Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?

Josh Bass · November 10th, 2019, 05:15 PM

Yes. I would keep calling maybe once a month with all those places and ask if they have any projects coming up they could use you on.

The idea is to call often enough to be remembered/thought of as persistent, but not so often as to be annoying. I think once a month is a good neighborhood. Some of my clients tell me they frequently get calls from people like you and the callers often don't follow up. Be the guy who follows up.

Ryan Elder · November 10th, 2019, 06:07 PM

Okay thanks, I'll do that.

But do you think if I follow others advice, to get a much better DP, crew and cast, to make the feature with, that it would definitely help my chances a lot on it being good, or no?

Brian Drysdale · November 11th, 2019, 02:49 AM

80% of how good a film is going to be is decided before a single frame is shot.

Ryan Elder · November 11th, 2019, 02:57 AM

Yep that makes sense. But out of that 80 percent would be the DP, crew and cast though, right?

Brian Drysdale · November 11th, 2019, 03:28 AM

Selecting those key people is part of the 80%.

Ryan Elder · November 11th, 2019, 11:47 AM

Okay thanks. I was also told by another filmmaker that I have collaborated before, that I should stop applying for other positions, because my problem is that I am trying to be a jack of all trades, and that I should spend my time on directing only, if I want to be a director. Do you think that's true, and that I should only take on directing projects only, even if they are my own, as oppose to other people's projects?

Brian Drysdale · November 11th, 2019, 12:38 PM

It depends on if you're earning a living from these other projects. You will have to get work as a director working for other producers and you need to work on more than just drama. If they're your own feature films you may find it's a single project every one or two years (if you're lucky). Actually shooting a feature film is a small percentage time wise compared to that spent developing the script and getting funding in place.

As a professional director, you need fast turnaround work for many producers. If you're also the producer, you need a range of clients, as they say, it's show BUSINESS.

Ryan Elder · November 11th, 2019, 01:03 PM

Oh okay. This next question has nothing to do with filmmaking but more of a career question.

I shopped the script of mine around that I am working on and have gotten feedback from filmmakers I have worked with before. They said that they are really uncomfortable with helping me make this script cause they said the material is too dark and controversial.

They said if I am to direct my first feature, they would be much more comfortable doing this other script I wrote before, which is not near as controversial and more safe for distribution. But the other script is way more high budget, and I wrote it as more of an exercise, or more food for thought to develop my writing. I thought maybe if I was successful in the future, I could have it ready to go then. Which is why I wrote this much lower budget feature, albeit with more controversial content.

However, they say that I should just throw away the script to that one, and just try harder to get the money for the higher budget one. But I don't think that's going to happen, and I think for my first feature, even if I do get external funding, they are probably more comfortable funding a lower budget movie, even if controversial compared to a high budget, safe movie?

What do you think?

Josh Bass · November 11th, 2019, 01:17 PM

what is so controversial? at this point shows and movies about every taboo topic under the sun are out there. What could possibly be so controversial about yours? This might be one of those things that says more about the people youre asking than your script. You ask a bunch of devout Christians to help you on your Hitler/Satan buddy comedy (for instance) its probably not gonna work out.

Ryan Elder · November 11th, 2019, 01:21 PM

That's just it, I don't know, what is so much about mine. It's about a group of serial rapist/killers going around committing crimes, and one of the victims wants revenge, and investigates to find out more about the mystery villain, but this has been kind of controversy has been done before, and I didn't think I was going too over the top with it at all.

Paul R Johnson · November 11th, 2019, 01:37 PM

Not a new story, but personally I'd run a mile from it. Have you any experience of this subject? I find it difficult to understand how you think this will work. Finding the actor and actress to do the rape scenes will be tricky. Those that can do it will not want to do it with a novice director. I'm not actually sure I could do a decent job - despite having some experience with people who have been raped. Maybe this means I would be unable to do a good job. Looking at the people who work for me regularly, quite a few would probably become busy quickly and not want to do it either. Your friends seem to be interested in making movies for fun, rather than as a career role - this one doesn't sound fun at all.

Ryan Elder · November 11th, 2019, 02:09 PM

Well it's just I wanted to make a movie that left a more lasting impression in people, cause if I do light and comedic films which the filmmakers I worked for, are use to, than I feel it will just be a forgotten low budget indie, rather than wanting to make something serious, that will stick in people's heads more after, hopefully.

Paul R Johnson · November 11th, 2019, 02:34 PM

I'd rather be known for making good light hearted movies people wanted to watch. Hard and dark subject matter limits the audience, limits the crew willing to work on it. It's really, really not the kind of movie a beginner should make because very, very hard to do.

Brian Drysdale · November 11th, 2019, 02:42 PM

It difficult to make a film that will stick people's minds. You need to be totally original and have great luck with your cast to pull that off with a first film and so far you don't seem to be showing the raw drive to make such a film.

This is Martin Scorsese entering the area of rape and its effect in his first feature.

You will get larger audiences with a lighter film, however, a good comedy isn't easy and requires a lot of work to get right.

Ryan Elder · November 11th, 2019, 02:46 PM

Well it's just more people in the indie filmmaking world are more open to making these kind of movies. There are more darker and controversial movies that are indie films out there, compared to more mainstream. So I think it's a matter of getting people to be more open to it maybe.

But every time I see a lighthearted and safe movie made by an indie filmmaker, I think to myself that perhaps the reason why people forgot about it later on, is because it's been there seen that, where as I thought I would have a better shot, if I brought something to the table that people are not use to seeing near as often. But of course I still want to make the movie as mainstream as possible, but with a darker premise than usual. I thought that would be the best way to play, take a dark premise, but try to make it as mainstream as possible for people.

