Copyright -- Various Issues

Scott T Anderson · April 12th, 2004, 11:11 PM

What's the farthest I can take someone else's song? What I mean is... I know if I keep my video private I can do anything I want, but where is the line drawn as far as using someone's copyrighted material? I am shooting a movie (for fun) with my friends and I am going to put in some music that i got from a CD. What can I NOT do with it? Can I use it in a portfolio? Can I send it to people to get my name out as long as I am not going for money? What's the deal?

Richard Alvarez · April 13th, 2004, 05:33 AM

Do a search under Paul Tauger here on the forum. Long threads about copyright issues are hashed and re-hashed.

Dylan Couper · April 13th, 2004, 03:04 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Scott T Anderson : What's the farthest I can take someone else's song? What I mean is... I know if I keep my video private I can do anything I want, but where is the line drawn as far as using someone's copyrighted material? I am shooting a movie (for fun) with my friends and I am going to put in some music that i got from a CD. What can I NOT do with it? Can I use it in a portfolio? Can I send it to people to get my name out as long as I am not going for money? What's the deal? -->>>

Here's the quick skinny.

NO.

:)

Bascially, you cannot do anything with it, except listen to it. When you buy music, that is all you are getting the rights to do with it. That is where the line is drawn.

The truth is of course, that you can really do whatever you want. If you are just watching it yourself or with friends, no-one is really going to know or care. That might be as far as I would go. I would not put it up on the web and I would NEVER use music I didn't have the rights to in my portfolio. I cannot think of anything less professional, except stealing video as well.

There are lots of sources of cheap, or free music out there. If you really need some, check with local bands as well.

Paul Tauger · April 13th, 2004, 04:38 PM

Yeah, what Dylan said.

;)

Don Parrish · May 18th, 2004, 06:48 AM

DETROIT -- A federal judge in Detroit has ruled that Eminem can proceed with copyright infringement claims against Apple Computer and other companies.

An ad for Apple's i-Pod music player and i-Tunes music service featured a boy singing the rapper's song "Lose Yourself." The commercial had been running last year on MTV, and on Apple's Web site.

The judge's ruling said Eminem's case can proceed against several companies, including MTV parent Viacom, and an advertising agency.

Apple had used the ad despite the fact that the company had failed to get Eminem's permission for the campaign. A lawyer for the defendants said no viewer would think Eminem is endorsing the i-Tunes service.

Michael Gibbons · May 18th, 2004, 08:33 AM

The lawyer's comment is the best. Very nice attempt to change the issue into something other than the copyright infringement it so obviously is.

How is this any different from any of us using copyrighted material in our video productions? Apple and Viacom can afford better lawyers, and therefore can ignore the law, that's how! To run the commercial for well over a year too, that is just arrogance.
I'm an Apple guy and all, but I hope Eminem comes out on top here. Regardless of how I feel about his music, I think he is in the right.
Michael

Rob Lohman · May 19th, 2004, 02:08 AM

Why can they go after MTV? MTV didn't make the ad, they just
sold a timeslot to someone else. Are they liable for what they
put in that timeslot?

Law Tyler · May 22nd, 2004, 04:08 PM

Well, in US, they can go after everybody the product passes thru. It is a well-designed system by wealthy lawyers, judges, and politicians to stifle innovation and free market. :-)

Shane Kinloch · June 23rd, 2004, 04:42 PM

G'day,

I'm considering using an old radio recording (mp3) of "The Teddy Bears Picnic" in an upcomming film project. I've only used music by friends in the past and was wondering what the copyright issues were with old recordings of old songs.

Can anyone help?

What if I used a mechanical music box that played the tune?

Dylan Couper · June 24th, 2004, 01:30 AM

Good question Shane. It's been covered quite a few times here. If you do a search in this forum using the terms music and copyright, you'll find a dozen threads with complete answers. To give you a quick rundown:
1) You need permission from whoever owns the rights to the original radio recodring in order to use it legaly.
2) If it is from a music box, it may be old enough that the melody is part of the public domain and can be used free. You'll have to do a little searching though.

Keith Loh · June 24th, 2004, 08:56 AM

I think if you used a mechanical music box the threading in the box would still qualify as someone's 'recording'. So then you would have to check to see if those rights are still active.

