Vest-Arm/Stabilizer use in weddings

Mike Tucker · January 8th, 2009, 09:57 PM

Hey Bruce,

Your work is phenomenal!! I'm a new Steadicam user and I'm wondering what on camera light to use.. Can you provide any direction??

Thanks,
Mike

Bruce Patterson · January 9th, 2009, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Tucker

Hey Bruce,

Your work is phenomenal!! I'm a new Steadicam user and I'm wondering what on camera light to use.. Can you provide any direction??

Thanks,
Mike

Thanks, Mike!

We use on and off camera lighting. Mostly I use a LitePanel light and the 2-bulb Sony camera lights. Hope that helps and thanks so much for the kind words on our work - much appreciated! :)

Mike Tucker · January 9th, 2009, 09:34 AM

Hey Bruce,

I have tried the LP Micro and was not happy... Are you using the Micro or the Mini?? If Mini, are you using the spot??

Thanks,
Mike

Jason Robinson · January 10th, 2009, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny O'Neill

A quick release is a must. I use a couple of manfrotto units, one on top of my tripod and one on the glidecam. So I Can go from glide to tripod in seconds. Typically the wife is on the tripod/glidetrack at the front of the church. My tripod at the back so I Can glide in and out with the bride and then mount up for the ceremony.

That is almost the same setup I use. I bought a pair of the Bogen QR plate assemblies for $50 each and they are exactly what I need (though they screw with camera placement and balance since the QR plate site unnaturally far back). It is a relatively easy swap to put the cam from glidecam to multirig (mounted on tripod adapter).

Yang Wen · May 31st, 2009, 09:42 AM

resurrecting an old thread.

Regarding the steadicam/glidecams with the vest+arm. How much of toll are those on the body? Does the vest help spread out the weight? What I'm trying to get at is, are those setups feasible for a solo shooter for long term coverage if there isn't time to put it down and go to tripod?

Danny O'Neill · May 31st, 2009, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yang Wen

resurrecting an old thread.

Regarding the steadicam/glidecams with the vest+arm. How much of toll are those on the body? Does the vest help spread out the weight? What I'm trying to get at is, are those setups feasible for a solo shooter for long term coverage if there isn't time to put it down and go to tripod?

Quite a toll, they just move the weight from your arms to your lower back and bum.

Yang Wen · May 31st, 2009, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny O'Neill

Quite a toll, they just move the weight from your arms to your lower back and bum.

Oh well.. in that case.. I'm out

Charles Papert · May 31st, 2009, 04:02 PM

Well, hold on there guys. There's a major difference between how long the average person can shoot with a body-mounted stabilizer vs handheld. Given, say, a five lb camera payload on a handheld rig like a Merlin or Glidecam, most people can only manage about 5 minutes continuous shooting before having to put it down and rest, most should be able to manage a solid 20 minutes when configured with vest and arm. Many will be able to go longer, some significantly so. I'm pretty average in terms of strength; granted I have been hauling 80 lb rigs for the past quarter-century so I have built some specific musculature but when I did the test shot for my Pilot review here at DVI, I had the rig on for something like 2 hours straight and had literally forgotten I was wearing it (moved furniture around, took a phone call etc...!)

The bottom line is that most people will feel the weight in places they are not used to, plus until they get the proper form down, many novice users will be expending far more energy than is actually required. Case in point rigs that don't have integrated monitors; you have to hold the sled in front of you to get a look at the flip-out monitor, which is more tiring than holding it to the side. It is also critical that the vest is properly configured to distribute the weight properly, as this will affect fatigue level as well.

Practice is always important with a stabilizer, not only to improve one's skill level at framing and moving with the rig, but also to build up stamina.

So yes, I will maintain that the toll that a minimal camera package (<10lbs) and matched stabilizer takes on the average body is generally far less than the handheld equivalent.

