Tips on panning at DVinfo.net

Don Libby · February 24th, 2003, 06:33 AM

Any tips on a good (if not proper) way to do a 365 degree pan? I've tried walking around the tripod but felf the move a bit jerky - I've tried sitting down underneath the tripod and turing the head with a little better results. I'm open to any and all suggestions.

Jon Eriksson · February 24th, 2003, 06:45 AM

I would ask myself if that kind of a pan really is needed. A pan longer than 90 degrees will leave the viewer disorientated, and as you said, it will be difficult in making it smooth.

But if you do need it, it is just a case of trial and error. Just remember to make it really slow - otherwise it wouldn't make sense to have it at all...

Good luck anyway
Jon

Jeff Donald · February 24th, 2003, 08:21 AM

On the rare occasion I need a 360 degree pan I walk it around. The jerkiness is probably the result of having to step around the legs of the tripod. I extend the tripods pan handle so that I can walk without tripping over the legs. If you handle does not extend, I suggest getting a tube or pipe and fastening it to the handle with gaffers tape.

Don Libby · February 24th, 2003, 09:17 AM

Thanks for the replies. I'm thinking that in the middle of nowhere I might want to give the viewer the impression of being isolated thus the 360 pan. I guess that I can clean any jerky moves up in editing. Again thanks - also sorry I posted in the wrong spot! I guess I'm still feeling my way around here.

Charles Papert · February 24th, 2003, 10:22 AM

Don:

Because the viewer "sees" the image in a very different way psychologically than the camera, making a full 360 pan does necessarily have the same effect as if one was standing in that environment. It can be an interesting thing to do visually for one reason or another, but after 180 degrees or so the viewer has lost track of where in the rotation the camera is seeing, something that we as humans retain if we were to spin in place. You can probably achieve the effect you are looking for with a few well-composed shots cut together in a montage, as well as careful sound design.

Matt Betea · February 24th, 2003, 10:40 AM

i agree with Charles. if the person was drugged, in a crowded, chaotic environment, then it might be a good effect to throw in there. i would personally use cuts of the character looking left and right with L/R POV shots in between.

Carl Slawinski · February 24th, 2003, 10:42 AM

Don,

Excuse me if I don't know what I am talking about, but would something like this Bescor MP-101 motorized pan head do the job fairly cheap?

http://www.bescor.com/Accessories/tripods.htm

Thanks

Carl

Don Libby · February 24th, 2003, 11:29 AM

Thank-you one and all for all the responses. All have given me information and made me think and rethink my "project". Once again this board has come to the forefront with its knowledge. I currently have 31 years experience in aviation security. I can sleep eat and do anything concerning this subject. HOWEVER, I've got less than 1 year experience in this endevor. This all a long winded way of saying thank-you.

Mike Rehmus · February 24th, 2003, 11:46 AM

None of the inexpensive power pan heads actually turn 360 degrees.

The Bescor does about 190, the Sunpack does 90.

There is a full 360 pan head somewhere out there. The real estate guys use them for the quick and dirty home tours for realtors.

The continuous rotation is to me, very uncomfortable . . . disorienting really.

I believe most of not all motion picture 'look-arounds' are of the pan and stop category. The camera pans about 90 degrees from a former position and then stops to allow the audience to look.

Robert J. Wolff · February 24th, 2003, 03:35 PM

If you have a "padded" situation, you can do the 360 without too much problem. By padded, I mean a shot where you are not constantly adjusting the frame. You suggest that you will be showing lonelyness.

Might I suggest the following: Tie a string (cord) to the pan handle. Walk your self around the shot, with the head locked horizontally. Make the line long enough to avoid your shadow('s).

No gurantee that this will solve your problem; but, you know the situation better than any one else.

It will probably take a few runs at it. Pratice makes perfect.

Bryan Roberts · February 24th, 2003, 04:49 PM

Yeah, just to add my .02, if you want the viewer to seem disoriented etc. then maybe a handheld pan that is a little jerky and stops at certain places would make more of a perspective disorientation "frantic" shot. But I could just be a moron :D

Rob Lohman · February 24th, 2003, 05:11 PM

Is there a reason why these Bescor products are so cheap? I
haven't seen a fluid head tripod for that amount of money here
yet etc.

Bryan Roberts · February 24th, 2003, 07:14 PM

Yes, I'm also VERY curious about these Bescor tripods. If they aren't completely terrible and are in fact a fluid head, wouldn't this be a great choice for a beginning tripod? The TX-25 is still a fluid head and seem great for 5lb and under dv camcorders and only costs 60 bucks! I might look into a tx-25...

Rob Lohman · February 25th, 2003, 07:31 AM

Anyone on this? Why are they so "cheap"? Any handson
experience anyone?

Don Libby · February 25th, 2003, 04:02 PM

Having rethought my plan I can see where it would not be the best course to do a 360 pan. 90 to 180 appears to fit what I'm attempting to do - show the vastness of the great SW. Thanks again.

