Warning! ... How I lost my DVX100 at DVinfo.net

Bill Peterson · January 3rd, 2004, 01:09 PM

(As posted on the Canopus forum, by me. )

Man do I hate to write this … I’d rather keep it to myself, you'll know why … but it could help some of the great folks here

(deep breath) Well I just got nailed for a AG-DVX100 … I got soft, talked to a nice guy and worked out a deal … split the extra shipping charges (yeah he wanted it overnight) .

He didn’t check out real great but, trying to be a nice guy and help out, I checked out the name he gave me against the address (In LA 1369 E 56th street) His name was Robert Johnson.

The LA county tax assessor whom we called confirmed that Mr. Lonnie J. Johnson owned the property at the above address, and before that it belonged to Emma Johnson. Sounded like a family affair. Talked to Robert several more times to arrange things, he always answered the phone. Till he got the camera that is.

Old Robert was supposedly trying to shoot a music video and really needed the camera.

We called our bank and asked about the best way to do the FedEx COD. Cashiers Check or money order? They said Cashiers Check was good. (Note … never do this, they don’t know squat about how to verify or check these checks, as it turns out).

Next move, sent the cam to the address, COD … FedEx handed it over to someone who didn’t even claim to be Robert Johnson … don’t ask me why yet, I’m still trying to find out how that worked. They delivered the no good cashiers check back here.

By pushing my bank and calling five different Wells Fargo Banks (the check was a Wells Fargo check), we finally determined that it was a dud. You would not believe how hard it was to find out that it was no good. They wanted us to deposit it and see what happened. We wouldn’t have know for over a week.

Meanwhile we call the LA Police department … the address is 8 miles from the Metro Frogery Section station house and only 1.6 miles from the community Police Station.

Robert must have figured that it would be a week or so before we found out the check was rubber, cause they answered the phone, then hung up when they figured out who it was on the line.

Anyway even with all the info, address, owner of property, (single family dwelling) phone numbers registered to someone, the FedEx drivers ID of who signed for it available. Yep you guessed it they wouldn’t drive over there. Fill out some forms and we’ll get back to you in a couple of days and assign someone was their response.

(It's Sat the 3rd now, still no one assigned to the case, next week maybe ... they say)

So that’s my sad tale … I asked for it twice, once in not insisting on dealing with folks on the forums that we all sort of know … and second in breaking my own rules and softening up cause someone was in need. Maybe it was the Christmas lights, maybe the eggnog. I’ve had great results over the last year buying gear from people off the forums, good stuff, and good people. And I got it good … my little Panasonic is in evil hands all by itself out in LA tonight.

Here’s some emails from the bad guys involved:

musicbiz41@yahoo.com,
hardhits@hotmail.com

BTW if you see a Panasonic AG-DVX100 with the serial # L2TD01033 It ain’t theirs email me!

Thanks all, (hope this helps to make you safer)
Happy New Year!
Bpete

Dylan Couper · January 3rd, 2004, 02:15 PM

Man that's awful. Sorry to hear about this. Maybe the cops will come through.

Also, I thought cashiers checks were solid? Doesn't that mean the bank has verified the funds and held they so it would clear once it was cashed?

Bill Peterson · January 3rd, 2004, 02:27 PM

Hey Dylan,
Well, that's exactly why I posted ... NO ... Cashier's Check means nothing to crooks. They forged the check, think of it like counterfeit money. It looks real good. My bank did not know that it was forged. Even Wells Fargo Bank (the check was supposed to be a Wells Fargo Bank check) took half the day to decide it wasn't real.

This same guy also offered to pay me with US PO Money Order. So they are counterfeiting them as well I guess. I understand why you thought that. We called our bank here and asked which was the safest way before we made the arrangments ... they said Cashier's Check ... WRONG!

