Shotgun mic at DVinfo.net

Alex Chan · August 9th, 2004, 10:09 AM

I can't afford a wireless mic right now. I have a Senhezier MKE300 shotgun mic, is it ok for capture the sound from Groom and Bride during the ceremony?

If I get a wireless mic in the future, should I get one or two? Most company selling one.

Don Bloom · August 9th, 2004, 06:25 PM

Chances are you won't be close enough to use the on cam mic to get the vows. You would probably have to be very very close to them and frankly, most officiants really disapprove of anyone other than the bride and groom being right there on the altar.

Generally most cameras used today of the smaller variety, I.E., PD150/170-VX2000/2100, GL1,GL2, XLS and XLS1, JVC300 will only accept 1 wireless system WITOUT some type of additional equipment, like a Beachtek box. I use 2-150's for weddings and run 2 wireless but 1 goes to each camera, if I wanted to run both to the same camera I'd need a Beachtek or Studio1 box. Since I run 2 cameras anyway, I just run a wireless on each.
Don B

Alex Chan · August 9th, 2004, 08:46 PM

what about if the wedding is at a small chapel?

Don Bloom · August 9th, 2004, 09:38 PM

If it was me and I didn't have a wireless rig, I would rent one for the day. The chapel would have to be very small and honestly, IMO, I would not risk it. Over the last 21 years I have found out that to most B/G's the vows are the most important thing. This is the comittment they make to each other and that's what they want to hear.

HOWEVER, if you feel you can "get away" with it, then I suppose the shotgun in a small chapel would do. Mind you, I didn't say that I would do it.
You need to do what you feel is right.

Don B

Chris Thomas · August 27th, 2004, 11:33 PM

I use a shotgun for on cam audio, and a minidisc recorder on the groom. Works great, I much prefer the minidisc over wireless for the simple control over the audio in post, with a completely segregated, high quality audio source. I use the shotgun for the bulk of the ceremony, fading the MD up for the vows, and the minister, who is usually close enough to the groom for any important spoken words. I find that in most cases, the bride and groom are simply too noisy, restless or whispery, to create an audio track that can be used as a primary, even with the knowledge that they are wearing a mic. Relying on the shotgun for the primary allows for good ambient sound, and a pretty decent pickup for most spoken pieces. I plan to get another MD and split the channels to route a lav on a podium and a boundary on the floor for other key captures. Syncing the audio in post is a breeze.

Cesar Ruiz · August 28th, 2004, 07:23 AM

Even if it is a small chapel, you never know if the bride and groom are going to whisper.

Listen to Alex and get a minidisc recorder. Then you can use your shotgun as a backup.

I use solely minidisc recorders and I love all 4 of them.

If you're not pressed for time go ebay and get one. Just make sure that it has a microphone input jack. The models with a 70 or 707 usually do.

A $20 lav mike will also be needed. Get one from B&H (azden) or radio shack.

Good luck.

Alex Chan · August 28th, 2004, 07:32 AM

Thanks, I actually has a minidisc recorder. I just need to get a lav mic. Any suggestion? Any brand and model good? So I just need to put it on the groom right?

Mike Rehmus · August 28th, 2004, 09:38 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Don Bloom : Chances are you won't be close enough to use the on cam mic to get the vows. You would probably have to be very very close to them and frankly, most officiants really disapprove of anyone other than the bride and groom being right there on the altar.

Generally most cameras used today of the smaller variety, I.E., PD150/170-VX2000/2100, GL1,GL2, XLS and XLS1, JVC300 will only accept 1 wireless system WITOUT some type of additional equipment, like a Beachtek box. I use 2-150's for weddings and run 2 wireless but 1 goes to each camera, if I wanted to run both to the same camera I'd need a Beachtek or Studio1 box. Since I run 2 cameras anyway, I just run a wireless on each.
Don B -->>>

The PD150/170 doesn't require anything to handle 2 wireless setups. I do it all the time.

Don Bloom · August 28th, 2004, 10:12 PM

Hey Mike,
What I MEANT to say was that if you run the shotgun to 1 channel and the wireless to channel 2 and you wanted to run 2 wireless to channel 2, then you'd need the adapter.
My brain was far ahead of my fingers and when that happens, OOOOPPPPPSSSS!
Thanks for waking me up on that! :-)

Don B.

BTW, I've been meaning to ask, on your DSR 300 what lens do you use?
Canon,Fuji? Also which focal length?
Thanks,

Don

Scott Plowman · August 29th, 2004, 01:15 AM

have them say their vows seperate from the actual event. Tell the cusstomer that its best that way.. and thats how they say to do it.. And thats what were supposed to do. And then take the new vows and put them over the ceremony while you cut in and out of them at the altar.. whew.. pulled that out of my a@#. this woud fix an audio nightmare

Dave Wagner · August 29th, 2004, 08:42 PM

Chris,

Do you ever have a problem with the sync of the MD audio with the minidv video?

