, and reputation. I charge about half of what i shoudl and take much longer to deliver as im so damn pedantic.. lol Being in sydney, competition is massive and some guys have been at it for years. Theyve got the experience and the skills, but from the work ive seen, they al follow the same formula which is nice, but is extremely unoriginal (i actually supply about 80% of videographers in sydney with their supplies.. ive even shot for a few of them, so ive seen alot of different demos) Sometimes i get a lil depressed when i see how much some of these guys charge, but i think that by the time i get to that level with domestic clients, my broadcast stuff will still be there. By then, these guys would be wanting to get into the corporate market (where i come from) SO im wher ethey want to be and theyre were i want to be.. Some of these guys dont do half the stuff i do.. yet. I just try to think happy thoughts until the day comes when i can charge a standard 3grand for a basic wedding job and people will pay without question. until then, its practice practice practice.. dude i really do think you can justify a higher rate. I dont knwo what your ultimate $$ goal is, however, your work shows how much u care for what u do.

July 1st, 2005, 05:58 PM	#24
Colby Knight Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 111	Wow. I have something to aspire to on my next wedding! Great work! What was the music used? Very, very nice. Excellent choice.