Linda Schodowsky · June 24th, 2004, 05:05 PM

I have been wondering something similar... suppost you have a subject in your film that is whistling or singing a few bars of a song? For example, if I were to show an individual in the film whistling/singing a few bars of "Wasting away again in Margeritaville" (sorry, but I saw Jimmy Buffet on Today and it's the only thing I can think of :)).

I've been wondering this... anybody know the answer? And the song would be not related to the movie in any way, just having a regular scene from a movie.

Paul Tauger · June 24th, 2004, 05:30 PM

Quote:

I have been wondering something similar... suppost you have a subject in your film that is whistling or singing a few bars of a song? For example, if I were to show an individual in the film whistling/singing a few bars of "Wasting away again in Margeritaville" (sorry, but I saw Jimmy Buffet on Today and it's the only thing I can think of :)).

It would be copyright infringement, if done without a license.

Nick Vizzone · July 14th, 2004, 11:04 AM

Does the music (or sound) from the shower scene in Psycho (you know, "wheet wheet wheet wheet") have a copyright? I think it might be part of a longer piece of music so I'm assuming yes. I've heard it (or something similar) in commercials and other movies, how do they do it? If you want to use something similar, how different does it have to be (considering it's only a note or two played on a stringed instrument)?

Bottom line is that this music (or sound) would fit perfectly in a scene from a short I'm making, but I will not steal someone else's work. Thanks if you can answer this.

Keith Loh · July 14th, 2004, 11:55 AM

I think perhaps it falls under parody use. If you are not appropriating the music and saying it is yours, you are just commenting on the music (or rather, the larger film) satirically. Everyone knows that music is from "Psycho".

EDIT: to backtrack, I know people use the notes from Jaws as well but I've heard them slightly altered so that they are not quite the same but still distinctively Jaws.

April 12th, 2004, 11:11 PM	#61
Scott T Anderson New Boot Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Tempe, Az Posts: 24	Music and copyright What's the farthest I can take someone else's song? What I mean is... I know if I keep my video private I can do anything I want, but where is the line drawn as far as using someone's copyrighted material? I am shooting a movie (for fun) with my friends and I am going to put in some music that i got from a CD. What can I NOT do with it? Can I use it in a portfolio? Can I send it to people to get my name out as long as I am not going for money? What's the deal?

April 13th, 2004, 03:04 PM	#63
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Re: Music and copyright <<<-- Originally posted by Scott T Anderson : What's the farthest I can take someone else's song? What I mean is... I know if I keep my video private I can do anything I want, but where is the line drawn as far as using someone's copyrighted material? I am shooting a movie (for fun) with my friends and I am going to put in some music that i got from a CD. What can I NOT do with it? Can I use it in a portfolio? Can I send it to people to get my name out as long as I am not going for money? What's the deal? -->>> Here's the quick skinny. NO. :) Bascially, you cannot do anything with it, except listen to it. When you buy music, that is all you are getting the rights to do with it. That is where the line is drawn. The truth is of course, that you can really do whatever you want. If you are just watching it yourself or with friends, no-one is really going to know or care. That might be as far as I would go. I would not put it up on the web and I would NEVER use music I didn't have the rights to in my portfolio. I cannot think of anything less professional, except stealing video as well. There are lots of sources of cheap, or free music out there. If you really need some, check with local bands as well. __________________ Need to rent camera gear in Vancouver BC? Check me out at camerarentalsvancouver.com

May 18th, 2004, 06:48 AM	#65
Don Parrish Major Player Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Tavares Fla Posts: 541	Remake copyright suit by Eminem DETROIT -- A federal judge in Detroit has ruled that Eminem can proceed with copyright infringement claims against Apple Computer and other companies. An ad for Apple's i-Pod music player and i-Tunes music service featured a boy singing the rapper's song "Lose Yourself." The commercial had been running last year on MTV, and on Apple's Web site. The judge's ruling said Eminem's case can proceed against several companies, including MTV parent Viacom, and an advertising agency. Apple had used the ad despite the fact that the company had failed to get Eminem's permission for the campaign. A lawyer for the defendants said no viewer would think Eminem is endorsing the i-Tunes service.

