And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for video at DVinfo.net

Steven Davis · February 4th, 2015, 12:44 PM

Film soccer highlights (henrico)
© craigslist - Map data © OpenStreetMap

(google map) (yahoo map)
compensation: $100.00 / 3 matches

Looking for reasonable level of experience to shoot soccer matches on Sundays.
Requirements and expectations:
Have your own transportation to take you to Bryan Park and Dorey Park.
Must own and know how to correctly operate your own HD camera and tripod.
Shoot 3 consecutive soccer matches 90 mins each.
Perform simple edits down to 5 min highlights of each ( no gfx or music required ).
Upload highlight files on a Dropbox account within 48 hours of the shoot.
Commit to a 9 week schedule.

The hired candidate will be paid $100. cash for 3 matches.

If you have a reel please send a link.
Season starts the 1st Sunday in March.

do NOT contact me with unsolicited services or offers

Noa Put · February 4th, 2015, 01:24 PM

They probably take a hourrate into consideration what they pay to have their car fixed and they probably forget that editing also takes time. :)

Shaun Roemich · February 4th, 2015, 04:37 PM

Here in Vancouver that would be up on Craigslist for NO money and "for your demo reel"...

Seriously.

Oh... and would be posted the night before the season started.

Gary Huff · February 4th, 2015, 05:35 PM

iPhone shoots HD. You can get a little adapter to mount it to a tripod as well! Then you can email them recorded file right there on the field!

Bruce Dempsey · February 4th, 2015, 06:16 PM

a hundred bucks per match
the idea of highlites is simply ludicrous (spell that rite?)

Shaun Roemich · February 4th, 2015, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary Huff

Then you can email them recorded file right there on the field!

Mobile data rates must be lower in the US than up here in Canada...

Vince Pachiano · February 4th, 2015, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce Dempsey

a hundred bucks per match

Re-read the Ad. It's $100 for 3 matches @ 90 minutes each
We are easily talking 8 hours of travel/production/post that is $12.50 per hour. No thanks!

Steven Davis · February 4th, 2015, 09:44 PM

I thought about emailing the poster to give them a polite dose of reality, but I would probably be wasting my time.

Andrew Smith · February 6th, 2015, 01:30 PM

What if your highlights of the recorded match were .... so bad they were hilarious. I mean, you could get distracted with the person selling hot dogs on the side of the field etc. (inserts evil thoughts)

Seriously, you'd make more money as the taxi driver going between the three matches and home again.

Andrew

James Manford · February 6th, 2015, 03:01 PM

The issue is this and always has solely been this ...

Newbies that start in the business charge peanuts. Not because they can't shoot video ... because they don't have business accumen and don't believe in their capabilities.

So what happens ... they advertise saying they'll shoot 8 hours straight and edit for £200 or for free for demo purposes.

That warps the perception of the general public. And then when they see established companies charging proper money (that they can live on). They throw up a tantrum.

Josh Bass · February 6th, 2015, 08:25 PM

i think clients fall into two basic categories: experienced and inexperienced.

experienced clients will understand what all this gear costs, what it takes to be a good shooter/editor/etc., how much effort and time goes into a shoot/edit, all those types of things--and have a good idea of what a rate commensurate with all that related to the market/city theyre hiring should be.

INexperienced clients have no idea about any of that, and i believe probably dont do any research on rates and simply pull a figure out of thin air for what they think our services are worth, and are therefore shocked to their cores to see a quote of $500+ for a few hours of shooting.

Paul Ekert · February 7th, 2015, 09:29 AM

On a bridal forum I saw one bride asking if anyone was willing to video her big day for 80 pounds. Not even 100! 80 quid for a full days work plus editing time. Might as well do it for free!

Kevin McRoberts · February 7th, 2015, 09:34 AM

You know all those small-market local news photogs (and sometimes reporters)? This could actually be a raise for most of them with more lenient turnaround times. All those high school basketball/football highlights that are turned around in time for the 11 O'Clock news are done with essentially the same expectations, albeit use of their gear, edit space, and possibly some meager employment benefits.