Thanks!

Chris Thomas · August 29th, 2004, 09:27 PM

Not usually. My recorder is one of the older models, which does not allow USB transfers from Minidisc, so I run the analog out through my camera then firwire capture audio only. I sync to a finger snap, clap or a cough.

The time code is 29.97 fps due to the camera capture, and the sync usually holds for the entire ceremony. I have only had to adjust it once over a 60 minute period, and I think it was because of a dropout on the DV tape.

I also use the recorder on the podium during speeches at the reception, which is a little harder to sync only because you have to sync each time you start and stop the recorder so if the speeches are not consecutive, you have to sync each one. Again, not too difficult, I just eyeball it in premiere, then zoom in on the timeline for more precision.

Cesar Ruiz · August 30th, 2004, 07:49 AM

Hey Chris,

Is there any reason why you pipe the audio through the cam? I currently just use the 'line in' on my sound card to grab analog from the minidisc.

Does routing through the cam and then firewire have an advantage I'm not seeing?

Thanks, always looking for the better way.

-Cesar

Chris Thomas · August 30th, 2004, 10:34 AM

Perhaps no... I have a cheap cam that I use exclusively as a deck, and an analog converter for my external video monitor (Costco currently has a deal on a toshiba FlatScreen picture tube 14" TV WITH 16x9 mode) that leaves the audio line in cables for the cam quite accessible on my desktop.

When I first got the minidisc recorder, I read a few forums that suggested sync was maintained better when converting the audio track to dv instead of importing a wav into premiere.

Honestly, I have never tried it through my sound card, as that would mean I have to pull out the old PC and plug in another cable! I figured why fix it if it ain't broke. My sync holds up very nicely over an hour of recording, if yours does too, great testimonial!

Cesar Ruiz · August 31st, 2004, 07:00 AM

OK, cool. I was just wondering if I was missing out on something...and I have to say that having one less cord snaking out of my computer is a good thing.

Plus, it sounds like a better way to avoid potential sound card eccentricities.

I'm going to try it out. Thanks.

August 9th, 2004, 10:09 AM	#1
Alex Chan Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 78	Shotgun mic I can't afford a wireless mic right now. I have a Senhezier MKE300 shotgun mic, is it ok for capture the sound from Groom and Bride during the ceremony? If I get a wireless mic in the future, should I get one or two? Most company selling one.

August 28th, 2004, 07:23 AM	#6
Cesar Ruiz Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Manchester, NH Posts: 182	Even if it is a small chapel, you never know if the bride and groom are going to whisper. Listen to Alex and get a minidisc recorder. Then you can use your shotgun as a backup. I use solely minidisc recorders and I love all 4 of them. If you're not pressed for time go ebay and get one. Just make sure that it has a microphone input jack. The models with a 70 or 707 usually do. A $20 lav mike will also be needed. Get one from B&H (azden) or radio shack. Good luck. __________________ Cana Video Productions, LLC Manchester, NH

August 28th, 2004, 09:38 PM	#8
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	<<<-- Originally posted by Don Bloom : Chances are you won't be close enough to use the on cam mic to get the vows. You would probably have to be very very close to them and frankly, most officiants really disapprove of anyone other than the bride and groom being right there on the altar. Generally most cameras used today of the smaller variety, I.E., PD150/170-VX2000/2100, GL1,GL2, XLS and XLS1, JVC300 will only accept 1 wireless system WITOUT some type of additional equipment, like a Beachtek box. I use 2-150's for weddings and run 2 wireless but 1 goes to each camera, if I wanted to run both to the same camera I'd need a Beachtek or Studio1 box. Since I run 2 cameras anyway, I just run a wireless on each. Don B -->>> The PD150/170 doesn't require anything to handle 2 wireless setups. I do it all the time. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

August 29th, 2004, 01:15 AM	#10
Scott Plowman Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Kansas City, Kansas, USA Posts: 85	have them say their vows seperate from the actual event. Tell the cusstomer that its best that way.. and thats how they say to do it.. And thats what were supposed to do. And then take the new vows and put them over the ceremony while you cut in and out of them at the altar.. whew.. pulled that out of my a@#. this woud fix an audio nightmare __________________ Panasonic DVX100A Frezzi Micro Fill 35 watt NRG power+ belt Sennheiser wireless G2 system Sennheiser ME66/ME64 Bogen tripod/ head and monopod AMD 2400* 2 gig CPU w/ 1 gig RAM

August 30th, 2004, 07:49 AM	#13
Cesar Ruiz Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Manchester, NH Posts: 182	Hey Chris, Is there any reason why you pipe the audio through the cam? I currently just use the 'line in' on my sound card to grab analog from the minidisc. Does routing through the cam and then firewire have an advantage I'm not seeing? Thanks, always looking for the better way. -Cesar __________________ Cana Video Productions, LLC Manchester, NH