May 18th, 2004, 08:33 AM	#66
Michael Gibbons Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Loveland, Colorado, USA Posts: 292	HEH The lawyer's comment is the best. Very nice attempt to change the issue into something other than the copyright infringement it so obviously is. How is this any different from any of us using copyrighted material in our video productions? Apple and Viacom can afford better lawyers, and therefore can ignore the law, that's how! To run the commercial for well over a year too, that is just arrogance. I'm an Apple guy and all, but I hope Eminem comes out on top here. Regardless of how I feel about his music, I think he is in the right. Michael __________________ " When some wild-eyed, eight foot tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head against a bar room wall, and looks you crooked in the eye, and he asks you if you've payed your dues, well, you just stare that big suker right back in the eye, and you remember what old Jack Burton always says at a time like that, 'Have you paid your dues, Jack? Yes sir, the check is in the mail."

May 19th, 2004, 02:08 AM	#67
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Why can they go after MTV? MTV didn't make the ad, they just sold a timeslot to someone else. Are they liable for what they put in that timeslot? __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

April 13th, 2004, 05:33 AM	#62
Richard Alvarez Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: San Mateo, CA Posts: 3,840	Do a search under Paul Tauger here on the forum. Long threads about copyright issues are hashed and re-hashed.

April 13th, 2004, 04:38 PM	#64
Paul Tauger Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Los Angeles (recently from San Francisco) Posts: 954	Yeah, what Dylan said. ;)

May 22nd, 2004, 04:08 PM	#68
Law Tyler Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Plano, TX Posts: 204	Well, in US, they can go after everybody the product passes thru. It is a well-designed system by wealthy lawyers, judges, and politicians to stifle innovation and free market. :-)

June 23rd, 2004, 04:42 PM	#69
Shane Kinloch Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 29	Music Copyright in Films G'day, I'm considering using an old radio recording (mp3) of "The Teddy Bears Picnic" in an upcomming film project. I've only used music by friends in the past and was wondering what the copyright issues were with old recordings of old songs. Can anyone help? What if I used a mechanical music box that played the tune?

June 24th, 2004, 01:30 AM	#70
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Good question Shane. It's been covered quite a few times here. If you do a search in this forum using the terms music and copyright, you'll find a dozen threads with complete answers. To give you a quick rundown: 1) You need permission from whoever owns the rights to the original radio recodring in order to use it legaly. 2) If it is from a music box, it may be old enough that the melody is part of the public domain and can be used free. You'll have to do a little searching though. __________________ Need to rent camera gear in Vancouver BC? Check me out at camerarentalsvancouver.com

June 24th, 2004, 08:56 AM	#71
Keith Loh Air China Pilot Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vancouver, B.C. Posts: 2,389	I think if you used a mechanical music box the threading in the box would still qualify as someone's 'recording'. So then you would have to check to see if those rights are still active. __________________ -- Visit http://www.KeithLoh.com \| stuff about living in Vancouver \| My Flickr photo gallery

June 24th, 2004, 05:05 PM	#72
Linda Schodowsky Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Berea, Ohio Posts: 139	I have been wondering something similar... suppost you have a subject in your film that is whistling or singing a few bars of a song? For example, if I were to show an individual in the film whistling/singing a few bars of "Wasting away again in Margeritaville" (sorry, but I saw Jimmy Buffet on Today and it's the only thing I can think of :)). I've been wondering this... anybody know the answer? And the song would be not related to the movie in any way, just having a regular scene from a movie.

July 14th, 2004, 11:04 AM	#74
Nick Vizzone New Boot Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Fredericksburg, VA Posts: 12	Another darn copyright question Does the music (or sound) from the shower scene in Psycho (you know, "wheet wheet wheet wheet") have a copyright? I think it might be part of a longer piece of music so I'm assuming yes. I've heard it (or something similar) in commercials and other movies, how do they do it? If you want to use something similar, how different does it have to be (considering it's only a note or two played on a stringed instrument)? Bottom line is that this music (or sound) would fit perfectly in a scene from a short I'm making, but I will not steal someone else's work. Thanks if you can answer this.

July 14th, 2004, 11:55 AM	#75
Keith Loh Air China Pilot Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vancouver, B.C. Posts: 2,389	I think perhaps it falls under parody use. If you are not appropriating the music and saying it is yours, you are just commenting on the music (or rather, the larger film) satirically. Everyone knows that music is from "Psycho". EDIT: to backtrack, I know people use the notes from Jaws as well but I've heard them slightly altered so that they are not quite the same but still distinctively Jaws. __________________ -- Visit http://www.KeithLoh.com \| stuff about living in Vancouver \| My Flickr photo gallery