Shooting your weddings in 30p or 24P?

[Mike Morrell]

Roger, I could not agree with your post more. I often think that I can "sell my services" to someone who thinks that paying anything is too much, but these customers, often prove to be the most difficult.

Stephen, thanks for the sympathy. You too are quite correct. Wedding videography is a tough biz. Often however, you are able to obtain great personal satisfaction from your customers. My last project that I turned in received the comment "That was the best wedding video I'd ever seen. It was like watching a movie of my own wedding." from the bride and groom. When you get kudos from the customers it does make up for a lot of the problems. But all the kudos in the world does not help you make a living.

[Peter Jefferson]

guys asking for the contracts, please check your mail.

as for the stigma of Video VS Still, there are many ways around this..

we, as videographers, have the means to pull miracles.. all we need to do is USE those means to a marketable effect.

there are many things we can do and services which are only possible from the tools in our studios which will make the photographer obsolete.. Thing is we need to offer it in a way where the photographer isn't threatened by us, and more importantly the end product is something the Bride and groom will be able to display openly...

Theres lots we can do, and theres no harm in taking a risk...
Ive done it to good effect, and its one of the things which hooks the client to me from the opposition...

we have the technolgy, we just have to use our imaginations to ge the most out of it

[Mike Morrell]

Peter, thanks bunches! There are a few points in the contract which I had never thought of. Good stuff.

As far as threatening the photographer goes, I did this recently and unintentionaly. I've learned that I need to make contact with the photographer prior to the event to explain what I'm doing and why I'm doing it. I think that I scared a photographer when he showed up and saw me with the same still camera that he uses. I take high quallity stills for use in the video and for use with the DVD packaging. My end DVD winds up attracting a lot of attention when placed on the bride's video shelf and a lot of this has to do with the quallity still photographs that I take. But when one shows up with a high end still camera and lenses, the photographer may think that you are selling stills and will cut them out of their sales. I'm not trying to do this and from now on, I'll make contact with the photographer ahead of time so that they don't get upset.

[James Sudik]

I would greatly appreciate a look at the contract mentioned here. I am preparing to do my FIRST wedding (yikes) this June. This would be of great benefit to me I'm sure, so I can't ask humbly enough. This thread, and a few others, has just about scared me off, and I am only looking to do this on my off-time from my regular job. Hope this bump is seen by those that could help, thanks in advance!

[Kevin Kwak]

Mr. Jefferson, I would like a copy of the contract for future reference. Thank you.

[Ray Boykin]

Peter,
Could you please send me your contact? Thank you in advance.

[Norman Woo]

I shoot all my weddings in 30P mode which is FRAME mode on the XL1. The exception to this is during the reception which I shoot in NORMAL mode because I have to go down to 1/30th of a second (The XL1 does not support any shutter speed below 1/60th in FRAME mode - which is not for case for the XL1s and XL2). For most of the dances I go down to 1/15th and sometimes 1/8th of a second to get those streaking slo-mo effects. Everybody loves those shots.

Can't wait to get my XL2 when I can shoot entirely in 30P mode.

Most of the comments I get back is the 'film' look quality of the wedding video.

[Cesar Ruiz]

I like Norm, always shoot in 30P using my GL2s and their Frame mode!

Clients love the "film"ier look. They can't really pinpoint the difference. Adjectives such as dreamy, surreal, better are used. Most don't even mention that it looks more like a movie. They just mention it doesn't look like home video and that makes them happy.

Norman, how do you handle slo-mo with your 30P. Currently, editing with Vegas, I just let Vegas do its thing with the defaults and if something looks really bad afterwards, I disable the resampling and opt for the more stuttery, but sharper look.

Any hints?

[Andre Andreev]

1. Peter, please CC me with that contract ( aaandre at gmail dot com)

2. I've noticed that autofocus is much much slower in 24p (and in 30p) mode on the DVX100A. As I have to constantly be aware of the iris / nd filter / color temperature settings (moving inside out etc.) I prefer to leave focus on auto. Maybe when we get into really high-end weddings we can hire a focus puller :)

Also, when shooting a wedding I always keep in mind that I might be slowing down some of the footage and therefore prefer to work in 60i mode, using the cinegamma color/knee settings.

And yes, we work with 2 DVX100A cameras so consistency of 24p footage wouldn't be a problem.

<off topic>Oh, and after watching our last wedding dvd yesterday, I must say that the DVX is an awesome camera! The colors are unbelievable.</off topic>

Regards
-- Andre

[Norman Woo]

Slo-mo in 30P is a pain in the a**. (I typed in those asterisks ...)

I use Adobe Premiere 6.5 and using slo-mo via the speed effect (I always use 50%), there is a slight stutter effect. To minimimize it (I can never get it as smooth when shot at NORMAL mode) a bit more, here's a trick: Take a copy of the clip and over lay on top of the original one but offset it by about a Frame to the right. Put the opacity of the new clip at about 40%. This has the effect of "blending" the frames together.

Another thing is to slow down those pans when shooting in 30p mode.

I once left the 30p mode on by mistake while filmming a segment for a local TV cable station here in Montreal (OK it's CH). Shooting at another angle was one of my DigiBetacam friend. When the producer saw our footage he couldn't help but beam with excitement and gave my friend all the credits for the "film-look" shots. Gee what an insult. My friend shook his head and pointed to my XL1 and said the shot came from "that camera".

I think I found a new friend ...

Now with that XL2 we're gonna take over the world!!!

[Dylan Couper]

60i is what I would shoot in. I've shot a wedding or two, but I've edited other peoples crappy wedding footage many times (it buys me vodka), and most of the time I end up using lots of slow motion effects that, as Norman said, would be a huge pain in the ass at 30p, and twice as bad at 24p.

If I had to do it again, 60i is the way to go. Artisticaly, the right piece in slow motion will deliver 10x the impact of shooting the whole thing in 24p, which most people wouldn't care about unless you told them about it in the first place.

[Ransom Tyer]

Thanks, Great advice from everyone here.

Has anyone tried using Trixtor or Re-Timer to slo-mo 30P footage?

I'm doing a wedding soon and I guess I want the best of both worlds, 30P (w/DVX100A) and good slo-mo and I'm willing to invest in one of these plugins to get it.

Thanks.

[Dylan Couper]

Haven't tried them. I've been pretty happy with the slow-motion in Vegas.

[George Ellis]

A little off topic, but I had an idea while reading... As a part for a demo reel, why not ask a receptive/apprecitive bride/groom if you can use an alternate camera at their wedding for your demo reel. Have someone 'video' the service and some reception work with a consumer cam like Uncle Bob. Picture in Picture that into your demo footage. The hand shaking, zooming, tunnel audio might help sell why someone wants to hire a pro?

Maybe?

[Dylan Couper]

George, it's a good idea but...
PUT IT IN A NEW THREAD!!! :)

Seriously, it's going to get missed by most people if you drop it at the bottom of a long thread.