Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations at DVinfo.net

Andrew Smith · October 9th, 2017, 07:54 AM

I've never had an issue with this, but it would be very disappointing to have your stream going down due to a 'false positive' or copyrighted music being inadvertently picked up by a microphone and streamed.

See Facebook Rights Manager Works With Three Third-Party Providers - Streaming Media Magazine

Apparently they have been checking live streams for a while. From their "Rights Manager" page:

"As more people watch and share live video on Facebook, we’ve taken steps to ensure that Rights Manager protects live video streams as well. We check every Facebook Live video stream against files in the Rights Manager reference library, and if a match surfaces, we’ll interrupt that live video. Video publishers and media companies can also provide reference streams of live content so that we can check live video on Facebook against those reference streams in real time."

Andrew

Chris Harding · October 9th, 2017, 06:29 PM

That makes something like a wedding ceremony a total waste of time to even consider streaming as brides always use popular music as they walk down the aisle ..nowdays even the official bridal march which used to be public domain has been "bought" by a greedy publisher.

I could understand if they stopped your stream if you added live copyright music but they will happily ping you now even if some music is playing in the background, in fact even from somewhere not even associated with the event you are filming. There was a well known legal case in the USA where a family were filming on a pier and the "Simpsons" were playing in a store TV nearby and they were sued by Fox Network!

How on earth are you to be expected to protect your event audio from some guy walking past with a boom box on his shoulder??

Cary Knoop · October 9th, 2017, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harding

nowdays even the official bridal march which used to be public domain has been "bought" by a greedy publisher.

What do you mean?

The Bridal March is public domain, any performance thereof is not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harding

How on earth are you to be expected to protect your event audio from some guy walking past with a boom box on his shoulder??

You can't!

Copyright obviously has a function in society but I think it is time to loosen up some of the extreme situations and extend fair use.

But congress even voted for extending the copyright so that people still can't draw some kind of a mouse made eons ago.
Talk to your representative and tell them copyright and patent laws need to be updated to work in the 21st century!

Boyd Ostroff · October 9th, 2017, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harding

.nowdays even the official bridal march which used to be public domain has been "bought" by a greedy publisher?

Do you mean "here comes the bride"? That is the bridal chorus from Richard Wagner's 1850 opera "Lohengrin". I don't see how a "greedy publisher" could "buy" that. But they could publish their own arrangement.

There's also the wedding march from Felix Mendelsohn's "A Midsummer Night's Dream" from 1842. Again, I don't see how anyone could copyright that today unless it was their own version.

Chris Harding · October 9th, 2017, 07:19 PM

It's quite likely that publishers have done their own arrangements of public domain songs. However try and see if Facebook can tell the difference ... I haven't been pinged by Facebook but have been pinged by YouTube for a "version" of Wagner's original funnily enough by Getty Images! They also seem to claim to own all the Royalty Free Smartsound music libraries and it takes a long dispute process to resolve it.

This isn't an issue with a video but to have a stream stopped kills the LIVE advantage making it virtually useless .... it doesn't help us if Facebook cannot tell the difference between an original Wagner recording and a newer copy does it? Your live stream will cease to be live any longer!

Cary Knoop · October 9th, 2017, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harding

an original Wagner recording

That's not possible!

Compositions, arrangements and performances are copyrighted.
So a performance of a composition that is in the public domain is still copyrighted.

Donald McPherson · October 9th, 2017, 11:29 PM

This is becoming a joke for many. But then again how does Facebook, Youtube and others differentiate fair use unless they have someone personally watch each and every video that has music. Yes, they should be flagged and taken from there and no re-streaming of anything with music.

For some of us older guys and girls. Who remembers recording the top ten off the radio when cassette recorders first came out.

Noa Put · October 10th, 2017, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Who remembers recording the top ten off the radio when cassette recorders first came out.