Take care,
Bill

Matthew de Jongh · January 3rd, 2004, 04:30 PM

that sucks!

i don't suppose fedex has any liability?

i can't think of any way you could have avoided it other than paypal or something?

at least you know where fedex delivered it, so there has got to be some legal recourse, please keep us posted.

matthew

Chris Hurd · January 3rd, 2004, 04:48 PM

This is pretty scary... I tend to insist on cashier's checks myself, and it's surprising to find that even these can be forged. The seller is usually in control of the transaction -- it's always a good idea to ship only after the check has been received, deposited and cleared. However, cons can work both ways and it's always a gamble. PayPal offers some protection but it's not fool-proof. Sorry to hear about this,

Jeff Donald · January 3rd, 2004, 05:30 PM

US Postal Service Money Orders are probably the safest. Postal Inspectors and other Federal authorities are more likely to take fraud and counterfeiting a little more seriously than most metro police departments.

Matthew de Jongh · January 3rd, 2004, 06:53 PM

i always wondered how closely the fedex guy looks at the check for c.o.d.'s

Bill Peterson · January 3rd, 2004, 07:16 PM

Hey Matthew … FedEx claims they have no liability for the forged check. We’re still miffed at the idea they would deliver it to another person than who was on the COD and accept a check from them.

Chris hi, Yeah you are mostly right, but in this case we shouldn’t even know the check is bad yet. Our bank was willing to accept it, then it would go to Wells Fargo, they would ponder it for a bit then tell our bank it was no good and we would get notice … from a week to two weeks for this little trip. Your bank would cash it for you … if you had an account with them and sufficient funds to cover the check. These they freeze till the check clears (or doesn’t if it’s a dud) … then you get the big ouch!

The hair got up on my neck ( a little late) and we faxed a copy to Wells Fargo, called three times etc., even at that they told us at first to deposit it and see, we insisted and they finally said it was forged.

Jeff .. this guy offered to pay by Money order if I wanted, so he’s also running them off at will. Forging/counterfeiting Cashier’s checks also falls under same category as Money Order, according to what this costly lesson is teaching me so far. You can report it to the FBI and they can act … (if they want) via laws about cross state transactions, use of the internet, wire (telephone) etc.. Trouble is they usually pass it down to the local Metro types because it’s not that important (to them).

Frankly the only good way I can see at this point is to have the buyer wire the money directly into your account. But how the heck is the buyer going to feel about that? No product from you and you want his money?

As far as having the address, so far it hasn’t helped a wit. The law won’t even drive by to see if it’s occupied or not.

So there it stands as of tonight …

Take care,
Bill

Matthew de Jongh · January 3rd, 2004, 07:21 PM

i think the treasury department is in charge of forgery of currency, that might qualify for banking things as well?

gotta be someone who will care...

matthew

Mike Rehmus · January 3rd, 2004, 07:51 PM

The last thing you ever want to do is give someone the wire transfer information on your bank account. Once they have that they can empty your account and the bank won't stop it if you inform them. The only way to stop it is to close the account.

Been there, been had by that.

BTW, Cashier's checks can be cancelled just like a personal check.

Jeff Donald · January 3rd, 2004, 08:10 PM

Postal Inspectors will investigate USPS MO counterfeiting, fraud etc. They may also request other Federal authorities to assist in the investigation, which they usually will do, since it's another Federal agency.

Frank Granovski · January 3rd, 2004, 09:15 PM

Just goes to show you that it's difficult to mix trust with business. I've always found that if the buyer (or seller) is in a hurry, it gives me a good reason to slow down and think it through. Sorry for your loss.

Christopher C. Murphy · January 3rd, 2004, 09:36 PM

Man that sucks, do you have any type of insurance? Check Ebay, if you see a camera like yours being sold...maybe email the person selling and see if they reply with something? How many people in LA right now will be selling a camera like yours? Maybe try and trick them and see if they say where its been or whatever. Or, maybe say you need the serial#, so you can check if its stolen. If they say no, or won't reply...you might have someone to look at?

I'm suggesting this because I have a few friend cops...they always check Ebay first after hearing of a theft.

