Any full time colorists here?

[Tim Kolb]

Originally Posted by Perrone Ford

Colorista didn't add anything beyond what I already had. I have tools for color correction. I wanted tools for grading. MB Looks contains Colorista's tools and a bunch of other stuff as well.

Well...of course on Avid, you have pretty damn solid CC tools as you point out...but Looks is more of an aesthetic in my mind...a really good one (I like Looks), but I would not characterize it as a color correction tool on par with Colorista (which we both agree you probably don't need with Media Composer).

"Grading" is an interesting term. It -was- "color correction" such as it was, light bulbs and all in the days of Telecine...now it seems to mean "make something look more like it came off a telecine."

Nothing wrong with that BTW...it's just that everyone has a different concept in their head...like when you or I say "loud, obnoxious music"... For some, that may be Nirvana, for others Metallica, for still others, standing too close to a polka band is what comes to mind.

[Perrone Ford]

LOL!

Well the delineation for me is this:

Color Correction: Getting to a properly exposed image that is faithful to what was seen by the eye of the person behind the lens. This could be as simple as fixing the fact that someone shot with a the wrong filter in front of the lens, or it could be that the film or sensor was exposed half a stop or more in the wrong direction, etc.

Color Grading: Manipulation of the image away from what was seen through the lens. If the DP couldn't get light onto a subjects face and that is changed in post, that's grading. If the DP couldn't get gel on a window and it's 2 stops too hot and needs to be brought down, that's grading. If someone's shoes are the wrong color and you want to change them, that's grading. If the sky isn't blue enough because you forgot the polarizer that day, that's grading.

Media Composer has a decent set of tools for color correction. But for grading, not so much. Actually, what I saw in Colorista 2 this week would shame Avid's tools even for color correction in many instances. However, some of the add-ins for Avid bring a LOT of power.

[Steve Kalle]

To Tim and any other AE CS5 users: would "Color Finesse 2" (included with AE CS5) be for grading or just correction? Tim - can you see if Color Finesse 2 will output via you Kona?

On a side note: because this thread is about CC/CG, I think many would like to know that Premiere Pro CS5 is the first NLE to convert YUV to RGB automatically by using any of its color effects. There is a great article over at provideocoalition.com that says you don't really need a pro I/O device with Premiere CS5 for CC/CG.

[Tim Kolb]

Hi Steve,

I haven't done the test yet, but since the preview out of AE can be viewed on the Kona (Windows or Mac) as far as I know (I KNOW on Windows...), I see no reason why CF wouldn't work.

I have no knowledge of how the RGB conversion is done though...AE is RGB only of course.

I did read that article you mention...and I'm chasing down some additional details on the "pipe" in PPro. I did notice that the article notes that ProRes 4444 is RGB...as far as I know, it's not. All ProRes in Y'CbCr to my knowledge (which isn't always right...but I think I have this one on good authority).

[Steve Nelson]

Steve,

You can use it for both CC and CG. You may choose to use multiple layers with masks created outside of Color Finesse but it just depends on what look you're going for. That being said, you can use the Curves, Hue/Saturation and other native tools in AE as well with similar results but they don't provide the scopes that Color Finesse provides. It's all a matter of preference and what you're comfortable working with. I sometimes like to combine Colorista after I do the initial work in Color Finesse because I feel the color wheels there provide a stronger more bold result than the color wheels inside Color Finesse. Again, it just depends upon the look you're trying to achieve.

[Steve Nelson]

Originally Posted by Perrone Ford

LOL!

Actually, what I saw in Colorista 2 this week would shame Avid's tools even for color correction in many instances. However, some of the add-ins for Avid bring a LOT of power.

I got some hands-on time with Colorista II last night and I agree! Huge improvement over version 1 and I may just end up using this as my #1 for CC and CG once I have a chance to do more side-by-side comparisons with renders and workflow. If it had its own set of scopes like Color Finesse I would be sold for sure. That being said, I can leverage the scopes in Premiere Pro or go purchase Test Gear 2 from Synthetic Aperture for After Effects. So far I'm really impressed with it though.

[Tim Kolb]

I just took a 17 minute master timeline and stripped out the CC I had on it in PPro and replaced it all with Colorista II.

I think "Looks" is a far different product and I think while both have a really impressive amount of control...they're both very different products.

I can't find a good reason to restrict myself to one or the other. :-)


(I'm rehearsing this for my wife...what do you think? Convincing?)


Seriously...IMO, both products' ROI has got to be some of the best in the industry.

[Steve Nelson]

Yep, both good tools with some overlap but really different tools for different jobs IMHO. I have both but don't use Looks very much anymore. I'm more into straight CC and CG but Looks is real good for doing some quick grading and getting of course that "Look".