Me! and then being angry because the radio host started talking before the song ended :)

Chris Harding · October 10th, 2017, 08:08 AM

I honestly agree with not allowing people to add copyright music to their streams (or videos) but they are honestly getting ridiculous killing a stream because some person is playing music in the background. Adding music to your feed should be a nono but how are you supposed to control ambient music being picked up by one of your mics!!

Tony McGuire · October 11th, 2017, 06:43 AM

I had a problem with you tube but not facebook. I steamed a local tallent show back in April and ran in to Facebook's time limit of 4 hours and had one flag for copy right music but it was a song that someone sang on the stage.

How ever Facebook did not flag any music that was backround music that was played in the intervils which left me scratching my head as You Tube did flag the backround music but the song that where preformed on stage

Chris Harding · October 11th, 2017, 07:13 AM

Hi Tony

So did either CDN stop the stream in it's tracks or did they just flag you? I don't mind You Tube or Facebook flagging a stream as long as they don't stop the live broadcast!!

Tony McGuire · October 18th, 2017, 02:11 AM

Hi Chris,

I was streaming straght to facebook live. Both streams where setup in the same software at the sametime and started together it was only facebook that had stopped and it seem it was on facebook side it was stopped. This was a live stream via my laptop using Vmix. I have also looked on the net after the event and have found others with the same problem after 4 hours straght stream live.

Sorry for not replying sooner, was flat out at work.

Chris Harding · October 18th, 2017, 06:17 AM

No problem Tony

So the Facebook stream didn't stop due to any music flagging but simply because your stream went over the 4 hour limit? Is that correct?

I got a bit confused about the streams though ...I'm assuming you had one to Facebook and one to YouTube??

I was just trying to ascertain if either stream was stopped because of a music breach!

Tony McGuire · October 18th, 2017, 07:21 AM

Hi Chris,

Well Vmix can do 3 sepert streams at the same time which can be handy, If you are going to be streaming to facebook for more that 4 hours. It would be very strange if it was copyright music they stopped it on as it was 4 hours and 10 seconds when it was stopped. The show that I streamed was a local talent show and it happened well into the 3 part of it. I have just googled this is what I got

https://www.facebook.com/help/mentions/460532527447800

Is there a time limit for a Live video?

Yes. The time limit for a Live video post is 4 hours.

Chris Harding · October 19th, 2017, 04:51 AM

So what happens if you do a series of posts (in your case let's say 60 minutes each) does that still count as 4 hours ? When i do weddings on Livestream I will often end up with around 6 streams as the ceremony might start at 2:00pm and the reception end at 10:00pm (8 hours in all) BUT my files might only total 1 or 2 hours at the most.

I think I need to do a Facebook and YouTube post from home and leave the radio on in the background and see if they ping me for the ambient music too??

October 9th, 2017, 07:54 AM	#1
Andrew Smith Equal Opportunity Offender Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 3,065	Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations I've never had an issue with this, but it would be very disappointing to have your stream going down due to a 'false positive' or copyrighted music being inadvertently picked up by a microphone and streamed. See Facebook Rights Manager Works With Three Third-Party Providers - Streaming Media Magazine Apparently they have been checking live streams for a while. From their "Rights Manager" page: "As more people watch and share live video on Facebook, we’ve taken steps to ensure that Rights Manager protects live video streams as well. We check every Facebook Live video stream against files in the Rights Manager reference library, and if a match surfaces, we’ll interrupt that live video. Video publishers and media companies can also provide reference streams of live content so that we can check live video on Facebook against those reference streams in real time." Andrew

October 9th, 2017, 06:29 PM	#2
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations That makes something like a wedding ceremony a total waste of time to even consider streaming as brides always use popular music as they walk down the aisle ..nowdays even the official bridal march which used to be public domain has been "bought" by a greedy publisher. I could understand if they stopped your stream if you added live copyright music but they will happily ping you now even if some music is playing in the background, in fact even from somewhere not even associated with the event you are filming. There was a well known legal case in the USA where a family were filming on a pier and the "Simpsons" were playing in a store TV nearby and they were sued by Fox Network! How on earth are you to be expected to protect your event audio from some guy walking past with a boom box on his shoulder??

