Would using a star filter for cinematography be too weird?

[Pete Cofrancesco]

I bought a knockoff Steadicam based on watching some those type of videos. I discovered they are very hard to operate. That guy makes it look easy. Also note he is walking on smooth level surfaces. I’ve borrowed an electronic gimbal with more success but both become heavy to hold and both you need to control the vertical axis with the ninja walk. These devices are designed to eliminate the camera operator body motion.

You ask so many questions pertaining to so many scenarios it’s hard to keep up. It’s a lot more simple when you pick the right tool for the right job. When you are picking a gimbal to do a slider shot because it’s easier or cheaper that’s when you get into trouble. Someone who is very skilled can push gimbal past it’s intended purpose. Circling around a person is a gimbal shot commonly used in weddings but it’s done slow not like the other video you posted that was done with a dolly.

[Ryan Elder]

Okay thanks. Well I want to get the right tool for the job, I just don't know what the right tool is for each shot.

For example, when you say not to use a gimbal for a dolly or slider shot, how do you know if a shot is a dolly or slider shot? I'm not talking about just ones you see in videos, but if I actually come up with shots on my own, how do I know what tool is for that job?

[Pete Cofrancesco]

Gimbal shots give the viewer the feeling they’re actually in the scene walking around where as dolly/slider shots the scene is being revealed to the viewer. In some cases just might be too difficult or impossible to lay dolly track.

[Brian Drysdale]

If you need precise moves, especially with longer lenses use a dolly or slider.

If going over uneven ground that can be seen in the shoot use a gimbal or a Steadicam, or if the shot goes beyond where a dolly or a crane can physically go. Unless you're working with experienced, skilled operators, don't expect the precision and smoothness that you get with a dolly.

Talk to the DP about the right tools, there's nothing worse than a director who thinks they know the way to do things, when they have limited knowledge. Even experienced directors do this, since the DP is the person who has to make it work.

[Ryan Elder]

Okay thanks, For the next project I want to do, I can talk to a DP. For the martial arts one however, it's tougher if it's just me.

Let's say I want to give the viewer the sense they are walking around, like a gimbal, but I don't want wide lenses, cause of barrel distortion, if I move in for a close up. What then? Is there a tool where I can walk wherever I want with the camera, but can use longer lenses, to avoid barrel distortion?

[Brian Drysdale]

Use a dolly with longer lens or buy better lenses that show less barrel distortion or switch lenses for the CUs.

Longer lenses are hardly great for dynamic action shots.

[Ryan Elder]

Okay thanks. There are plenty of wide action shots, that I would use wider lenses. But for some of the CU shots, I want the camera to move.

Like for example, there is a script I want to do where an actor is chasing another actor down the sidewalk and through a field. I can do wides for that, while running along with them with a gimbal.

But if I want to cut to CU's of their faces during the running, and I don't want a wide lens cause of the barrel distortion, what tool do I use for that? I could use a dolly as long as the track is long enough for the shots while running.

Another shot I want is for it to start out as a higher up shot, but then do a 180 degree spin around an actor, while the camera comes down, and then moves towards his face for a CU. I don't want barrel distortion, so what tool would be best for this type of combinations of moves then?

[John Nantz]

With regard to the martial arts scene(s), if the scene involves active interaction between two people, there is a lot you can get away with because it will be the action that is what the viewer will focus on. The audio, focusing, level horizon, even the framing, not so much. Everything moves so fast there is no time for the viewer (unless they're a video guy) to fixate on "errors".

For a budget, non Hollywood video, if it were me with the gear I have, I'd go with a wide cam on a tripod and my handheld AX53 OIS cam to get more closeups from different angles, especially closeups. Since this would be "acting" one can do a number of takes to get the best combination of clips to put together. No worry about barrel distortion and you can handle the audio because you're experienced in that area. Personally, I always like the Røde Video Mic on the AX53 if nothing else but for helping with syncing although FCP X is really good at that. Capturing the players/actors/participant noises really helps. Watching football with action audio is much engaging than the sterile audio without players noises typical of TV game broadcasts. (they probably don't want to broadcast what the players of opposing teams are saying to each other)

Adjust framing and possibly speed in edit. A little slo-mo piece?

For a training video a multicam would be good and especially with some slo-mo to capture important details. Combine that with some editorial comments using the Motion application or whatever you're using. Graphics for the opening and credits. Music? Voice over?

[Josh Bass]

for the martial arts thing if youre that worried about it why not get some friends to pretend to do martial arts and you can test out all your ideas and see what works. it shouldnt take that long so it fits what youve told us theyll put up in terms of helping you.

[Ryan Elder]

Okay thanks. I've already tested out some ideas. I'm going to do some long lens shots on a tripod from far away, to get more movement out of it with the fight. Then intercut with some close ups. Just not sure if I should use a gimbal for the close ups or not.

One shot so far that I also want to do, is an over the head shot... By that I mean it's like on OTS shot, but it's going over the top of someone's head instead, with the top of the head, out of focus. But then I want to move the camera around the actor, and refocus for a CU of his face, as the camera comes around him. What tool would be best for that type of movement?

[John Nantz]

Don’t know how the client wants to use the martial arts action, just something in general or maybe be able to show “some moves”? In some sports, whether it is wrestling, tennis, football, or whatever, there are certain “moves” that are used by participants in that sport and the client would probably like to be able to incorporate some of those in the action video. If so, then they would need to somehow choreograph the action (you might call this a script) to have them in, and in which case, they might want you to try and capture them.

In wrestling, I know there are moves and counter moves.

Even non-team sports have “moves” (probably called differently, like gymnastics, ice skating (dancing, like triple axels), etc.

Just thinking ahead. This would be upping the complexity.
This seems like a good gig! You try out some new techniques, learn a bit about some martial arts, and … get PAID for it all at the same time.

Next thread title: “What kit to buy with all the new found money?”
(we can help you with that too!!!)

[Ryan Elder]

Oh thanks. I just feel I would do so much better if I took on projects with crews, where I could concentrate on directing and leave someone else to handle the cinematography. I feel that maybe I should stop doing documentary and corporate video type projects after this one, where they want me to be a one man band.

[Josh Bass]

problem there is that those projects would likely be significantly higher profile and higher budget for a more sophisticated caliber of client. The only way to get hired by THOSE folks is demonstrate that they should put their faith in you, based on your a reel of your work and probably several face to face meetings or at least a formal bid or treatment.

I think everyone here would agree that based on your reel, questions, apparent skill level and experience, you are nowhere near ready for those projects yet.

The projects you hate and want to stop doing are known as “paying dues” and its how you get the experience so you so badly need and learn to master your craft. If you can take on these types of projects with no sweat and “crush” them without copious questions and mistakes, then perhaps you’ll be ready for that next level of commanding a crew as director.

[Brian Drysdale]

You may find getting CUs of faces while running using a gimbal difficult. if not impossible because can't run that fast going backwards. You can do this with a Steadicam because you can operate it facing forwards, while the camera faces backwards.

For real speed you should hard mount the Steadicam on a Quad or a small John Deere flat bed and use that. The Steadicam arm adsorbs the bumps over rough ground, with the operator sitting on the vehicle controlling the finer framing movements. The latter becomes more important with longer lenses and tighter shots.

[Ryan Elder]

Oh okay I think that those type of vehicles are illegal in city limits though.

However, why can't you face forward while the gimbal is facing backward though compared to a steadicam?