Travis Cossel · May 31st, 2009, 07:00 PM

I concur with Charles. I use a Merlin with an XHA1 at weddings, and it's about 10lbs total weight. I use the Merlin/A1 combo all day long and it can be pretty brutal on your arm and back by the end of the day.

I got to try out the Pilot at WPPI and I flew the rig for probably 30-40 minutes nonstop. I had a screwed-up Achilles that I had been walking on for several days and was nearly to the point of not being able to walk anymore. Despite this, flying the Pilot was an absolute breeze and joy.

If I could justify the $5k purchase in my market, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Susanto Widjaja · May 31st, 2009, 07:29 PM

Could I just ask how do you put the pilot away on a wedding when you want to rest? is it safe to put it on the floor sideways?

Thanks

Ram Purad · June 1st, 2009, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Susanto Widjaja

Could I just ask how do you put the pilot away on a wedding when you want to rest? is it safe to put it on the floor sideways?

Thanks

Susanto,

I think the best way rest the pilot when not in use is to hang it on a steadistand or any other lighting c-stand. Pilot comes with the bracket (which holds the sled) that can be mounted to a stand.

Got my pilot last Thursday. End up with a back pain after the very first test run around the house :-) After some adjustment on the arm and the vest, 2nd run felt much better. Definitely there is a learning curve. Loving the added inertia pilot has to offer compare to the hand held merlin.

To the pilot + xh-a1 users, any one know where can I get a very short (>5") BNC to rca-video cable to connect the A1's BNC port to the rca port on the stage. I don't like the lengthy cable which came with the pilot. Don't like to rap around excessive cable to A1's handle.

Michael Padilla · June 4th, 2009, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Ganglfinger

In about 2 hours I am going to shoot my first wedding ever (in 10 years of wedding videography) WITHOUT a tripod.
I have rigged up my glidecam (which I have not used in years) with a 3 foot bar which goes into the handle of the glidecam and the other end rests in a socket attached to a special belt, kind of like something a flag bearer in the military might wear.
I also have a zoom controller attached to the glidecam since the camera will now be 6 inches over my head and the zoom will be hard to reach.
I believe I will be able to hold this contraption rock solid for 15-20 minutes. After the ceremony I will take the bar out and use it as a traditional glidecam for the reception.
I may try to put a picture up of the thing if anyone is interested.

Yeah.. we are generally the same.. as a skilled steadicam op, or shoulder rig system you can get away with it.. but I don't recommend it for the ceremony etc.. I actually tried this a couple of weeks ago.. and man I just shouldn't have.. im paying for it now.

Regarding the original post here are my recommendations: can't go wrong with Steadicam, Varizoom or Glidecam. The Varizoom Aviator is generally what I have used over the past five years.. and it has done the job nicely.. plus their rigs are on a massive sale right now so I hear!
If you want a handheld rig.. I'd probably go for a cheap used Glidecam on ebay.

Patrick Moreau · June 4th, 2009, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Padilla

Regarding the original post here are my recommendations: can't go wrong with Steadicam, Varizoom or Glidecam.

michael,

i think your a third right there. you can't go wrong with steadicam :)

glidecam is great when your first starting, varizoom is great if you want to overpay for something that underdelivers, but i don't know anybody who really progresses with their steadicam work and doesn't end up with a steadicam.

no wonder why the brand steadicam is used as a verb for the shots it create.

P.

Michael Padilla · June 4th, 2009, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Moreau

michael,

i think your a third right there. you can't go wrong with steadicam :)

glidecam is great when your first starting, varizoom is great if you want to overpay for something that underdelivers, but i don't know anybody who really progresses with their steadicam work and doesn't end up with a steadicam.

no wonder why the brand steadicam is used as a verb for the shots it create.

P.

Ok, rub my nose it in then hu?? So you want to sell your Flyer P.?

Hey I remember a time when you called me and asked if I would sell my Aviator to you :D LOL - Damnn.. I should have!