August 9th, 2004, 06:25 PM	#2
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	Chances are you won't be close enough to use the on cam mic to get the vows. You would probably have to be very very close to them and frankly, most officiants really disapprove of anyone other than the bride and groom being right there on the altar. Generally most cameras used today of the smaller variety, I.E., PD150/170-VX2000/2100, GL1,GL2, XLS and XLS1, JVC300 will only accept 1 wireless system WITOUT some type of additional equipment, like a Beachtek box. I use 2-150's for weddings and run 2 wireless but 1 goes to each camera, if I wanted to run both to the same camera I'd need a Beachtek or Studio1 box. Since I run 2 cameras anyway, I just run a wireless on each. Don B

August 9th, 2004, 08:46 PM	#3
Alex Chan Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 78	what about if the wedding is at a small chapel?

August 9th, 2004, 09:38 PM	#4
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	If it was me and I didn't have a wireless rig, I would rent one for the day. The chapel would have to be very small and honestly, IMO, I would not risk it. Over the last 21 years I have found out that to most B/G's the vows are the most important thing. This is the comittment they make to each other and that's what they want to hear. HOWEVER, if you feel you can "get away" with it, then I suppose the shotgun in a small chapel would do. Mind you, I didn't say that I would do it. You need to do what you feel is right. Don B

August 27th, 2004, 11:33 PM	#5
Chris Thomas Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Burlington ON, Canada Posts: 118	I use a shotgun for on cam audio, and a minidisc recorder on the groom. Works great, I much prefer the minidisc over wireless for the simple control over the audio in post, with a completely segregated, high quality audio source. I use the shotgun for the bulk of the ceremony, fading the MD up for the vows, and the minister, who is usually close enough to the groom for any important spoken words. I find that in most cases, the bride and groom are simply too noisy, restless or whispery, to create an audio track that can be used as a primary, even with the knowledge that they are wearing a mic. Relying on the shotgun for the primary allows for good ambient sound, and a pretty decent pickup for most spoken pieces. I plan to get another MD and split the channels to route a lav on a podium and a boundary on the floor for other key captures. Syncing the audio in post is a breeze.

August 28th, 2004, 07:32 AM	#7
Alex Chan Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 78	Thanks, I actually has a minidisc recorder. I just need to get a lav mic. Any suggestion? Any brand and model good? So I just need to put it on the groom right?

August 28th, 2004, 10:12 PM	#9
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	Hey Mike, What I MEANT to say was that if you run the shotgun to 1 channel and the wireless to channel 2 and you wanted to run 2 wireless to channel 2, then you'd need the adapter. My brain was far ahead of my fingers and when that happens, OOOOPPPPPSSSS! Thanks for waking me up on that! :-) Don B. BTW, I've been meaning to ask, on your DSR 300 what lens do you use? Canon,Fuji? Also which focal length? Thanks, Don

August 29th, 2004, 08:42 PM	#11
Dave Wagner Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 28	Chris, Do you ever have a problem with the sync of the MD audio with the minidv video? Thanks!

August 29th, 2004, 09:27 PM	#12
Chris Thomas Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Burlington ON, Canada Posts: 118	Not usually. My recorder is one of the older models, which does not allow USB transfers from Minidisc, so I run the analog out through my camera then firwire capture audio only. I sync to a finger snap, clap or a cough. The time code is 29.97 fps due to the camera capture, and the sync usually holds for the entire ceremony. I have only had to adjust it once over a 60 minute period, and I think it was because of a dropout on the DV tape. I also use the recorder on the podium during speeches at the reception, which is a little harder to sync only because you have to sync each time you start and stop the recorder so if the speeches are not consecutive, you have to sync each one. Again, not too difficult, I just eyeball it in premiere, then zoom in on the timeline for more precision.

August 30th, 2004, 10:34 AM	#14
Chris Thomas Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Burlington ON, Canada Posts: 118	Perhaps no... I have a cheap cam that I use exclusively as a deck, and an analog converter for my external video monitor (Costco currently has a deal on a toshiba FlatScreen picture tube 14" TV WITH 16x9 mode) that leaves the audio line in cables for the cam quite accessible on my desktop. When I first got the minidisc recorder, I read a few forums that suggested sync was maintained better when converting the audio track to dv instead of importing a wav into premiere. Honestly, I have never tried it through my sound card, as that would mean I have to pull out the old PC and plug in another cable! I figured why fix it if it ain't broke. My sync holds up very nicely over an hour of recording, if yours does too, great testimonial!

August 31st, 2004, 07:00 AM	#15
Cesar Ruiz Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Manchester, NH Posts: 182	OK, cool. I was just wondering if I was missing out on something...and I have to say that having one less cord snaking out of my computer is a good thing. Plus, it sounds like a better way to avoid potential sound card eccentricities. I'm going to try it out. Thanks. __________________ Cana Video Productions, LLC Manchester, NH