Classical Music: Is it legal to use in movies? at DVinfo.net

Drew Meinecke · June 4th, 2005, 07:50 AM

I know that public domain is legal to use, but if I buy a CD of a performance of a public domain song that has been recorded recently is it still considered public domain?

Boyd Ostroff · June 4th, 2005, 08:02 AM

Almost always: no. It's very simple to find out... just look to see if the CD is copyrighted.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 4th, 2005, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drew Meinecke

I know that public domain is legal to use, but if I buy a CD of a performance of a public domain song that has been recorded recently is it still considered public domain?

No, this is not considered public domain.
If you have a local choir sing "Battle Hymn of the Republic," which is a pub-domain song, you could have them do a work-for-hire agreement, and the song is yours to use as you choose.
If you took the Mormon Tabernacle Choir's recording of the "Battle Hymn of the Republic" you could expect a lawsuit to be knocking on your door.

While the song might be PD, the recording is not. The recording carries its own copyright, held by the recording artist or his publisher. In addition, sync rights and mechanical rights become part of the story too.

Peter Wiley · June 4th, 2005, 08:37 AM

The best rule of thumb is to assume that all recorded music is copyrighted. In practice it is very difficult to find out if any recording or piece of music is really in the public domain.

Looking at the CD won't do it because even if the performer is not claiming copyright over his/her performance that does not mean you have a right to use the music.

See: http://www.pdinfo.com/

And esp. http://www.pdinfo.com/record.htm

Paul Tauger · June 6th, 2005, 10:10 AM

Any work of authorship that is fixed in a tangible medium is protected by copyright under U.S. law. Copyright protection arises when a public domain work is translated into a new medium, e.g. if a very old recording that has passed into the public domain is digitized and ANY "selection" is made, e.g. filtering, pop and hiss removal, etc., a new protectable work is created.

Any CD recording implicates multiple copyright concerns. Though the underlying work may have passed into the public domain, the recording itself may still be protected.

Drew Meinecke · June 8th, 2005, 11:26 AM

So are there any recordings of classical music available for legal use? Or do I have to have them performed and record it?

Paul Tauger · June 8th, 2005, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drew Meinecke

So are there any recordings of classical music available for legal use? Or do I have to have them performed and record it?

I'm sure there are some, if you have an old wax-cylinder player. There may be some phonograph records around which have fallen into the public domain. I'd be surprised if there were any CDs.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 8th, 2005, 11:34 AM

There are LOTS of libes of classical music created solely for the purpose of royalty-free/buyout (which isn't necessarily the same thing)
The cheapest ones can be found at Sam Goodies' or Camelot, in their Sound FX sections. Be SURE to look at the license, because sometimes they're not licensed for broadcast, but ARE licensed for mass production of non-broadcast product. I bought one last month in Walmart's bargain bin for 2.99, and it's got 9 classical selections that only needed EQ and some verb and they were quite usable. Sound Dogs has offerings, Weed has some, Freeplay has some, it's really all over the place.
Another option is to find classical midi files that someone has specifically said "you can use this" or "This is Public Domain" and use the MIDI files to generate your own orchestral sounds.
Finally, the local community orchestras usually are open for this for free or low fee. I've done this twice in SLC, Ut

Jimmy McKenzie · June 8th, 2005, 12:23 PM

Hi Douglas,
Many of my buyout non-needle drop libraries have various classical tracks that are useful from time to time. I'm curious about the disk you found at Walmart. Is this something you can use in a video production that will not hit the air?
Thanks - Jimmy.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 8th, 2005, 12:29 PM

Yes, the disk I found at Walmart specifically states :
"These sounds may be used for commercial sound design and audio composition, excluding audio or video presentation sent over public airwaves. You may not reproduce these sounds as individual sounds for purposes of resale; they must be incorporated exclusively into sound design or audio compostion. "Any unauthorized use yadayadayada."

I've seen other even less restrictive statements.

Jimmy McKenzie · June 8th, 2005, 12:36 PM

Thanks for the reply. Next excursion to the "electronic" department, I'll be sure to read the fine print.

June 4th, 2005, 07:50 AM	#1
Drew Meinecke Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: USA Posts: 53	Classical Music: Is it legal to use in movies? I know that public domain is legal to use, but if I buy a CD of a performance of a public domain song that has been recorded recently is it still considered public domain?

June 8th, 2005, 11:34 AM	#8
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	There are LOTS of libes of classical music created solely for the purpose of royalty-free/buyout (which isn't necessarily the same thing) The cheapest ones can be found at Sam Goodies' or Camelot, in their Sound FX sections. Be SURE to look at the license, because sometimes they're not licensed for broadcast, but ARE licensed for mass production of non-broadcast product. I bought one last month in Walmart's bargain bin for 2.99, and it's got 9 classical selections that only needed EQ and some verb and they were quite usable. Sound Dogs has offerings, Weed has some, Freeplay has some, it's really all over the place. Another option is to find classical midi files that someone has specifically said "you can use this" or "This is Public Domain" and use the MIDI files to generate your own orchestral sounds. Finally, the local community orchestras usually are open for this for free or low fee. I've done this twice in SLC, Ut __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

June 8th, 2005, 12:23 PM	#9
Jimmy McKenzie Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Waterloo Ontario Posts: 721	Walmart? Hi Douglas, Many of my buyout non-needle drop libraries have various classical tracks that are useful from time to time. I'm curious about the disk you found at Walmart. Is this something you can use in a video production that will not hit the air? Thanks - Jimmy.

June 8th, 2005, 12:29 PM	#10
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	Yes, the disk I found at Walmart specifically states : "These sounds may be used for commercial sound design and audio composition, excluding audio or video presentation sent over public airwaves. You may not reproduce these sounds as individual sounds for purposes of resale; they must be incorporated exclusively into sound design or audio compostion. "Any unauthorized use yadayadayada." I've seen other even less restrictive statements. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

June 4th, 2005, 08:02 AM	#2
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Almost always: no. It's very simple to find out... just look to see if the CD is copyrighted.

June 4th, 2005, 08:37 AM	#4
Peter Wiley Major Player Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Lewisburg PA Posts: 752	The best rule of thumb is to assume that all recorded music is copyrighted. In practice it is very difficult to find out if any recording or piece of music is really in the public domain. Looking at the CD won't do it because even if the performer is not claiming copyright over his/her performance that does not mean you have a right to use the music. See: http://www.pdinfo.com/ And esp. http://www.pdinfo.com/record.htm

June 6th, 2005, 10:10 AM	#5
Paul Tauger Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Los Angeles (recently from San Francisco) Posts: 954	Any work of authorship that is fixed in a tangible medium is protected by copyright under U.S. law. Copyright protection arises when a public domain work is translated into a new medium, e.g. if a very old recording that has passed into the public domain is digitized and ANY "selection" is made, e.g. filtering, pop and hiss removal, etc., a new protectable work is created. Any CD recording implicates multiple copyright concerns. Though the underlying work may have passed into the public domain, the recording itself may still be protected.

June 8th, 2005, 11:26 AM	#6
Drew Meinecke Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: USA Posts: 53	So are there any recordings of classical music available for legal use? Or do I have to have them performed and record it?

June 8th, 2005, 12:36 PM	#11
Jimmy McKenzie Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Waterloo Ontario Posts: 721	Thanks for the reply. Next excursion to the "electronic" department, I'll be sure to read the fine print.