Ram Purad · June 4th, 2009, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Moreau

michael,

i think your a third right there. you can't go wrong with steadicam :)

glidecam is great when your first starting, varizoom is great if you want to overpay for something that underdelivers, but i don't know anybody who really progresses with their steadicam work and doesn't end up with a steadicam.

no wonder why the brand steadicam is used as a verb for the shots it create.

P.

Right on Patrick,

I know I made a good choice when I traded my Glidecam 2000 for merlin a while ago (MYW;-) And later upgrading to the pilot. Never liked the design of the Glidecam (odd gimbal handle position, inability to quickly micro adjust the stage). Loving the flexibility the pilot has to offer (adjustable gimbal, ability to add merlin weights to increase inertia, and quick micro adjustable stage knobs).

But I know its just a preference thing. I've seen silky smooth gliding shots coming out of Glidecam and other stabilizers.

May 31st, 2009, 04:02 PM	#23
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Well, hold on there guys. There's a major difference between how long the average person can shoot with a body-mounted stabilizer vs handheld. Given, say, a five lb camera payload on a handheld rig like a Merlin or Glidecam, most people can only manage about 5 minutes continuous shooting before having to put it down and rest, most should be able to manage a solid 20 minutes when configured with vest and arm. Many will be able to go longer, some significantly so. I'm pretty average in terms of strength; granted I have been hauling 80 lb rigs for the past quarter-century so I have built some specific musculature but when I did the test shot for my Pilot review here at DVI, I had the rig on for something like 2 hours straight and had literally forgotten I was wearing it (moved furniture around, took a phone call etc...!) The bottom line is that most people will feel the weight in places they are not used to, plus until they get the proper form down, many novice users will be expending far more energy than is actually required. Case in point rigs that don't have integrated monitors; you have to hold the sled in front of you to get a look at the flip-out monitor, which is more tiring than holding it to the side. It is also critical that the vest is properly configured to distribute the weight properly, as this will affect fatigue level as well. Practice is always important with a stabilizer, not only to improve one's skill level at framing and moving with the rig, but also to build up stamina. So yes, I will maintain that the toll that a minimal camera package (<10lbs) and matched stabilizer takes on the average body is generally far less than the handheld equivalent. __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

May 31st, 2009, 07:00 PM	#24
Travis Cossel Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 2,933	I concur with Charles. I use a Merlin with an XHA1 at weddings, and it's about 10lbs total weight. I use the Merlin/A1 combo all day long and it can be pretty brutal on your arm and back by the end of the day. I got to try out the Pilot at WPPI and I flew the rig for probably 30-40 minutes nonstop. I had a screwed-up Achilles that I had been walking on for several days and was nearly to the point of not being able to walk anymore. Despite this, flying the Pilot was an absolute breeze and joy. If I could justify the $5k purchase in my market, I'd do it in a heartbeat. __________________ Black Label Films www.blacklabelweddingfilms.com

May 31st, 2009, 07:29 PM	#25
Susanto Widjaja Major Player Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 622	Could I just ask how do you put the pilot away on a wedding when you want to rest? is it safe to put it on the floor sideways? Thanks __________________ If a picture is worth a thousand words, what about motion picture? website: www.papercranes.com.au \| blog: www.weddingvideosydney.net

January 8th, 2009, 09:57 PM	#16
Mike Tucker New Boot Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 20	Hey Bruce, Your work is phenomenal!! I'm a new Steadicam user and I'm wondering what on camera light to use.. Can you provide any direction?? Thanks, Mike

January 9th, 2009, 09:34 AM	#18
Mike Tucker New Boot Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 20	Hey Bruce, I have tried the LP Micro and was not happy... Are you using the Micro or the Mini?? If Mini, are you using the spot?? Thanks, Mike

May 31st, 2009, 09:42 AM	#20
Yang Wen Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 991	resurrecting an old thread. Regarding the steadicam/glidecams with the vest+arm. How much of toll are those on the body? Does the vest help spread out the weight? What I'm trying to get at is, are those setups feasible for a solo shooter for long term coverage if there isn't time to put it down and go to tripod?