October 9th, 2017, 07:19 PM	#5
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations It's quite likely that publishers have done their own arrangements of public domain songs. However try and see if Facebook can tell the difference ... I haven't been pinged by Facebook but have been pinged by YouTube for a "version" of Wagner's original funnily enough by Getty Images! They also seem to claim to own all the Royalty Free Smartsound music libraries and it takes a long dispute process to resolve it. This isn't an issue with a video but to have a stream stopped kills the LIVE advantage making it virtually useless .... it doesn't help us if Facebook cannot tell the difference between an original Wagner recording and a newer copy does it? Your live stream will cease to be live any longer!

October 9th, 2017, 11:29 PM	#7
Donald McPherson Major Player Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Aberdeen Scotland Posts: 815	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations This is becoming a joke for many. But then again how does Facebook, Youtube and others differentiate fair use unless they have someone personally watch each and every video that has music. Yes, they should be flagged and taken from there and no re-streaming of anything with music. For some of us older guys and girls. Who remembers recording the top ten off the radio when cassette recorders first came out. __________________ A little knowledge goes a long way but not long enough.

October 10th, 2017, 08:08 AM	#9
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations I honestly agree with not allowing people to add copyright music to their streams (or videos) but they are honestly getting ridiculous killing a stream because some person is playing music in the background. Adding music to your feed should be a nono but how are you supposed to control ambient music being picked up by one of your mics!!

October 11th, 2017, 06:43 AM	#10
Tony McGuire Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Donegal Ireland Posts: 119	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations I had a problem with you tube but not facebook. I steamed a local tallent show back in April and ran in to Facebook's time limit of 4 hours and had one flag for copy right music but it was a song that someone sang on the stage. How ever Facebook did not flag any music that was backround music that was played in the intervils which left me scratching my head as You Tube did flag the backround music but the song that where preformed on stage

October 11th, 2017, 07:13 AM	#11
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations Hi Tony So did either CDN stop the stream in it's tracks or did they just flag you? I don't mind You Tube or Facebook flagging a stream as long as they don't stop the live broadcast!!

October 18th, 2017, 02:11 AM	#12
Tony McGuire Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Donegal Ireland Posts: 119	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations Hi Chris, I was streaming straght to facebook live. Both streams where setup in the same software at the sametime and started together it was only facebook that had stopped and it seem it was on facebook side it was stopped. This was a live stream via my laptop using Vmix. I have also looked on the net after the event and have found others with the same problem after 4 hours straght stream live. Sorry for not replying sooner, was flat out at work.

October 18th, 2017, 06:17 AM	#13
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations No problem Tony So the Facebook stream didn't stop due to any music flagging but simply because your stream went over the 4 hour limit? Is that correct? I got a bit confused about the streams though ...I'm assuming you had one to Facebook and one to YouTube?? I was just trying to ascertain if either stream was stopped because of a music breach!

October 18th, 2017, 07:21 AM	#14
Tony McGuire Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Donegal Ireland Posts: 119	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations Hi Chris, Well Vmix can do 3 sepert streams at the same time which can be handy, If you are going to be streaming to facebook for more that 4 hours. It would be very strange if it was copyright music they stopped it on as it was 4 hours and 10 seconds when it was stopped. The show that I streamed was a local talent show and it happened well into the 3 part of it. I have just googled this is what I got https://www.facebook.com/help/mentions/460532527447800 Is there a time limit for a Live video? Yes. The time limit for a Live video post is 4 hours.

October 19th, 2017, 04:51 AM	#15
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: Facebook to be checking live streams for copyright violations So what happens if you do a series of posts (in your case let's say 60 minutes each) does that still count as 4 hours ? When i do weddings on Livestream I will often end up with around 6 streams as the ceremony might start at 2:00pm and the reception end at 10:00pm (8 hours in all) BUT my files might only total 1 or 2 hours at the most. I think I need to do a Facebook and YouTube post from home and leave the radio on in the background and see if they ping me for the ambient music too??