Shark Tank for UWOL #5

[Kevin Railsback]

Marco,

You shouldn't worry if you get a HM, the win or nothing at all.

It's just an opinion. You're never going to make everyone happy.

I bet if you had different judges go over previous challenges, you'd get different results.

The key thing is how YOU feel about it.

I know I could slap something together to stay out of the tank. I mean I could do a day in the life of a cow or something. But, I'd feel like I was cheating myself.

So, don't get down on yourself. I don't worry about the level of films that are being entered. There will always be people that can shoot and edit better than I could ever dream of. I mean I look at the films being entered and I'm just blown away But as long as I can see progress in my work and I can live with my work, that's all that matters.

At least that's how I feel about it. :)

[Marco Wagner]

Makes sense to me. Thanks for the re-up Kevin. Your right about the judging thing. It is so hard in these contests to gauge what type of judge the "judge" is. In some cases it's all the entrants, in others maybe a single person or small circle. I don't get too down about it, heck, at least it's free to enter, lol...

[Meryem Ersoz]

you all have no idea how freaking difficult it is to pick a winner in this thing....every judge who has ever participated has commented on that exact issue.

[Geir Inge]

Originally Posted by Meryem Ersoz

you all have no idea how freaking difficult it is to pick a winner in this thing....every judge who has ever participated has commented on that exact issue.

I know perfectly well how they feel.
In Norway we have, each year in January, something called UKM ( Culture Youth Gathering) much like the "Battle of bands if you heared about it. There's a gathering in everyone of our 431 commune and the age is from 10 to 25 years. The youth is participating in different categorys and I've been in the jury in our commune so tell me; how can you put a piano playing girl or boy up against a rock band, painting artist, dancing troup, flute players or even one who's made a go cart? We are, the jury, to choose 4 of the acting numbers that will participate in the gathering for the county, then on to the national gathering. It's hopeless if you ask me. But it's fun for the kids, it's a opportunity to perform on a big stage and show what your good in.

So I think the uwol jury's doing quite well, and I might envy Brian for his polar bears, Per Johan for his musk ox, but I don't envy the jury their job :)
I salute them, cheers!

[Meryem Ersoz]

Originally Posted by Geir Inge

so tell me; how can you put a piano playing girl or boy up against a rock band, painting artist, dancing troup, flute players or even one who's made a go cart?

that's pretty much how it is judging UWOL! weighing someone's macro piece against a great timelapse against a completely unique approach to the theme. et cetera.

just because you don't win or don't even make the final cut doesn't mean you didn't make a great film. the level of competition is pretty serious...i think DJ summed it up perfectly when she said, in any given moment, any one of the top four entries could have won, but in one particular moment, the one moment that counted, the judge had to settle on one, not four....

so don't take any of it personally, as kevin sums up nicely, when we make a great film and improve our craft, we win. that's the real goal. that other form of winning is just the carrot on the stick that we little bunnies are chasing.

it's great fun to run a contest that i probably could not even win, given the quality of the top entries....some days, it's great to be judge!

[Brian McKay]

Hello Guys:

I find it so interesting this topic of the compatition part of the challenges. I'm without question one of the most competative people you'll ever meet. That's why I'm sitting here nursing a broken sholder blade, cracked ribs and my brand new metal collar bone...don't ask...lets just say that during a race in late July I parted company with my motor bike.

Back to the UWOL challenges, for some odd reason I haven't looked at them as a compatition but more of an opportunity to give new found friends an insight into life in the arctic and at the same time have the opportunity to travel to Norway, California, Africa and a little (soon to be gone) park in Washington. Don't get me wrong I'd love to win but honestly it's absolutely secondary. I'm looking forward to showing you some animals that you don't see everday as well as looking forward to seeing what others had opportunity to film.

Brian

[Steven Gotz]

I don't know that I will ever be able to win. But to be given an honorable mention in the top four would certainly assure me that I am on the right track. And that is what I really want. To get better and better until I get more positive commens than negative, then perhaps make the top four.

[Kevin Railsback]

Steven,

I'd put more weight on the feedback than whether or not you place or win.

If you have a large group of diverse people telling you the same thing then you can bet that's how your work is being perceived. It's still people's opinions and you still can disagree. But, what you think and feel about the work may not be coming across to the rest of us. A small change in the edit or music might make a big difference to how your work feels or looks to other people.

