Long-billed Curlew, EX3 at DVinfo.net

Jerry Merrell · September 26th, 2009, 03:53 PM

I am still trying to improve my technique and would be grateful for constructive critiques. I am shooting with an EX3, Nikkor 70-200 f2.8 lens, -3 gain, shutter @ 180 degrees, 1080p 30fps. I have recently switched from Cine4 to Cine1 settings. I processed this clip with Avid Liquid 7 (increased saturation and applied unsharp mask).

I am particularly interested in comments about framing, panning technique, colors, post-processing and sharpness.

YouTube - Long billed Curlew

Thanks!

Jerry Merrell

Steve Phillipps · September 26th, 2009, 04:16 PM

2 comments I'd make: get a better tripod, and be good to grade the pictures as they look very washed out (no doubt due to the Cine settings - these are designed to make flat pictures containing as much dynamic range as possible for you to work on afterwards).
Also try some slightly higher frame rates - this often makes small bird movement look more natural and takes the edge of some of the camera movement.
Cheers,
Steve

Jerry Merrell · September 26th, 2009, 06:21 PM

Steve, Thanks for the comments. I will experiment with grading the pictures.

I was recording at 30 fps. Are you recommending overcranking and playing back at 30 fps or shooting at 60i?

Jerry

Steve Phillipps · September 27th, 2009, 01:27 PM

If you're playing back at 30P try shooting maybe 40 or 50 fps, it's a funny thing but animal movement often looks a lot nicer (and actually more natural) when slowed a bit. You'd probably be surprised how much TV nature footage is off-speed without people even knowing.
I'm no editor so don't know the ins and outs of grading but in essence you're trying to put contrast back into the flattened shots, so deepen the blacks and brighten the whites.
Steve

Jerry Merrell · September 27th, 2009, 04:30 PM

Steve,

Here is the reprocessed clip.

Although I am comfortable with digital SLR RAW files, color grading video is new to me. I adjusted the RGB histograms individually to darken blacks, enhance the highlights and add more contrast.

YouTube - Long-billed Curlew - reprocessed

Thanks for the comments. I will experiment with overcranking and start shopping for a better tripod.

Jerry

Jonathan Betz · September 28th, 2009, 10:12 AM

You are definitely moving in the right direction with regards to grading.

When framing shots, make sure you always consider the rule of thirds. You did well to place the curlew toward the right third of the frame initially, but as the shot progresses the shift toward centered framing leaves something to be desired. It is sometimes difficult, especially when just starting out, to avoid centering subjects during pans, but with practice the rule of thirds will become more second nature and you won't even need to think about it (I also think that you will find it easier to focus on framing once you are no longer struggling with an insufficient tripod). I can see where this would be a unique challenge for someone transitioning from still photography to video since maintaining good framing while both the camera and subject are moving can be quite difficult. Keep up the good work!

Bo Skelmose · September 28th, 2009, 11:34 AM

Hi
I see no problems in framing the bird - the air in the picture are in front of it, as it is walking - when it stops and turns you center it - now you cannot tell which way it will walk - if it will? Only problem, as I see, is the stative that is not smooth enough - it could be because of a cheap stative or wind on the camera or yourself when moving - sometimes I grab the head of the stative instead of the pin sticking out to make a smooth pan....

Ofer Levy · September 28th, 2009, 08:15 PM

Hi Jerry,

The repost looks lovely to me!
As to the slight vibrations you get I do the following which really helps:
To avoid the vibrations caused by the wind I always use a hide which blocks the wind - extremely useful.
In order to avoid vibrations caused by touching the camera/handle/tripod I attach a rubber band to the handle and only touch it. Also very effective.

Keep it up mate,

Regards,

Ofer

Jonathan Betz · September 28th, 2009, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bo Skelmose

I see no problems in framing the bird...

I understand the practical reasons for centering the bird once it stops because you don't know which way it might move, but that doesn't mean there isn't room for improvement. Sometimes the best shots come from taking a guess as to which direction an animal might move. Nice work though Jerry. Overall I think the shot is a success.

Ofer Levy · September 29th, 2009, 03:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonathan Betz

I understand the practical reasons for centering the bird once it stops because you don't know which way it might move, but that doesn't mean there isn't room for improvement.

I also can't see any issue with the framing and personally wouldn't have done it any other way. I would have zoomed in if it was possible but framing is fine IMHO. As I am sure you know, composition has a lot to do with personal taste as opposed to sharpness, exposure etc. The "rule of thirds" is only a suggestion and the actual framing can be fantastic even without following this "rule" - it all depends on the shot and personal taste.
Cheers,
Ofer
Ofer Levy Photography

Jonathan Betz · September 29th, 2009, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ofer Levy

The "rule of thirds" is only a suggestion

True. I think the shot is solid and honestly, in what was perhaps a futile attempt to be helpful :), I was just looking for ways it *might* be improved.

Jerry Merrell · September 29th, 2009, 06:30 AM

Thank you for all the helpful comments.

Jerry

Steve Phillipps · September 30th, 2009, 04:07 PM

Nice Jerry.
The old advice about tripods is still true, buy the most expensive you can afford and the heaviest you can carry.
My favourites for the EX3 would be Ronford 2004 or O'Connor 1030, but I know a lot of guys (like Ofer) go for the Millers with a lot of success. If funds are tight I'd always go for an old Sachtler (like Video 18 II or Video 20 II) rather than a brand new Manfrotto or the like.
Steve

Dale Guthormsen · September 30th, 2009, 06:17 PM

Gerry,

I think the shot is lovely, particularly the improved one.

