Help with an eBay/Paypal fraud

[Heath McKnight]

I wish I knew now instead of then...

I sold some ram to a nice person who shipped it to Russia (whoops on my part) about a month ago. This person is based in America, or so they said, and now Paypal says the person bought it with a stolen credit card and I didn't insure it or something. So I ask you guys, what can I do? I'm reporting it to eBay, but what else can I do? I think I'm out $144 and change and I DON'T have that much money because it's been slow in the freelance dept.

HELP!

heath

[Frank Granovski]

There's nothing you can do to get your ram back. I would just make the report on-line and then right it off.

[Heath McKnight]

<<<-- Originally posted by Frank Granovski : There's nothing you can do to get your ram back. I would just make the report on-line and then right it off. -->>>

Yeah...this sucks...Well, ya live, ya learn. But why am I being charged by Paypal for something someone else did? This isn't my fault.

heath

[Matt Stahley]

Be careful this is not a scam with someone using PayPal. I've been getting some emails supposedly from Paypal that i think are fake and they note that they have inserted paypal logos in my auctions. Well I dont have any auctions going on right now and they want you to log into Paypal etc. this may be a scam of some sort/

[Heath McKnight]

No, it's real; I've called Paypal and everything.

Here's my two theories:

1. Stolen credit card to buy it.

2. Person bought it via credit card, then claimed they didn't buy it.

Now I have to provide shipping information (which I can't find, as I've rearranged my entire workspace/bedroom), which may also not be helpful since I don't think there was a tracking number (though an insurance number may actually help), and the credit card company will, in 75 days, decide if I'm legit and make sure I'm not out $144 and change.

heath

[Frank Granovski]

There is a thread somewhere at dvinfo about How Not To Get Ripped Off On E-bay.

I use e-bay often to buy stuff, like lenses mainly. I'M ALWAYS SO CAREFUL! So far, I've never been ripped off.

Perhaps someone can find that thread and post the link here. Anyways, I'd just write it off and be wiser the next time.

Oh, I have been ripped-off before---before I got wise. Just not with e-bay.

I make a point of always being 100% sure when I buy or sell. And I'm never to quick with signing anything, unless I was being tortured in an Iranian jail or in a Texas brothel. :)

[Heath McKnight]

The person had a HIGH user rating, though now the rating is down to one. Hmph...

heath

[Robbie Smolinsky]

Heath, sorry to hear about your misfortune. I am no longer using Paypal because of all the fraudulent activity. Whether the account was stolen or they did some sort of chargeback on their credit card, chances are you won't get your money or ram back again, at least not through Paypal or Ebay, but your credit card may protect you. It is actually written in the Paypal user agreement (the one you have to agree to before having access to an account) that they reserve every right to recoupe their own losses and the losses of others (i.e. victim of a stolen account, or someone doing a fraudulent chargeback) directly from your bank account and/or registered credit cards. For example:

-You sell Tom a $2000 camera
-Tom sends you $2000 through Paypal, so you ship Tom the camera
-Two weeks later, you get an email from Paypal saying that the account Tom was using was stolen.
-Paypal in turn credits the stolen account Tom was using $2000
- Now Paypal is not going to take a $2000 loss, so they go straight to your account (either Paypal money, bank accoutn or credit card) and take their $2000 back
- So at the end of the day, Paypal is protected and loses nothing, Tom gets a free camera, and you are out 2 grand and a camera. A double Whammy.

This has actually happened to someone I know.

Of course, this is really a worse case scenario but a possibility none the less. I don't want to alarm you, but there is a chance Paypal will try to get the $144 from you even though you've already shipped your RAM. However, if nothing else, I wouldn't expect any compensation from Paypal especially since you don't have tracking info, etc. They do offer protection for you if you follow their rules (i.e. ship to verified buyers confirmed address only, with tracking and signature confirmation, etc etc) but it sounds as though you may not qualify for that protection.


I don't mean to rip the Paypal system, they have a right to protect their assests entirely. I just think its really unfortunate that there are so many people out there willing to abuse the system and steal from honest people. I think they should be strung up in public so us good citizens can throw tomatoes at them and drunks can pee on em. But thats just my 2 cents.

Robbie

[Heath McKnight]

That's what happened to me; and since I shipped it to Russia, I'm screwed. Only thing I have going for me is the UPS Store (formerly Mail Boxes Etc.) found exactly what I bought and the shipping price is exactly what the price for Russia shipments are. But, long story short, I'm gonna hope to God I can write this off on my taxes somehow...

Lesson learned, Paypal account to be deactivated after the investigation.

heath

[Joe Carney]

>>I think they should be strung up in public so us good citizens can throw tomatoes at them and drunks can pee on em. But thats just my 2 cents.
<<

I say bring back the public stocks, like they had in the old country and in Salem Ma during the witch trials. hehehe


Now I'm worried, I just started up my Paypal to buy things through Ebay so I don't have to give my credit card.

[Frank Granovski]

As Alex would say, Paypal sucks. (Sorry Chris, Ken, Jeff....) Let me explain. About a year ago I opened up a Paypal account. However, I'n not sure whether it was because I'm in Canada or what, but I had problems with Paypal right from the start. They once charged me 3X for a service fee ($5 US X 3). They took it straight from my MC. Could I get it back? Nope. So from that time forth, NO MORE PAYPAL. It's a scam in my opinion. I just use M.O.s, thank you. And if I don't get what I ordered, I get my M.O. refunded---thanks to the credit union I use. (This hasn't happened yet, thanks to getting to know who I'm dealing with. A good test is to e-mail the seller, and ask for info.)

[Heath McKnight]

I don't think I should pay for someone else's crime, but what choice do I have? I should've read the fine print...

Lesson learned and no wonder Cafepress.com stopped using them. I'm done with them.

CODs are nice; woman who bought my camera recommended it to protect us. I did it via UPS with great success.

heath

[Robbie Smolinsky]

Joe, I didn't mean to incite worry upon everone who reads this thread. I actually use Paypal for purchasing things as I feel it really is more secure. I think the risk comes in when selling, because the account could be stolen, and there are multiple ways for the buyer to try to get a refund, which may end up at your expense.

As you said Heath, "I don't think I should pay for someone else's crime, but what choice do I have? I should've read the fine print..." Thats exactly what gets me. I mean I realize Paypal needs to protect itself from losses, but at the same time I think they could mediate a little better when problems arise. I would think they should take a person's history or previous activity into account, Paypal is one of the fastest growing companies around (as far as profits go) but they do little in the form of customer service and protection.

But in the meantime, I'll keep paying through Paypal when I absolutely need to use a credit card, and I'll be taking money orders and COD as my only forms of payment.

FRANK: I was curious, what credit union do you use that offers a refund on money orders? I have never heard of that, but I'd love the additional security!!

And I second Frank's suggestion of asking questions whenever you're in a transaction, even make small talk, because it never hurts to make a new friend! And it certainly helps to let you know what kind of person you're dealing with!


Robbie

[Heath McKnight]

Do a google.com search on Paypal frauds and you'll be shocked at what you find. Even the consumer fraud reporters told me I'm f-cked. Nuts.

Okay, this is probably NOT gonna work, but if I pay the bill with my American Express card, I may very well be able to fight it. Then again, I knowingly paid for it with my AMX card, so maybe not.

Nothing I can do but complain to each higher up person at Paypal, because their customer service SUCKS!

heath

[Frank Granovski]

FRANK: I was curious, what credit union do you use that offers a refund on money orders? I have never heard of that, but I'd love the additional security!!

Canadian financial institutions are governed by different laws than those in the USA.