Vinten Vision Lubricate Friction (LF) system - is it a true fluid head?

[Zsolt Gordos]

From Vinten website:


"The Vision 3 comes with an illuminated levelling bubble for quick and easy set-up, detented and calibrated drag controls using Vinten's Lubricate Friction (LF) system, plus a full ±90° of smooth tilt movement."

This Lubricate Friction (LF) system made me think, as it sounds like Vinten Vision is NOT a fluid head, rather a friction based system. True fluid heads are better, if i am not wrong.

Anyone has more insight and share? What are the good true fluid heads for the same budget where Vinten Vision 3 stands?

Thanks a lot for fast reply, i am about buying a support for my HDV cam, low weight - so I cannot consider bigger heads (let alone their price tag).

[Alister Chapman]

The LF system uses a special kind of grease that thick and sticky, kind of like a thick glue that never sets. The grease is between clutch plates and you can adjust the presure between the plates to adjust the drag. It is not a true fluid system that actually moves a fluid from one chamber to another like a car damper but it is a very effective system that gives a very smooth action with a "fluid" feel. It is a simpler system so it is cheaper to produce and simpler maintain. True fluid heads are very rare these days, most manufacturers use either the sticky grease system or cams and gears.

[Zsolt Gordos]

Thanks Alister!
So is it only the production quality that makes Vinten's system different from Manfrotto 501 (I had horrible experiences with that, I can use it for no-pan no-tilt work only...)

If most makers produce their heads with the same "grease" design, does it mean Miller Arrow or Sachtler heads come also with the same?
Is there any advantage in true fluid head?
And finally: which model has true fluid head?

[Mike Teutsch]

Originally Posted by Zsolt Gordos

Thanks Alister!
So is it only the production quality that makes Vinten's system different from Manfrotto 501 (I had horrible experiences with that, I can use it for no-pan no-tilt work only...)

Got rid of my 501 for the same reason. The 503 is just fine though. Just so you know.

Mike

[Tom Wills]

I can just tell you straight off that the Vinten Vision series is miles and miles from the Manfrottos. I've played with a few of the Manfrotto "Fluid" heads, and I also have been using a big ol' Vinten Vision 10. The Vinten is completely and utterly different in terms of feel, smoothness, and quality. I can zoom in to the full range of an ENG camera's zoom lens, do the slowest pan or tilt you could imagine, stop, and watch it just sit there. There's no stickyness at the beginning of a move, no hesitation, no mechanical problems, nothing.

I really don't know how they do it, but it is just completely different. The mechanisms may be similar in design, but I'd say that the similarities stop there.

(And just for your information, this Vinten Vision 10 has been in service with a very large local news station for longer than some of their employees have, and yet is still just as rock-solid as the day it came in.)

[Mike Teutsch]

Originally Posted by Tom Wills

I can just tell you straight off that the Vinten Vision series is miles and miles from the Manfrottos. I've played with a few of the Manfrotto "Fluid" heads, and I also have been using a big ol' Vinten Vision 10. The Vinten is completely and utterly different in terms of feel, smoothness, and quality. I can zoom in to the full range of an ENG camera's zoom lens, do the slowest pan or tilt you could imagine, stop, and watch it just sit there. There's no stickyness at the beginning of a move, no hesitation, no mechanical problems, nothing.

I really don't know how they do it, but it is just completely different. The mechanisms may be similar in design, but I'd say that the similarities stop there.

(And just for your information, this Vinten Vision 10 has been in service with a very large local news station for longer than some of their employees have, and yet is still just as rock-solid as the day it came in.)

I'm sure you are correct on this! But, it's like the old saying, "you get what you pay for!" A head that costs $1,000.00 should work better than one that cost $250.00.

Mike

[Alister Chapman]

The different manufacturers use many different and varied ways of using the grease to lubricate the head. They may just simply use it as you would a grease lubricant or they may have complex packs of clutches and plates. Vinten have been making broadcast tripods for decades, and the LF system is very well proven. Sachtler use a slightly different system that relies on cams to set the drag in fixed steps so sometimes you can't get exactly the amount of drag you want. However it is an excellent reliable system. I don't know the details of Manfrotto and some of the other drag systems.

[Zsolt Gordos]

Thanks for the valuable comments!