I may have told this story before here but bear with me if I did.

I did a documentary on mountain lions returning to Iowa. I entered it in a bunch of festivals. Even my local film festival rejected it. I changed a couple things I got from feedback and entered it in more festivals. The changes were very minor. But then it started getting into festivals, won a couple international festivals for best documentary etc.

To me it was the same film. But it was perceived differently and suddenly it was an award winner.

The biggest change was getting a professional to do the VO. Same script, just a different way of presenting the words.

So please, don't hang you hat on winning or placing in order to be successful. It's just one persons perception of your film.

If twenty of us here say oh yeah, don't do that, then maybe take a look at a different way of doing the same thing. Doesn't mean we're right either. But, it doesn't take a win or to place to be on the right track.

I'm not saying it doesn't feel good to win and I'm not trying to sound like a sad sack to those who have. But, to have Mat or Per or you or anyone else say "Man, the really moved me." That means WAY more to me.

To show Meryem some work and have her say it brought tears to her eyes, THAT means more to me.

I went back and read the feedback for your last challenge film. Read them again. People are liking what you're doing. THAT my friend is being on the right track! :)

All righty, I gotta run. I really hate not having a free day until the middle of October!

[Meryem Ersoz]

i agree with every word that kevin said, but it is also good to have goals, like steven. if your goal is improvement, it helps a lot to imagine yourself in the company of some of the most consistently best players and to learn from how they handle their cameras, sound equipment, editing systems, compression schemes, etc. and then add your signature to a similar technical expertise.

i'm proud of the UWOL judging system, actually, because there's no room for any individual or set group of shooters to develop a reputation which tilts the outcome. the regular players may know who those people are, but the judge doesn't, and every contest is judged with a set of completely fresh eyes. whether you agree with the judge's final selection or not, you can trust that each contest is a brand new day, and anyone has the capacity to win on any given month.

discussing how to maximize the use of the judging to improve your skills is way more fun than watching people swim with sharks. kind of a hijacking but an interesting hijacking....

[Steven Gotz]

Don't misunderstand, it is certainly the feedback that is important. However, getting to the point where I get to bring tears to someone's eyes is the real goal. It means I am actually listening to the feedback, you know?

[Mat Thompson]

I think Kevins got it spot on. He and Meryem know how I feel about feedback and for me apart from actually completing finished productions its definately the best part about uwol to me. On a side note I do wish people we're more inclined to critique rather than pat on the back but I've always been that way....I'm thick skinned and believe in praising where its due but telling it how it is....if somethings bad or not working then tell me! Every time this happens you look at things from another angle, every new angle brings greater depth to your creativity!

This said everyone likes to feel like they've achieved and I know I was buzzing for a couple of days when the Fisher King did me proud....especially with the grief I'd given Meryem about the topic choice ;-) !

Its been great to see the improvement in everyones work and be a small part of that improvement as part of our uwol community.

Keep it up folks :)

[Per Johan Naesje]

Kevin is indeed spot on! This challenge has given me very much from the feedback to my films. Others see my film from viewpoints I haven't thought about.

I just wonder if Meryem foresee that this challenge should develop such a strong group worldwide and still growing. It also seem that we have a large audience viewing our films and threads, there's always many guests looking into our community when I'm online.

[Gabriel Yeager]

Theres a pretty good chance I will actually be taking a swim this time...

After reading all this, I definitely am thinking I wont be submitting anything.
Kevin has a great point.

Can't wait to see the entrys though.
~Gabriel

[Trond Saetre]

Don't bail out yet, Gabriel.
You still have one more week to come up with something.
The shark tank is not ready for you yet. :-)

[Kevin Railsback]

Hey Gabriel,

Don't bail just cause of what I said.

Is it a time issue or a subject issue?

I may have a solution that will keep you out of the tank. I'll have to go read the rules. In fact, it might not even be in the rules but Meryem had it in a post.

I'll email you and we can talk about it tomorrow. I'm whipped and need to egt some Z's so I can drag myself out of bed again at 5:30 and repeat my never ending day. Can't wait for Thanksgiving to get here so I can actually sleep in for a day or two. :)

Anyway, I'll send you an email tonight so we can chat tomorrow. I don;t have internet access during the day but I can email with no problem.