February 24th, 2003, 06:33 AM	#1
Don Libby Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 48	Tips on paning Any tips on a good (if not proper) way to do a 365 degree pan? I've tried walking around the tripod but felf the move a bit jerky - I've tried sitting down underneath the tripod and turing the head with a little better results. I'm open to any and all suggestions.

February 24th, 2003, 06:45 AM	#2
Jon Eriksson Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London, UK Posts: 42	I would ask myself if that kind of a pan really is needed. A pan longer than 90 degrees will leave the viewer disorientated, and as you said, it will be difficult in making it smooth. But if you do need it, it is just a case of trial and error. Just remember to make it really slow - otherwise it wouldn't make sense to have it at all... Good luck anyway Jon __________________ Real Men do not Preview

February 24th, 2003, 08:21 AM	#3
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	On the rare occasion I need a 360 degree pan I walk it around. The jerkiness is probably the result of having to step around the legs of the tripod. I extend the tripods pan handle so that I can walk without tripping over the legs. If you handle does not extend, I suggest getting a tube or pipe and fastening it to the handle with gaffers tape. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

February 24th, 2003, 10:22 AM	#5
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Don: Because the viewer "sees" the image in a very different way psychologically than the camera, making a full 360 pan does necessarily have the same effect as if one was standing in that environment. It can be an interesting thing to do visually for one reason or another, but after 180 degrees or so the viewer has lost track of where in the rotation the camera is seeing, something that we as humans retain if we were to spin in place. You can probably achieve the effect you are looking for with a few well-composed shots cut together in a montage, as well as careful sound design. __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

February 24th, 2003, 11:46 AM	#9
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	None of the inexpensive power pan heads actually turn 360 degrees. The Bescor does about 190, the Sunpack does 90. There is a full 360 pan head somewhere out there. The real estate guys use them for the quick and dirty home tours for realtors. The continuous rotation is to me, very uncomfortable . . . disorienting really. I believe most of not all motion picture 'look-arounds' are of the pan and stop category. The camera pans about 90 degrees from a former position and then stops to allow the audience to look. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

February 24th, 2003, 09:17 AM	#4
Don Libby Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 48	Thanks for the replies. I'm thinking that in the middle of nowhere I might want to give the viewer the impression of being isolated thus the 360 pan. I guess that I can clean any jerky moves up in editing. Again thanks - also sorry I posted in the wrong spot! I guess I'm still feeling my way around here.

February 24th, 2003, 10:40 AM	#6
Matt Betea Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: detroit, mi Posts: 187	i agree with Charles. if the person was drugged, in a crowded, chaotic environment, then it might be a good effect to throw in there. i would personally use cuts of the character looking left and right with L/R POV shots in between.

February 24th, 2003, 10:42 AM	#7
Carl Slawinski Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Mount Prospect, IL Posts: 67	Don, Excuse me if I don't know what I am talking about, but would something like this Bescor MP-101 motorized pan head do the job fairly cheap? http://www.bescor.com/Accessories/tripods.htm Thanks Carl

February 24th, 2003, 11:29 AM	#8
Don Libby Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 48	Thank-you one and all for all the responses. All have given me information and made me think and rethink my "project". Once again this board has come to the forefront with its knowledge. I currently have 31 years experience in aviation security. I can sleep eat and do anything concerning this subject. HOWEVER, I've got less than 1 year experience in this endevor. This all a long winded way of saying thank-you.

February 24th, 2003, 03:35 PM	#10
Robert J. Wolff Major Player Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Adirondacks of New York Posts: 210	??Panning??, If you have a "padded" situation, you can do the 360 without too much problem. By padded, I mean a shot where you are not constantly adjusting the frame. You suggest that you will be showing lonelyness. Might I suggest the following: Tie a string (cord) to the pan handle. Walk your self around the shot, with the head locked horizontally. Make the line long enough to avoid your shadow('s). No gurantee that this will solve your problem; but, you know the situation better than any one else. It will probably take a few runs at it. Pratice makes perfect. __________________ Himself

February 24th, 2003, 04:49 PM	#11
Bryan Roberts Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 436	Yeah, just to add my .02, if you want the viewer to seem disoriented etc. then maybe a handheld pan that is a little jerky and stops at certain places would make more of a perspective disorientation "frantic" shot. But I could just be a moron :D

February 24th, 2003, 05:11 PM	#12
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Is there a reason why these Bescor products are so cheap? I haven't seen a fluid head tripod for that amount of money here yet etc. __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

February 24th, 2003, 07:14 PM	#13
Bryan Roberts Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 436	Yes, I'm also VERY curious about these Bescor tripods. If they aren't completely terrible and are in fact a fluid head, wouldn't this be a great choice for a beginning tripod? The TX-25 is still a fluid head and seem great for 5lb and under dv camcorders and only costs 60 bucks! I might look into a tx-25...

February 25th, 2003, 07:31 AM	#14
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Anyone on this? Why are they so "cheap"? Any handson experience anyone? __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

February 25th, 2003, 04:02 PM	#15
Don Libby Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 48	Having rethought my plan I can see where it would not be the best course to do a 360 pan. 90 to 180 appears to fit what I'm attempting to do - show the vastness of the great SW. Thanks again.