"film like" slow mo

Marcus Marchesseault · December 6th, 2005, 02:41 AM

The rugby slomo was done by the Dynapel software from Goodervideo's site. No other software was used. Their software uses a type of "morphing" between original video frames. It uses the original as keyframes and extrapolates new frames between using intelligent "morphing" techniques. Download the demo software for free and test some of your videos. It is a standalone application, so you don't need a specific plugin.

Mike Henderson · December 6th, 2005, 05:24 AM

Exactly "which" software are you referring to please? I had tried out the "Slowmotion" software on that site and this did not do what the Rugby video showed, please advise, thanks.

Rick Steele · December 6th, 2005, 06:14 AM

Well, I tried the MotionPerfect demo on a test AVI made in Adobe Premiere slowed to 50%.

I can't see any difference. My test AVI required no additional frames to be created by MotionPerfect. I suspect Premiere already did this?

I'm thinking that the DynaPel products are designed for converting choppy video with non-standard frame rates (like from a web cam) to full frame PAL or NTSC. Indeed that's what DynaPel's demos videos seem to show.

Mike Henderson · December 6th, 2005, 06:35 AM

In my situation, I record my video's from the Digicam into the pc and simply wish to have the slomo done exactly like with the Rugby video without having to modify the video in any way [slowing down the speed e.t.c], I wrote to Dynapel's main Technician yesterday and I am waiting on his reply to find out what I need to do be able to control my avi videos in slomo in the exact way that this Rugby video does it with the quicktime player, will report back here if I hear from him.

Marcus Marchesseault · December 7th, 2005, 05:32 AM

Slowing the video down %50 will double it's length. It's as simple as that. Why slow it down in Premiere, then slow it down again in MotionPerfect? That would quadruple the length of the video. You are just doing extra steps and Premiere won't give you the smooth slow motion that can be achieved with SlowMotion or MotionPerfect.

Quicktime is not being used to slow the rugby video. Dynapel's software slowed it down and Quicktime is simply playing it. Quicktime thinks it is just a normal video. New frames were generated by SlowMotion to keep the framerate smooth.

I downloaded SlowMotion from Goodervideo and it does exactly what it should. It takes in a standard video file and slows the motion down by increasing the number of frames. When played back, it looks slow because it is a longer video file. It plays at the normal framerate, it just has more frames to play so it will take longer for the same action to take place.

Mike Henderson · December 7th, 2005, 05:44 AM

I hear what you're saying Marcus but please understand that I am trying to get the same result from my video files as with the Rugby video and this is just not happening with the slowmotion software on it's own so something is missing here and that is why I wrote to Dynapel's Tech, still haven't heard from them.

Rick Steele · December 7th, 2005, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus Marchesseault

Slowing the video down %50 will double it's length.

Yes.

Quote:

Why slow it down in Premiere, then slow it down again in MotionPerfect?

Let me clarify.

- I have a 1 minute AVI source at 100% speed
- I use Premiere to render that source at 50% speed
- Used the same source in Motion Perfect at 50%
- Put those two side-by-side... No difference.

The frame counts are pretty much the same too. After researching some functionality in Premiere Pro 1.51 it seems it does its own "frame interpolation" just like MP but I'm sure the algorithm is different.

Again, MotionPerfect indeed does what it claims as I can't tell the difference between the two clips. I was just hoping it would do a better job at "frame blending" using a 29.97 source but it appears it only inserts redundant frames where needed (which is what premiere and other NLE's do anyway).

Now if one were to use the Rugby source footage in this test, Premiere would not do what MP does so again, I'm guessing it's only good for using non-standard frame rates as the source footage (like taking 15fps from a web cam to 30fps)

This is all speculation on my part as I've really never thought about what happens when rendering slo-mo. It's very interesting and I'm learning a lot.

Marcus Marchesseault · December 7th, 2005, 07:37 AM

Nope, it doesn't just insert frames. Read the FAQ on Goodervideo's site. Also, look at your two 50% clips on a good NTSC monitor at full framerate. Don't use your computer as it's framerate can be variable. I'm sure you will see a difference. If you don't, use MP or SlowMotion to it's slowest rate. Do the same rate with Premiere. I'm sure you will see a difference. If that doesn't work, run the SlowMotion clip through the software again slowing it to something like 1/6th it's original speed and you should see a huge difference. The rugby video is something like 1/15th the original speed, so one might need to run the video through the software a few times.

Mike Henderson · December 7th, 2005, 07:41 AM

Let me see if I am understanding this slomo thing correctly, are you saying that I can take my son's game's video avi files and slow it down first then import it into Quicktime and get the same manipulation as with the Rugby video?

