Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? at DVinfo.net

Ryan Elder · February 4th, 2019, 02:38 PM

I have a short film I want to shoot, that involves a fight scene, where actors are rolling and flipping, and all that. During some of the flips, I want to be able to roll the camera with them flip.

I noticed that gimbals can roll, and tried watching some tutorials on them. But every time they do the rolls, it's slow. Are gimbals capable of increasing the speed, so they can roll as fast as a person can roll?

Pete Cofrancesco · February 4th, 2019, 07:50 PM

You’ll need to build something for example

or mount a tripod head horizontally even on a slider to roll and slide at the same time

You also might need to instead mount the camera to a wheel since you probably need to be ground level

Ryan Elder · February 4th, 2019, 10:07 PM

Okay thanks. I can try building something but the start and stop of it, does not seem the smoothest, but maybe that just takes practice.

Do you think maybe I should just build all my equipment to move the camera? Like for example, I was thinking of getting a gimbal, but should I just make a DIY steadicam rig instead, or are gimbals popular because they can do a better job, than the DYI stuff?

Pete Cofrancesco · February 4th, 2019, 10:31 PM

Tripod head would allow a more controlled roll but would limit the rotation to less than 180 degrees. Like someone said most of this stuff you have to experiment for yourself.

I’ve used both, I’d recommend the electronic gimbal over the steadicam for its ease of use and versatility. The steadicam yields a more natural motion but is exceedingly difficult to operate properly.

Ryan Elder · February 4th, 2019, 11:17 PM

Okay thanks. That is a limitation with the tripod head that is for sure. I was trying to find out how many degree of a roll the Moza Air 2 could do but cannot find any tutorials on it, that talk about how far it can push a roll, or how fast it can do a roll.

Mainly I want to do the roll, while an actor rolls, and the actors are going to do the rolls as fast as they can.

But can the Moza Air 2 do a full fast roll, and keep up? I was going to invest in a gimbal anyway, for all these others moves I could do for other shots. But would the Moza Air 2 be able to do the rolls as well?

Pete Cofrancesco · February 5th, 2019, 12:03 AM

Gimbals are for slow smooth motion not what I’d imagine the speed you need for fight scene. You could be over thinking it. might be a simple as the camera hand held and the operator rolling on mat along side the actor. Just experiment until you find the right approach. Even if a gimbal isn’t the right tool for this scene you should get one they’re indispensable for cinematic work.

Ryan Elder · February 5th, 2019, 12:26 AM

Okay thanks, I was most likely going to get one any way for other shots. I don't think they are for slow motion only though, as they seem to perform well with action scenes, such as following actors while running in chase scenes, in the short films I have seen, unless I am wrong.

However, if it is not right for doing fast rolls, what is? I tried doing it handheld, as a test but it looks too handheld, and not good or professional. I think need some sort of stabilized too, that can roll it fast, while keeping it stabilized, if possible.

Actually according to B & H, the Moza Air can do a 360 degree role, but I still can't find what the speed is.

Pete Cofrancesco · February 5th, 2019, 07:38 AM

I meant for this particular action I can’t imagine you’d be able to match the speed and timing of a roll with a gimbal like you would with a tripod head.

Ryan Elder · February 5th, 2019, 11:52 AM

Okay thanks, I could use a tripod head if that's better, and I looked for one before, but I could not find a tripod head that could do a full 360 degree roll, or at least close to. Is there any?

Plus the roll a tripod head does looks off, cause the anchor point of the roll is not in the middle of the camera, like a gimbal.

February 4th, 2019, 02:38 PM	#1
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? I have a short film I want to shoot, that involves a fight scene, where actors are rolling and flipping, and all that. During some of the flips, I want to be able to roll the camera with them flip. I noticed that gimbals can roll, and tried watching some tutorials on them. But every time they do the rolls, it's slow. Are gimbals capable of increasing the speed, so they can roll as fast as a person can roll?

February 4th, 2019, 07:50 PM	#2
Pete Cofrancesco Inner Circle Join Date: May 2004 Location: USA Posts: 3,005	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? You’ll need to build something for example DSLR rotating camera mount behind the scenes - YouTube or mount a tripod head horizontally even on a slider to roll and slide at the same time You also might need to instead mount the camera to a wheel since you probably need to be ground level Last edited by Pete Cofrancesco; February 4th, 2019 at 10:12 PM.

February 4th, 2019, 10:07 PM	#3
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? Okay thanks. I can try building something but the start and stop of it, does not seem the smoothest, but maybe that just takes practice. Do you think maybe I should just build all my equipment to move the camera? Like for example, I was thinking of getting a gimbal, but should I just make a DIY steadicam rig instead, or are gimbals popular because they can do a better job, than the DYI stuff?

February 4th, 2019, 10:31 PM	#4
Pete Cofrancesco Inner Circle Join Date: May 2004 Location: USA Posts: 3,005	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? Tripod head would allow a more controlled roll but would limit the rotation to less than 180 degrees. Like someone said most of this stuff you have to experiment for yourself. I’ve used both, I’d recommend the electronic gimbal over the steadicam for its ease of use and versatility. The steadicam yields a more natural motion but is exceedingly difficult to operate properly.

February 4th, 2019, 11:17 PM	#5
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? Okay thanks. That is a limitation with the tripod head that is for sure. I was trying to find out how many degree of a roll the Moza Air 2 could do but cannot find any tutorials on it, that talk about how far it can push a roll, or how fast it can do a roll. Mainly I want to do the roll, while an actor rolls, and the actors are going to do the rolls as fast as they can. But can the Moza Air 2 do a full fast roll, and keep up? I was going to invest in a gimbal anyway, for all these others moves I could do for other shots. But would the Moza Air 2 be able to do the rolls as well?

February 5th, 2019, 12:03 AM	#6
Pete Cofrancesco Inner Circle Join Date: May 2004 Location: USA Posts: 3,005	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? Gimbals are for slow smooth motion not what I’d imagine the speed you need for fight scene. You could be over thinking it. might be a simple as the camera hand held and the operator rolling on mat along side the actor. Just experiment until you find the right approach. Even if a gimbal isn’t the right tool for this scene you should get one they’re indispensable for cinematic work.

February 5th, 2019, 12:26 AM	#7
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? Okay thanks, I was most likely going to get one any way for other shots. I don't think they are for slow motion only though, as they seem to perform well with action scenes, such as following actors while running in chase scenes, in the short films I have seen, unless I am wrong. However, if it is not right for doing fast rolls, what is? I tried doing it handheld, as a test but it looks too handheld, and not good or professional. I think need some sort of stabilized too, that can roll it fast, while keeping it stabilized, if possible. Actually according to B & H, the Moza Air can do a 360 degree role, but I still can't find what the speed is.

February 5th, 2019, 07:38 AM	#8
Pete Cofrancesco Inner Circle Join Date: May 2004 Location: USA Posts: 3,005	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? I meant for this particular action I can’t imagine you’d be able to match the speed and timing of a roll with a gimbal like you would with a tripod head.

February 5th, 2019, 11:52 AM	#9
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,888	Re: Can a gimbal do fast roll moves? Okay thanks, I could use a tripod head if that's better, and I looked for one before, but I could not find a tripod head that could do a full 360 degree roll, or at least close to. Is there any? Plus the roll a tripod head does looks off, cause the anchor point of the roll is not in the middle of the camera, like a gimbal.