As a youngster, I did far worse work for far less money in a day. Think like a 16 year old weighing this vs. flipping burgers at minimum wage - take a borrowed Handicam, iMovie or Moviemaker on parent's (or your own) computer, a little time, and you've got yourself gas money for a couple of weeks. Face it: simple video work is now in the realm of lawn mowing.

Josh Bass · February 7th, 2015, 09:57 AM

Problem is clients have the same expectation from people using what you listed above as someone with an $8000 cam, pro lighting kit, pro computer and pro editing software.

Kevin McRoberts · February 7th, 2015, 10:45 AM

This is kids' soccer. It's one of those jobs that takes time, but not that much skill or equipment. Two ways to look at it: either they don't know what it takes but know what they have and will accept whatever they get in that budget, OR they know what it takes and know what they have and don't expect a fully pro shooter with a pro codec camera, but are fine with a high schooler or moonlighting soccer mom doing the work. I can't make myself upset at the poster - they're not going to be getting rich as a kids soccer sports highlights producer. There can't be a lot of resources there. No way I'd be taking the job, but if I lived closer and my kids were a little older, I'd be fine with them working it.

I've gotten inquiries from inexperienced producers before, usually for small scale corporate work. There's a small period of education where they realize they have to compromise on either deadline, budget, or quality. These often aren't pro marketing people... they're bakers, or mechanics, or whatever that know very generally what they want, know exactly what they have, but don't know the path to a finished product. Either a deal is struck, or it isn't. If a videographer caves on all three, then they're the one being educated.

The CL postings I actually get miffed about are more like what Josh mentions, though... "highly rated reality show wants experienced F800 shooter with outstanding reel for intensive 12-hour day shoots - $250/d" That's paraphrasing from an actual posting recently, on CL or another job board. That POS producer knows exactly how much that experience and ability are worth, how much they'll personally profit, and is paying crap rates, expecting far too much. Those are the ones I get cheesed about.

February 4th, 2015, 12:44 PM	#1
Steven Davis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 3,065	And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for video Film soccer highlights (henrico) © craigslist - Map data © OpenStreetMap (google map) (yahoo map) compensation: $100.00 / 3 matches Looking for reasonable level of experience to shoot soccer matches on Sundays. Requirements and expectations: Have your own transportation to take you to Bryan Park and Dorey Park. Must own and know how to correctly operate your own HD camera and tripod. Shoot 3 consecutive soccer matches 90 mins each. Perform simple edits down to 5 min highlights of each ( no gfx or music required ). Upload highlight files on a Dropbox account within 48 hours of the shoot. Commit to a 9 week schedule. The hired candidate will be paid $100. cash for 3 matches. If you have a reel please send a link. Season starts the 1st Sunday in March. do NOT contact me with unsolicited services or offers __________________ What happens if I push the 'Red' button?

February 4th, 2015, 01:24 PM	#2
Noa Put Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Posts: 9,510	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid They probably take a hourrate into consideration what they pay to have their car fixed and they probably forget that editing also takes time. :)

February 4th, 2015, 04:37 PM	#3
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid Here in Vancouver that would be up on Craigslist for NO money and "for your demo reel"... Seriously. Oh... and would be posted the night before the season started. __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

February 4th, 2015, 05:35 PM	#4
Gary Huff Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 2,006	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid iPhone shoots HD. You can get a little adapter to mount it to a tripod as well! Then you can email them recorded file right there on the field!

February 4th, 2015, 06:16 PM	#5
Bruce Dempsey Major Player Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Atlantic Coast Canada Posts: 599	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid a hundred bucks per match the idea of highlites is simply ludicrous (spell that rite?)

February 4th, 2015, 09:44 PM	#8
Steven Davis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 3,065	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid I thought about emailing the poster to give them a polite dose of reality, but I would probably be wasting my time. __________________ What happens if I push the 'Red' button?