Rick Steele · December 7th, 2005, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Henderson

Let me see if I am understanding this slomo thing correctly, are you saying that I can take my son's game's video avi files and slow it down first then import it into Quicktime and get the same manipulation as with the Rugby video?

Mike, forget quicktime - take it out of the picture as it has nothing to do with the task at hand. The Rugby sample footage was "converted" to quicktime to make the download smaller. Prior to that conversion the original file was an uncompressed AVI.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus Marchesseault

If you don't, use MP or SlowMotion to it's slowest rate. Do the same rate with Premiere.

Well, I did the same test at quarter speed. Things look worse in MP but and the Premiere render turned out much better. Again, I couldn't tell much difference in scenes where somebody is just walking but when using MP at 25% speed for something like a golf swing was unacceptable - the blurring is too choppy.

I'm not downgrading this product. I just think there's a reason why it's priced the way it is. (vs. Twixtor or RealVis for example).

Mike Henderson · December 7th, 2005, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Steele

Mike, forget quicktime - take it out of the picture as it has nothing to do with the task at hand. The Rugby sample footage was "converted" to quicktime to make the download smaller. Prior to that conversion the original file was an uncompressed AVI..

The reason why I mentioned Quicktime Rick is becuase of the "slider" manipulation, when I move the "play" slider on the Quicktime interface [with the Rugby video], it gives me the smooth slomo like the NFL/NBA e.t.c, this is what I need, ok so I am guessing from your post that I can use "any" interface for this that has a similar slider? If so, then what do I need to get the slomo itself like in the Rugby video?

Rick Steele · December 7th, 2005, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Henderson

I can use "any" interface for this that has a similar slider? If so, then what do I need to get the slomo itself like in the Rugby video?

I don't know what slider you're referring to in QuickTime and no you don't need it to use the Dynapel's SlowMotion software .

Using the SlowMotion software merely open your source AVI and allow it to do its thing (try half speed). The resultant file will also be an AVI and depending on the frame rate of your source file can be much larger than the original.

Try playing that AVI in Windows Media Player.

Mike Henderson · December 7th, 2005, 08:58 AM

The slider is question is the slider on the bottom of the interface that moves from left to right, what I do is I click on it and drag it either to the left or right to go forward or reverse and however quickly I feel to and the slomo is not choppy, it is very smooth. I had tried it in WMP and "every" other player [also Quicktime] that has a similar slider but only got choppy results.

My question here would be "how" to get the my avi to show in slomo like the way it shows in the rugby video when I move the slider. I will try the Gooder "slow motion" software again, this time at a slower speed like you suggested, I don't think I had done this before, will get back to you in afew, thanks.

Mike Henderson · December 7th, 2005, 09:48 AM

I played with the slowmotion factors but again, main problem, the Gooder interface does not have a slider for me to drag to control the speed of the slomo? I am wondering now if I can slow down the speed of my video file, save it and then import that into quicktime, would this do the trick?

Rick Steele · December 7th, 2005, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Henderson

I played with the slowmotion factors but again, main problem, the Gooder interface does not have a slider for me to drag to control the speed of the slomo? I am wondering now if I can slow down the speed of my video file, save it and then import that into quicktime, would this do the trick?

Mike, you have some kind of fixation with this “slider” thing. :) Forget QuickTime, Forget the slider, forget everything you’ve ever heard about these two terms. Let’s start over.

(1.) If you haven’t already done so, download the SlowMotion software demo here and install it.

http://www.goodervideo.com/download/...on_Install.exe

(2.) Start the demo

(3.) In the “Input” section click the Browse button. Navigate to any AVI you want to apply the slow motion to. I’d suggest chosing something real short (60 seconds or so) as the rendering process will take a while.

(4.) In the “Video Settings” section let’s try reducing the speed to 50%. (Slowmotion Factor 2).

(5.) Next press the “Video Compressor” button… just to the right. Under “Output Compressor” choose “DV Video Encoder”. Make sure compressor quality is set to 100%. Press OK when you’ve done this.

(6.) Note the location file name given In the “Output” video section. This is where you’re finished clip will end up once rendering is done. Browse to a different folder and rename it if you want.

(7.) Press the “Start” icon on the toolbar and let it do its thing. (Depending on the length of your source AVI It’ll take a while). Also, the demo will watermark the final result.

Are we gettin’ anywhere yet?

