Tossing in the Towel.

Chris Harding · July 24th, 2009, 12:14 AM

Hi Dana

Thanks!! You are probably right!! I watched my VHS wedding once and it's been in the draw ever since but yes, others will watch it more often!!!

I simply tailor my shoots to the market and at present the market is low budget documentary style. Sometimes we often forget that we are running a business and it makes sense to get work to create a good cash flow I try to minimise my capital expenditure to less than 20% of my income. No sense to buy two Sony EX3's to make $40,000 a year!!! Also no sense in offering Hollywood Style Productions unless there is a market for them!!
As they say "You have to cut your suit according to the cloth"

Yes, I would love to shoot higher end with awesome HD cameras and charge huge amounts of money but jobs would be very scarce at the prices

I'm married but my wife is in nursing and works weekends so that also works out well..as we both work on weekends!

Chris

Dana Salsbury · July 24th, 2009, 04:37 PM

So Michael and I both work 40+hr posts. Don't feel bad Chris, even though you're kicking back. Don't feel bad knowing we're sleep deprived and strain our eyes to the max. ;o)

You know, we have a conviction for quality video that helps us sell, but you have a conviction for video as well, but also for budget. It's just different business plans.

Michael Padilla · July 24th, 2009, 04:45 PM

Hey Chris do you have any footage posted?

Chris Harding · July 24th, 2009, 06:38 PM

Hi Michael

I have some samples on the link below..it's very basic documentary style shoots, nothing to rave about but my clients are happy and it puts bread on the table!!

Sample Wedding Video Clips

Chris

Susanto Widjaja · July 24th, 2009, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harding

Hi Susanto

I'm at the venue for 10 hours but I probably shoot onto 3 tapes (Cam A, Cam B and then a new tape in case the speeches go on and on!!) I am the cameraman and the editor so I shoot to edit. 90% of edits are purely trimming start and end points of each sequence. Take the ceremony ...I will add the bridal party arrival to the timeline from my "B" cam then drop in the "A" cam ceremony footage, overlay the cutaways from the "B" cam during the ceremony then finally add the register signing and congrats footage from the "B" cam. Short and sweet and fast to edit!!! I also have templates in Vegas filled with presets I have already done as well as pre-made DVD Menu templates so only the photo and couple's name need to be changed.

You are probably doing cinematic style video which I suspect would take ages to edit and cut to music!! All my weddings are documentary style so they are quick and easy and very fast to edit. If you are indeed doing Cinematic then 40 hours is more than justified I'm sure!!! but then again I make $1400 and you probably make at least $5K!!!!

I found the market here was documentary biased. All most brides wanted was a realtime recording of their wedding. I'm sure the Cinematic style has a market here but I notice that most Sydneysiders offer Cinematic ... my market is documentary here and the majority of brides have small budgets!!!

Chris

Hi Chris,

Like I said before, I don't think there's anything wrong with what you're doing. nobody can force anyone to do something. So do what works for you. but your method certainly doesn't work for me. I'd love to have a workflow like you though. with all the templates and everything. but I haven't found one for me just yet. You're probably right, I haven't got an enquiry from perth so far. I've got some from melbourne, adelaide, brisbane but not perth. I guess the market are so different there.

I still can' t believe you're spending only 5 hours on post though!.. thats crazy man..

oh yeah, I don't get 5k for most weddings. hahaha.. i wish it'll be straight on 5k all the way but reality sucks.

Cheers mate

Santo

Michael Padilla · July 24th, 2009, 07:06 PM

yeah its basic.. but man did you see that mansion?! Goodness there are so many great elements to shoot off of there.. next time you get a gig at Caversham give me a call and I'll shoot it with you :D

Sorry but that looks like there's a market for cinematic work.. I dream of shooting in locations that beautiful. And even a woman minister.. that's liberal$$.

I noticed your cameras.. they look really big. That could be a different from doing anything cinematic.
Wess & Jess :)

Well at least now know there is a market in Austrailia incase I ever decide to move outback mate.

I think your getting a very fair rate for the work your providing; I would probably be happy with that as well. You may want to consider having a higher package rate that includes a more cinematic shooting/editing style.

Also consider that the videos you are showing are also attracting the kind of customers you are getting. First thing I would consider is eliminating the 80's text and the 4x3 framing (even if you do it in post with a widescreen matte). I know David Perry for years shot exclusively on a GL2 and produced breathtaking work and always finished it with a widescreen matte.

Chris Harding · July 24th, 2009, 07:29 PM

Hi Michael
Caversham is actually a wedding reception centre...but we do have the odd Mansion too!!
I totally agree with you, there is a market for upmarket Cinematic videos. I actually was advertising two upmarket cinematic versions last year and never got a peep from them. Guess the recession is forcing people to cut back on weddings. There just seemed to be a better market (although not so creative and glamorous) in doing more straight forward stuff. Of all my clients last season (I did 29 weddings from Sept to May ..that's our "season") all asked for documentary style ...they simply wanted me to cover the wedding at a price they could afford. These sort of folk will either book me or get Uncle Joe to shoot their wedding as they just couldn't afford thousands for a video from a creative genius!!! I don't put my work anywhere near your creations...it's a different market completely. Yeah, the titles need some work and the 4:3 issue is being handled on another post here!