Murph

Bill Peterson · January 3rd, 2004, 10:29 PM

I think you’re right Matthew; the treasury dept. has some involvement. I have filed a report with the FBI and the IFCC as well as the local LA Metro Police. The IFCC and FBI are supposed to direct traffic so to speak to who handles what. Trouble is by the time they get around to actually doing anything besides paper work the trail is long cold.

Right now I have all the info in my first post, plus a voice recording (very distinctive, deep, well spoken) of the guy, a strong suspicion that he’s hanging around the music video scene. The FedEx guy identified them as blacks.

Mike … you could be right … drat! I thought you needed a password, permissions and several checks to be able to do an outgoing wire. Oh well …

Jeff .. that sounds right … the question is when! That’s been the rub all along here. I was pretty sure we could set this guy up … cause he didn’t know we knew. But an entire week will have gone by before anyone will even talk about tracing his number or even riding by the house, or for that matter really even talking to us about it seriously.

Hi Frank … thanks … and yep you’re right, and worse still … I knew that then. Oops, I’m sure it was the Silent Night carol playing in the background that made me do it anyway.

Christopher … I’m hoping so. I’ve got tons of insurance but I don’t know if any of it covers being stupid. I couldn’t reach my insurance agent either. Seems like everyone but the crooks are taking the week off. Yeah … I did check Ebay, but I think they already had a sale for the camera. In fact I think they have a shopping list … just my feeling.

Thanks guys,
Bill

Sharon Fraats · January 4th, 2004, 01:27 AM

I do so hate to hear stories such as these as I have been ripped before myself. I would ask that if you want to read another persons problems and how people from around the country helped out this man in Chicago where I am from.

He even was mentioned on the main pages Macnn and Macaddict as to his plight and I could not believe how many people helped him. It does show that there are good people still around in this world.

Mr. Hurd please note that I notice that you remove links from time to time I would ask of you to allow this one as there is good news to hear from another.

http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.p...+stolen+laptop

January 3rd, 2004, 01:09 PM	#1
Bill Peterson New Boot Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida Posts: 17	Warning! ... How I lost my DVX100 (As posted on the Canopus forum, by me. ) Man do I hate to write this … I’d rather keep it to myself, you'll know why … but it could help some of the great folks here (deep breath) Well I just got nailed for a AG-DVX100 … I got soft, talked to a nice guy and worked out a deal … split the extra shipping charges (yeah he wanted it overnight) . He didn’t check out real great but, trying to be a nice guy and help out, I checked out the name he gave me against the address (In LA 1369 E 56th street) His name was Robert Johnson. The LA county tax assessor whom we called confirmed that Mr. Lonnie J. Johnson owned the property at the above address, and before that it belonged to Emma Johnson. Sounded like a family affair. Talked to Robert several more times to arrange things, he always answered the phone. Till he got the camera that is. Old Robert was supposedly trying to shoot a music video and really needed the camera. We called our bank and asked about the best way to do the FedEx COD. Cashiers Check or money order? They said Cashiers Check was good. (Note … never do this, they don’t know squat about how to verify or check these checks, as it turns out). Next move, sent the cam to the address, COD … FedEx handed it over to someone who didn’t even claim to be Robert Johnson … don’t ask me why yet, I’m still trying to find out how that worked. They delivered the no good cashiers check back here. By pushing my bank and calling five different Wells Fargo Banks (the check was a Wells Fargo check), we finally determined that it was a dud. You would not believe how hard it was to find out that it was no good. They wanted us to deposit it and see what happened. We wouldn’t have know for over a week. Meanwhile we call the LA Police department … the address is 8 miles from the Metro Frogery Section station house and only 1.6 miles from the community Police Station. Robert must have figured that it would be a week or so before we found out the check was rubber, cause they answered the phone, then hung up when they figured out who it was on the line. Anyway even with all the info, address, owner of property, (single family dwelling) phone numbers registered to someone, the FedEx drivers ID of who signed for it available. Yep you guessed it they wouldn’t drive over there. Fill out some forms and we’ll get back to you in a couple of days and assign someone was their response. (It's Sat the 3rd now, still no one assigned to the case, next week maybe ... they say) So that’s my sad tale … I asked for it twice, once in not insisting on dealing with folks on the forums that we all sort of know … and second in breaking my own rules and softening up cause someone was in need. Maybe it was the Christmas lights, maybe the eggnog. I’ve had great results over the last year buying gear from people off the forums, good stuff, and good people. And I got it good … my little Panasonic is in evil hands all by itself out in LA tonight. Here’s some emails from the bad guys involved: musicbiz41@yahoo.com, hardhits@hotmail.com BTW if you see a Panasonic AG-DVX100 with the serial # L2TD01033 It ain’t theirs email me! Thanks all, (hope this helps to make you safer) Happy New Year! Bpete