December 6th, 2005, 02:41 AM	#31
Marcus Marchesseault Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 1,961	The rugby slomo was done by the Dynapel software from Goodervideo's site. No other software was used. Their software uses a type of "morphing" between original video frames. It uses the original as keyframes and extrapolates new frames between using intelligent "morphing" techniques. Download the demo software for free and test some of your videos. It is a standalone application, so you don't need a specific plugin.

December 6th, 2005, 05:24 AM	#32
Mike Henderson New Boot Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 16	Exactly "which" software are you referring to please? I had tried out the "Slowmotion" software on that site and this did not do what the Rugby video showed, please advise, thanks.

December 6th, 2005, 06:14 AM	#33
Rick Steele Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Denver, Colorado USA Posts: 654	Well, I tried the MotionPerfect demo on a test AVI made in Adobe Premiere slowed to 50%. I can't see any difference. My test AVI required no additional frames to be created by MotionPerfect. I suspect Premiere already did this? I'm thinking that the DynaPel products are designed for converting choppy video with non-standard frame rates (like from a web cam) to full frame PAL or NTSC. Indeed that's what DynaPel's demos videos seem to show.

December 6th, 2005, 06:35 AM	#34
Mike Henderson New Boot Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 16	In my situation, I record my video's from the Digicam into the pc and simply wish to have the slomo done exactly like with the Rugby video without having to modify the video in any way [slowing down the speed e.t.c], I wrote to Dynapel's main Technician yesterday and I am waiting on his reply to find out what I need to do be able to control my avi videos in slomo in the exact way that this Rugby video does it with the quicktime player, will report back here if I hear from him.

December 7th, 2005, 05:32 AM	#35
Marcus Marchesseault Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 1,961	Slowing the video down %50 will double it's length. It's as simple as that. Why slow it down in Premiere, then slow it down again in MotionPerfect? That would quadruple the length of the video. You are just doing extra steps and Premiere won't give you the smooth slow motion that can be achieved with SlowMotion or MotionPerfect. Quicktime is not being used to slow the rugby video. Dynapel's software slowed it down and Quicktime is simply playing it. Quicktime thinks it is just a normal video. New frames were generated by SlowMotion to keep the framerate smooth. I downloaded SlowMotion from Goodervideo and it does exactly what it should. It takes in a standard video file and slows the motion down by increasing the number of frames. When played back, it looks slow because it is a longer video file. It plays at the normal framerate, it just has more frames to play so it will take longer for the same action to take place.

December 7th, 2005, 05:44 AM	#36
Mike Henderson New Boot Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 16	I hear what you're saying Marcus but please understand that I am trying to get the same result from my video files as with the Rugby video and this is just not happening with the slowmotion software on it's own so something is missing here and that is why I wrote to Dynapel's Tech, still haven't heard from them.

December 7th, 2005, 07:37 AM	#38
Marcus Marchesseault Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 1,961	Nope, it doesn't just insert frames. Read the FAQ on Goodervideo's site. Also, look at your two 50% clips on a good NTSC monitor at full framerate. Don't use your computer as it's framerate can be variable. I'm sure you will see a difference. If you don't, use MP or SlowMotion to it's slowest rate. Do the same rate with Premiere. I'm sure you will see a difference. If that doesn't work, run the SlowMotion clip through the software again slowing it to something like 1/6th it's original speed and you should see a huge difference. The rugby video is something like 1/15th the original speed, so one might need to run the video through the software a few times.

December 7th, 2005, 07:41 AM	#39
Mike Henderson New Boot Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 16	Let me see if I am understanding this slomo thing correctly, are you saying that I can take my son's game's video avi files and slow it down first then import it into Quicktime and get the same manipulation as with the Rugby video?

December 7th, 2005, 08:58 AM	#43
Mike Henderson New Boot Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 16	The slider is question is the slider on the bottom of the interface that moves from left to right, what I do is I click on it and drag it either to the left or right to go forward or reverse and however quickly I feel to and the slomo is not choppy, it is very smooth. I had tried it in WMP and "every" other player [also Quicktime] that has a similar slider but only got choppy results. My question here would be "how" to get the my avi to show in slomo like the way it shows in the rugby video when I move the slider. I will try the Gooder "slow motion" software again, this time at a slower speed like you suggested, I don't think I had done this before, will get back to you in afew, thanks.

December 7th, 2005, 09:48 AM	#44
Mike Henderson New Boot Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 16	I played with the slowmotion factors but again, main problem, the Gooder interface does not have a slider for me to drag to control the speed of the slomo? I am wondering now if I can slow down the speed of my video file, save it and then import that into quicktime, would this do the trick?