The focus seems to soft to me. Was it shot in DV or HD?

Jerry Merrell · September 30th, 2009, 07:34 PM

Steve, thanks for the tripod recommendations.

Dale, the clip was shot in HD (1080p).

September 26th, 2009, 03:53 PM	#1
Jerry Merrell New Boot Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Winter Park Florida Posts: 23	Long-billed Curlew, EX3 I am still trying to improve my technique and would be grateful for constructive critiques. I am shooting with an EX3, Nikkor 70-200 f2.8 lens, -3 gain, shutter @ 180 degrees, 1080p 30fps. I have recently switched from Cine4 to Cine1 settings. I processed this clip with Avid Liquid 7 (increased saturation and applied unsharp mask). I am particularly interested in comments about framing, panning technique, colors, post-processing and sharpness. YouTube - Long billed Curlew Thanks! Jerry Merrell

September 28th, 2009, 10:12 AM	#6
Jonathan Betz Regular Crew Join Date: May 2009 Location: Washington DC Posts: 59	You are definitely moving in the right direction with regards to grading. When framing shots, make sure you always consider the rule of thirds. You did well to place the curlew toward the right third of the frame initially, but as the shot progresses the shift toward centered framing leaves something to be desired. It is sometimes difficult, especially when just starting out, to avoid centering subjects during pans, but with practice the rule of thirds will become more second nature and you won't even need to think about it (I also think that you will find it easier to focus on framing once you are no longer struggling with an insufficient tripod). I can see where this would be a unique challenge for someone transitioning from still photography to video since maintaining good framing while both the camera and subject are moving can be quite difficult. Keep up the good work! __________________ Jon Betz www.jonbetzfilms.com

September 30th, 2009, 06:17 PM	#14
Dale Guthormsen Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Saskatchewan Posts: 3,048	Gerry, I think the shot is lovely, particularly the improved one. The focus seems to soft to me. Was it shot in DV or HD? __________________ DATS ALL FOLKS Dale W. Guthormsen

September 26th, 2009, 04:16 PM	#2
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	2 comments I'd make: get a better tripod, and be good to grade the pictures as they look very washed out (no doubt due to the Cine settings - these are designed to make flat pictures containing as much dynamic range as possible for you to work on afterwards). Also try some slightly higher frame rates - this often makes small bird movement look more natural and takes the edge of some of the camera movement. Cheers, Steve

September 26th, 2009, 06:21 PM	#3
Jerry Merrell New Boot Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Winter Park Florida Posts: 23	Steve, Thanks for the comments. I will experiment with grading the pictures. I was recording at 30 fps. Are you recommending overcranking and playing back at 30 fps or shooting at 60i? Jerry

September 27th, 2009, 01:27 PM	#4
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	If you're playing back at 30P try shooting maybe 40 or 50 fps, it's a funny thing but animal movement often looks a lot nicer (and actually more natural) when slowed a bit. You'd probably be surprised how much TV nature footage is off-speed without people even knowing. I'm no editor so don't know the ins and outs of grading but in essence you're trying to put contrast back into the flattened shots, so deepen the blacks and brighten the whites. Steve

September 27th, 2009, 04:30 PM	#5
Jerry Merrell New Boot Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Winter Park Florida Posts: 23	Steve, Here is the reprocessed clip. Although I am comfortable with digital SLR RAW files, color grading video is new to me. I adjusted the RGB histograms individually to darken blacks, enhance the highlights and add more contrast. YouTube - Long-billed Curlew - reprocessed Thanks for the comments. I will experiment with overcranking and start shopping for a better tripod. Jerry

September 28th, 2009, 11:34 AM	#7
Bo Skelmose Major Player Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Denmark Posts: 495	Hi I see no problems in framing the bird - the air in the picture are in front of it, as it is walking - when it stops and turns you center it - now you cannot tell which way it will walk - if it will? Only problem, as I see, is the stative that is not smooth enough - it could be because of a cheap stative or wind on the camera or yourself when moving - sometimes I grab the head of the stative instead of the pin sticking out to make a smooth pan....

September 28th, 2009, 08:15 PM	#8
Ofer Levy Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Sydney-Australia Posts: 443	Hi Jerry, The repost looks lovely to me! As to the slight vibrations you get I do the following which really helps: To avoid the vibrations caused by the wind I always use a hide which blocks the wind - extremely useful. In order to avoid vibrations caused by touching the camera/handle/tripod I attach a rubber band to the handle and only touch it. Also very effective. Keep it up mate, Regards, Ofer

September 29th, 2009, 06:30 AM	#12
Jerry Merrell New Boot Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Winter Park Florida Posts: 23	Thank you for all the helpful comments. Jerry

September 30th, 2009, 04:07 PM	#13
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	Nice Jerry. The old advice about tripods is still true, buy the most expensive you can afford and the heaviest you can carry. My favourites for the EX3 would be Ronford 2004 or O'Connor 1030, but I know a lot of guys (like Ofer) go for the Millers with a lot of success. If funds are tight I'd always go for an old Sachtler (like Video 18 II or Video 20 II) rather than a brand new Manfrotto or the like. Steve

September 30th, 2009, 07:34 PM	#15
Jerry Merrell New Boot Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Winter Park Florida Posts: 23	Steve, thanks for the tripod recommendations. Dale, the clip was shot in HD (1080p).