January 3rd, 2004, 02:15 PM	#2
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Man that's awful. Sorry to hear about this. Maybe the cops will come through. Also, I thought cashiers checks were solid? Doesn't that mean the bank has verified the funds and held they so it would clear once it was cashed? __________________ Need to rent camera gear in Vancouver BC? Check me out at camerarentalsvancouver.com

January 3rd, 2004, 04:48 PM	#5
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	This is pretty scary... I tend to insist on cashier's checks myself, and it's surprising to find that even these can be forged. The seller is usually in control of the transaction -- it's always a good idea to ship only after the check has been received, deposited and cleared. However, cons can work both ways and it's always a gamble. PayPal offers some protection but it's not fool-proof. Sorry to hear about this, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

January 3rd, 2004, 05:30 PM	#6
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	US Postal Service Money Orders are probably the safest. Postal Inspectors and other Federal authorities are more likely to take fraud and counterfeiting a little more seriously than most metro police departments. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

January 3rd, 2004, 07:51 PM	#10
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	The last thing you ever want to do is give someone the wire transfer information on your bank account. Once they have that they can empty your account and the bank won't stop it if you inform them. The only way to stop it is to close the account. Been there, been had by that. BTW, Cashier's checks can be cancelled just like a personal check. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

January 3rd, 2004, 02:27 PM	#3
Bill Peterson New Boot Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida Posts: 17	Hey Dylan, Well, that's exactly why I posted ... NO ... Cashier's Check means nothing to crooks. They forged the check, think of it like counterfeit money. It looks real good. My bank did not know that it was forged. Even Wells Fargo Bank (the check was supposed to be a Wells Fargo Bank check) took half the day to decide it wasn't real. This same guy also offered to pay me with US PO Money Order. So they are counterfeiting them as well I guess. I understand why you thought that. We called our bank here and asked which was the safest way before we made the arrangments ... they said Cashier's Check ... WRONG! Take care, Bill

January 3rd, 2004, 04:30 PM	#4
Matthew de Jongh Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: sounthern maine Posts: 344	that sucks! i don't suppose fedex has any liability? i can't think of any way you could have avoided it other than paypal or something? at least you know where fedex delivered it, so there has got to be some legal recourse, please keep us posted. matthew

January 3rd, 2004, 06:53 PM	#7
Matthew de Jongh Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: sounthern maine Posts: 344	i always wondered how closely the fedex guy looks at the check for c.o.d.'s

January 3rd, 2004, 07:16 PM	#8
Bill Peterson New Boot Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida Posts: 17	Hey Matthew … FedEx claims they have no liability for the forged check. We’re still miffed at the idea they would deliver it to another person than who was on the COD and accept a check from them. Chris hi, Yeah you are mostly right, but in this case we shouldn’t even know the check is bad yet. Our bank was willing to accept it, then it would go to Wells Fargo, they would ponder it for a bit then tell our bank it was no good and we would get notice … from a week to two weeks for this little trip. Your bank would cash it for you … if you had an account with them and sufficient funds to cover the check. These they freeze till the check clears (or doesn’t if it’s a dud) … then you get the big ouch! The hair got up on my neck ( a little late) and we faxed a copy to Wells Fargo, called three times etc., even at that they told us at first to deposit it and see, we insisted and they finally said it was forged. Jeff .. this guy offered to pay by Money order if I wanted, so he’s also running them off at will. Forging/counterfeiting Cashier’s checks also falls under same category as Money Order, according to what this costly lesson is teaching me so far. You can report it to the FBI and they can act … (if they want) via laws about cross state transactions, use of the internet, wire (telephone) etc.. Trouble is they usually pass it down to the local Metro types because it’s not that important (to them). Frankly the only good way I can see at this point is to have the buyer wire the money directly into your account. But how the heck is the buyer going to feel about that? No product from you and you want his money? As far as having the address, so far it hasn’t helped a wit. The law won’t even drive by to see if it’s occupied or not. So there it stands as of tonight … Take care, Bill