Hey Santo

I cost my weddings out at $70 per hour and a basic wedding from prep to reception end allows me 20 hours. (hence the 1399 price) To work a 10 hour shoot plus a 40 hour edit you would need to charge at least $3500 +++ and you probably have way more expensive cams than me to factor into your costing so your price should reflect that too!! $4000 would be realistic and affordable in Sydney but probably not in Perth (we are a tad poorer than you guys!!)

Thanks you both for your comments

Chris

July 24th, 2009, 04:37 PM	#32
Dana Salsbury Major Player Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 859	So Michael and I both work 40+hr posts. Don't feel bad Chris, even though you're kicking back. Don't feel bad knowing we're sleep deprived and strain our eyes to the max. ;o) You know, we have a conviction for quality video that helps us sell, but you have a conviction for video as well, but also for budget. It's just different business plans. __________________ www.LegacyHDV.com Weddings \| Corporate \| HMC150s \| FCPX \| Encore \| Lion

July 24th, 2009, 04:45 PM	#33
Michael Padilla Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: O.C., CA United States Posts: 337	Hey Chris do you have any footage posted? __________________ -M www.visualmasterpiece.com

July 24th, 2009, 07:06 PM	#36
Michael Padilla Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: O.C., CA United States Posts: 337	yeah its basic.. but man did you see that mansion?! Goodness there are so many great elements to shoot off of there.. next time you get a gig at Caversham give me a call and I'll shoot it with you :D Sorry but that looks like there's a market for cinematic work.. I dream of shooting in locations that beautiful. And even a woman minister.. that's liberal$$. I noticed your cameras.. they look really big. That could be a different from doing anything cinematic. Wess & Jess :) Well at least now know there is a market in Austrailia incase I ever decide to move outback mate. I think your getting a very fair rate for the work your providing; I would probably be happy with that as well. You may want to consider having a higher package rate that includes a more cinematic shooting/editing style. Also consider that the videos you are showing are also attracting the kind of customers you are getting. First thing I would consider is eliminating the 80's text and the 4x3 framing (even if you do it in post with a widescreen matte). I know David Perry for years shot exclusively on a GL2 and produced breathtaking work and always finished it with a widescreen matte. __________________ -M www.visualmasterpiece.com

July 24th, 2009, 12:14 AM	#31
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Dana Thanks!! You are probably right!! I watched my VHS wedding once and it's been in the draw ever since but yes, others will watch it more often!!! I simply tailor my shoots to the market and at present the market is low budget documentary style. Sometimes we often forget that we are running a business and it makes sense to get work to create a good cash flow I try to minimise my capital expenditure to less than 20% of my income. No sense to buy two Sony EX3's to make $40,000 a year!!! Also no sense in offering Hollywood Style Productions unless there is a market for them!! As they say "You have to cut your suit according to the cloth" Yes, I would love to shoot higher end with awesome HD cameras and charge huge amounts of money but jobs would be very scarce at the prices I'm married but my wife is in nursing and works weekends so that also works out well..as we both work on weekends! Chris

July 24th, 2009, 06:38 PM	#34
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Michael I have some samples on the link below..it's very basic documentary style shoots, nothing to rave about but my clients are happy and it puts bread on the table!! Sample Wedding Video Clips Chris

July 24th, 2009, 07:29 PM	#37
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Michael Caversham is actually a wedding reception centre...but we do have the odd Mansion too!! I totally agree with you, there is a market for upmarket Cinematic videos. I actually was advertising two upmarket cinematic versions last year and never got a peep from them. Guess the recession is forcing people to cut back on weddings. There just seemed to be a better market (although not so creative and glamorous) in doing more straight forward stuff. Of all my clients last season (I did 29 weddings from Sept to May ..that's our "season") all asked for documentary style ...they simply wanted me to cover the wedding at a price they could afford. These sort of folk will either book me or get Uncle Joe to shoot their wedding as they just couldn't afford thousands for a video from a creative genius!!! I don't put my work anywhere near your creations...it's a different market completely. Yeah, the titles need some work and the 4:3 issue is being handled on another post here! Hey Santo I cost my weddings out at $70 per hour and a basic wedding from prep to reception end allows me 20 hours. (hence the 1399 price) To work a 10 hour shoot plus a 40 hour edit you would need to charge at least $3500 +++ and you probably have way more expensive cams than me to factor into your costing so your price should reflect that too!! $4000 would be realistic and affordable in Sydney but probably not in Perth (we are a tad poorer than you guys!!) Thanks you both for your comments Chris