November 10th, 2019, 05:15 PM	#391
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Yes. I would keep calling maybe once a month with all those places and ask if they have any projects coming up they could use you on. The idea is to call often enough to be remembered/thought of as persistent, but not so often as to be annoying. I think once a month is a good neighborhood. Some of my clients tell me they frequently get calls from people like you and the callers often don't follow up. Be the guy who follows up. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

November 10th, 2019, 06:07 PM	#392
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Okay thanks, I'll do that. But do you think if I follow others advice, to get a much better DP, crew and cast, to make the feature with, that it would definitely help my chances a lot on it being good, or no?

November 11th, 2019, 02:49 AM	#393
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,152	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? 80% of how good a film is going to be is decided before a single frame is shot.

November 11th, 2019, 02:57 AM	#394
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Yep that makes sense. But out of that 80 percent would be the DP, crew and cast though, right?

November 11th, 2019, 03:28 AM	#395
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,152	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Selecting those key people is part of the 80%.

November 11th, 2019, 11:47 AM	#396
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Okay thanks. I was also told by another filmmaker that I have collaborated before, that I should stop applying for other positions, because my problem is that I am trying to be a jack of all trades, and that I should spend my time on directing only, if I want to be a director. Do you think that's true, and that I should only take on directing projects only, even if they are my own, as oppose to other people's projects?

November 11th, 2019, 12:38 PM	#397
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,152	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? It depends on if you're earning a living from these other projects. You will have to get work as a director working for other producers and you need to work on more than just drama. If they're your own feature films you may find it's a single project every one or two years (if you're lucky). Actually shooting a feature film is a small percentage time wise compared to that spent developing the script and getting funding in place. As a professional director, you need fast turnaround work for many producers. If you're also the producer, you need a range of clients, as they say, it's show BUSINESS.

November 11th, 2019, 01:03 PM	#398
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Oh okay. This next question has nothing to do with filmmaking but more of a career question. I shopped the script of mine around that I am working on and have gotten feedback from filmmakers I have worked with before. They said that they are really uncomfortable with helping me make this script cause they said the material is too dark and controversial. They said if I am to direct my first feature, they would be much more comfortable doing this other script I wrote before, which is not near as controversial and more safe for distribution. But the other script is way more high budget, and I wrote it as more of an exercise, or more food for thought to develop my writing. I thought maybe if I was successful in the future, I could have it ready to go then. Which is why I wrote this much lower budget feature, albeit with more controversial content. However, they say that I should just throw away the script to that one, and just try harder to get the money for the higher budget one. But I don't think that's going to happen, and I think for my first feature, even if I do get external funding, they are probably more comfortable funding a lower budget movie, even if controversial compared to a high budget, safe movie? What do you think?

November 11th, 2019, 01:17 PM	#399
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? what is so controversial? at this point shows and movies about every taboo topic under the sun are out there. What could possibly be so controversial about yours? This might be one of those things that says more about the people youre asking than your script. You ask a bunch of devout Christians to help you on your Hitler/Satan buddy comedy (for instance) its probably not gonna work out. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

November 11th, 2019, 01:21 PM	#400
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? That's just it, I don't know, what is so much about mine. It's about a group of serial rapist/killers going around committing crimes, and one of the victims wants revenge, and investigates to find out more about the mystery villain, but this has been kind of controversy has been done before, and I didn't think I was going too over the top with it at all.

November 11th, 2019, 01:37 PM	#401
Paul R Johnson Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lowestoft - UK Posts: 4,045	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Not a new story, but personally I'd run a mile from it. Have you any experience of this subject? I find it difficult to understand how you think this will work. Finding the actor and actress to do the rape scenes will be tricky. Those that can do it will not want to do it with a novice director. I'm not actually sure I could do a decent job - despite having some experience with people who have been raped. Maybe this means I would be unable to do a good job. Looking at the people who work for me regularly, quite a few would probably become busy quickly and not want to do it either. Your friends seem to be interested in making movies for fun, rather than as a career role - this one doesn't sound fun at all.

November 11th, 2019, 02:09 PM	#402
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Well it's just I wanted to make a movie that left a more lasting impression in people, cause if I do light and comedic films which the filmmakers I worked for, are use to, than I feel it will just be a forgotten low budget indie, rather than wanting to make something serious, that will stick in people's heads more after, hopefully.

November 11th, 2019, 02:34 PM	#403
Paul R Johnson Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lowestoft - UK Posts: 4,045	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? I'd rather be known for making good light hearted movies people wanted to watch. Hard and dark subject matter limits the audience, limits the crew willing to work on it. It's really, really not the kind of movie a beginner should make because very, very hard to do.

November 11th, 2019, 02:42 PM	#404
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,152	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? It difficult to make a film that will stick people's minds. You need to be totally original and have great luck with your cast to pull that off with a first film and so far you don't seem to be showing the raw drive to make such a film. This is Martin Scorsese entering the area of rape and its effect in his first feature. Whoâ€™s That Knocking At My Door (1967) - I Wonâ€™t Marry You - YouTube You will get larger audiences with a lighter film, however, a good comedy isn't easy and requires a lot of work to get right.

November 11th, 2019, 02:46 PM	#405
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? Well it's just more people in the indie filmmaking world are more open to making these kind of movies. There are more darker and controversial movies that are indie films out there, compared to more mainstream. So I think it's a matter of getting people to be more open to it maybe. But every time I see a lighthearted and safe movie made by an indie filmmaker, I think to myself that perhaps the reason why people forgot about it later on, is because it's been there seen that, where as I thought I would have a better shot, if I brought something to the table that people are not use to seeing near as often. But of course I still want to make the movie as mainstream as possible, but with a darker premise than usual. I thought that would be the best way to play, take a dark premise, but try to make it as mainstream as possible for people.