January 3rd, 2004, 07:21 PM	#9
Matthew de Jongh Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: sounthern maine Posts: 344	i think the treasury department is in charge of forgery of currency, that might qualify for banking things as well? gotta be someone who will care... matthew

January 3rd, 2004, 08:10 PM	#11
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	Postal Inspectors will investigate USPS MO counterfeiting, fraud etc. They may also request other Federal authorities to assist in the investigation, which they usually will do, since it's another Federal agency. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

January 3rd, 2004, 09:15 PM	#12
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	Just goes to show you that it's difficult to mix trust with business. I've always found that if the buyer (or seller) is in a hurry, it gives me a good reason to slow down and think it through. Sorry for your loss.

January 3rd, 2004, 09:36 PM	#13
Christopher C. Murphy Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 1,707	Man that sucks, do you have any type of insurance? Check Ebay, if you see a camera like yours being sold...maybe email the person selling and see if they reply with something? How many people in LA right now will be selling a camera like yours? Maybe try and trick them and see if they say where its been or whatever. Or, maybe say you need the serial#, so you can check if its stolen. If they say no, or won't reply...you might have someone to look at? I'm suggesting this because I have a few friend cops...they always check Ebay first after hearing of a theft. Murph __________________ Christopher C. Murphy Director, Producer, Writer

January 3rd, 2004, 10:29 PM	#14
Bill Peterson New Boot Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida Posts: 17	I think you’re right Matthew; the treasury dept. has some involvement. I have filed a report with the FBI and the IFCC as well as the local LA Metro Police. The IFCC and FBI are supposed to direct traffic so to speak to who handles what. Trouble is by the time they get around to actually doing anything besides paper work the trail is long cold. Right now I have all the info in my first post, plus a voice recording (very distinctive, deep, well spoken) of the guy, a strong suspicion that he’s hanging around the music video scene. The FedEx guy identified them as blacks. Mike … you could be right … drat! I thought you needed a password, permissions and several checks to be able to do an outgoing wire. Oh well … Jeff .. that sounds right … the question is when! That’s been the rub all along here. I was pretty sure we could set this guy up … cause he didn’t know we knew. But an entire week will have gone by before anyone will even talk about tracing his number or even riding by the house, or for that matter really even talking to us about it seriously. Hi Frank … thanks … and yep you’re right, and worse still … I knew that then. Oops, I’m sure it was the Silent Night carol playing in the background that made me do it anyway. Christopher … I’m hoping so. I’ve got tons of insurance but I don’t know if any of it covers being stupid. I couldn’t reach my insurance agent either. Seems like everyone but the crooks are taking the week off. Yeah … I did check Ebay, but I think they already had a sale for the camera. In fact I think they have a shopping list … just my feeling. Thanks guys, Bill

January 4th, 2004, 01:27 AM	#15
Sharon Fraats Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: chicago, ill Posts: 190	I do so hate to hear stories such as these as I have been ripped before myself. I would ask that if you want to read another persons problems and how people from around the country helped out this man in Chicago where I am from. He even was mentioned on the main pages Macnn and Macaddict as to his plight and I could not believe how many people helped him. It does show that there are good people still around in this world. Mr. Hurd please note that I notice that you remove links from time to time I would ask of you to allow this one as there is good news to hear from another. http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.p...+stolen+laptop