February 6th, 2015, 01:30 PM	#9
Andrew Smith Equal Opportunity Offender Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 3,064	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid What if your highlights of the recorded match were .... so bad they were hilarious. I mean, you could get distracted with the person selling hot dogs on the side of the field etc. (inserts evil thoughts) Seriously, you'd make more money as the taxi driver going between the three matches and home again. Andrew

February 6th, 2015, 03:01 PM	#10
James Manford Trustee Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: London, UK Posts: 1,393	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid The issue is this and always has solely been this ... Newbies that start in the business charge peanuts. Not because they can't shoot video ... because they don't have business accumen and don't believe in their capabilities. So what happens ... they advertise saying they'll shoot 8 hours straight and edit for £200 or for free for demo purposes. That warps the perception of the general public. And then when they see established companies charging proper money (that they can live on). They throw up a tantrum.

February 6th, 2015, 08:25 PM	#11
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid i think clients fall into two basic categories: experienced and inexperienced. experienced clients will understand what all this gear costs, what it takes to be a good shooter/editor/etc., how much effort and time goes into a shoot/edit, all those types of things--and have a good idea of what a rate commensurate with all that related to the market/city theyre hiring should be. INexperienced clients have no idea about any of that, and i believe probably dont do any research on rates and simply pull a figure out of thin air for what they think our services are worth, and are therefore shocked to their cores to see a quote of $500+ for a few hours of shooting. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

February 7th, 2015, 09:29 AM	#12
Paul Ekert Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Oxford Posts: 66	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid On a bridal forum I saw one bride asking if anyone was willing to video her big day for 80 pounds. Not even 100! 80 quid for a full days work plus editing time. Might as well do it for free!

February 7th, 2015, 09:34 AM	#13
Kevin McRoberts Major Player Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Charlottesville, VA Posts: 700	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid You know all those small-market local news photogs (and sometimes reporters)? This could actually be a raise for most of them with more lenient turnaround times. All those high school basketball/football highlights that are turned around in time for the 11 O'Clock news are done with essentially the same expectations, albeit use of their gear, edit space, and possibly some meager employment benefits. As a youngster, I did far worse work for far less money in a day. Think like a 16 year old weighing this vs. flipping burgers at minimum wage - take a borrowed Handicam, iMovie or Moviemaker on parent's (or your own) computer, a little time, and you've got yourself gas money for a couple of weeks. Face it: simple video work is now in the realm of lawn mowing. __________________ Freelance pudgy bearded lighting camera operator www.mcbob.tv

February 7th, 2015, 09:57 AM	#14
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid Problem is clients have the same expectation from people using what you listed above as someone with an $8000 cam, pro lighting kit, pro computer and pro editing software. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

February 7th, 2015, 10:45 AM	#15
Kevin McRoberts Major Player Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Charlottesville, VA Posts: 700	Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid This is kids' soccer. It's one of those jobs that takes time, but not that much skill or equipment. Two ways to look at it: either they don't know what it takes but know what they have and will accept whatever they get in that budget, OR they know what it takes and know what they have and don't expect a fully pro shooter with a pro codec camera, but are fine with a high schooler or moonlighting soccer mom doing the work. I can't make myself upset at the poster - they're not going to be getting rich as a kids soccer sports highlights producer. There can't be a lot of resources there. No way I'd be taking the job, but if I lived closer and my kids were a little older, I'd be fine with them working it. I've gotten inquiries from inexperienced producers before, usually for small scale corporate work. There's a small period of education where they realize they have to compromise on either deadline, budget, or quality. These often aren't pro marketing people... they're bakers, or mechanics, or whatever that know very generally what they want, know exactly what they have, but don't know the path to a finished product. Either a deal is struck, or it isn't. If a videographer caves on all three, then they're the one being educated. The CL postings I actually get miffed about are more like what Josh mentions, though... "highly rated reality show wants experienced F800 shooter with outstanding reel for intensive 12-hour day shoots - $250/d" That's paraphrasing from an actual posting recently, on CL or another job board. That POS producer knows exactly how much that experience and ability are worth, how much they'll personally profit, and is paying crap rates, expecting far too much. Those are the ones I get cheesed about. __________________ Freelance pudgy bearded lighting camera operator www.mcbob.tv