New Sony PXW-FS5

[Glen Vandermolen]

Originally Posted by Jeroen Wolf

This camera has so much going for it. I was eyeballing the FS7 but after holding this thing at IBC I was pretty much sold. I could hold this for hours. Reminded me vaguely of the trusty&ancient PD-150 (shooting through the viewfinder) - but with much better ergonomics. The ND-filter implementation is brilliant.
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Thank you for a hands-on impression.
I used a PD-150 and I wasn't really in love with the form. It wasn't fun to handhold for a long period of time. I hope the FS5 is considerably better in this regard.

[Andy Wilkinson]

Here's Alister Chapman's hands on review of the Sony PXW-FS5:

The Sony PXW-FS5. Run and Gun Super35 for all. | XDCAM-USER.COM

[David Heath]

Originally Posted by Jack Zhang

The clients I get literally are via networking and they constantly low ball me. If I communicated that I wanted ridiculous rates for stuff, I get no work. Even offering my services for half the rental rate of my current camera, the EX1R, I got NO GIGS.

I remember doing a business course, and a scenario came up of "how to handle clients who press for lower rates". The advice given was to try to accommodate - but in general terms along the lines of "well, I might be able to do it for that price, but we will have to simplify the work".

The alternatives (I believe) were "no, it's this price" or simply going along with them, and the latter was generally seen as a slippery slope.

So, I tend to agree with the others - the problem lies not with this camera, but with your clients expectations. Somehow you have to tell them that if they want 60p, 4K, a decent quality camera, and a low rate, they'll have to choose which three of those four.

Anyway - back to the camera itself...... I'm hoping to see it in a week or two, but thanks for posting Alister's impressions in the meantime, Andy.

If I've one question, it's about the Clear Image zoom. Alister says "The camera even has Sony’s clear image zoom function that electronically increases the zoom range with virtually no image degradation." - but presumably that's only true in HD, not 4K? Start zooming by cropping, and if the whole sensor is 3840x2160, you'll still have more than enough photosites to give HD after the crop, but not 4K?

[Mike Watson]

I believe Jack is a few years out of school. When you're young it's a) hard to book big clients, b) hard to raise the rate, c) you're not a very good negotiator yet. All things that change with time, in my experience.

[Andy Wilkinson]

David, there is some good information about the Clear Image Zoom function (and lot of other interesting technical info!) in the 20-minute Sony video that was embedded in Post #41 (on Page 3 of in this thread). It's the one where the Sony Design Engineer talks us through the various features/aspects of the camera with it in his hands.

[Jim Stamos]

thanks for that clarification on the focussing of the lens, so its just like the x70.
ill pass, im better off buying the 70 for 4,000 less.
youd think theyd have a true focus on the fs5 for that price

[Mike Watson]

It's a kit lens. You can use any lens you want that may have geared focus. The 18-105 is an all-around lens, and has some compromises. But for a walkaround lens that's F4 throughout and $550... it ain't bad.

[Jack Zhang]

Originally Posted by Mike Watson

I believe Jack is a few years out of school. When you're young it's a) hard to book big clients, b) hard to raise the rate, c) you're not a very good negotiator yet. All things that change with time, in my experience.

Plus I have Asperger's Syndrome, yet another factor in why I've been a terrible communicator other than trying to make clients via friendships.

[Christopher Young]

Originally Posted by Andy Wilkinson

(and lot of other interesting technical info!)

As Andy mentions a lot of other interesting detail. A very important piece of information that slips through pretty quickly if you are not careful lies between 6:12 and 6:34 in that embedded video in post #41. That is the fact that Sony with its own proprietary XAVC-L codec are the only manufacturer using DUAL-PASS H.264 encoding in their cameras. This goes a long way to explaining how Sony is getting the quality they are out of the 50-mbit HD encoding on their cameras that run this codec. I've been surprised how the X70 handles rapid and complex scene movement with its XAVC-L 50-mbit codec. It handles it extremely well indeed.

Anyone who understands the efficiency and benefits of dual-pass encoding when encoding H.264 / x264 will have witnessed the improvement with dual-pass encoding especially if the video contains high motion content. Hard to encode scenes that contain material such as spray from water fountains or rapidly falling rain on flowing water surfaces being particular hard to encode efficiently. So it's not all in the bit rate is it.

Interesting camera. In many ways it is an X70 codec wise, barring the X70's QFHD upgrade but with the S35 sensor from its bigger brothers. 4K for me is not a big demand in the foreseeable future for me so I pretty tempted to give this a go. A cross between and X70 and an FS7 could work.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

[Andy Wilkinson]

For those in the UK...I just saw a CVP Facebook post the says they will have a FS5 available tomorrow morning (Wed 23rd Sep) at their Brentwood store.

I am unable to go due to my schedule :-(....but book in if you can and tell us all what you think afterwards!

I also had a delivery notification from CVP that my Metabones adapter (Mark IV, Canon EF to Sony) will arrive today. When I ordered it, delivery was estimated at around 6 weeks so I wanted to make sure I had one in my hands...was n't expecting it so soon...now all I need is an FS5 to attach it too!

[Mike Watson]

I've got an FS5 on pre-order right now.

Next week I have a shoot for which I need an extra camera. Lockdown wide shot. I currently have an FS-100 and a 5DMkII. Whatever I buy, I'd like it to play nice with the FS5. Something in the $1000 price range. Any suggestions?

[Jeroen Wolf]

A used GH4 (with V-log)?

[Tom Gresham]

Originally Posted by Mike Watson

I've got an FS5 on pre-order right now.

Next week I have a shoot for which I need an extra camera. Lockdown wide shot. I currently have an FS-100 and a 5DMkII. Whatever I buy, I'd like it to play nice with the FS5. Something in the $1000 price range. Any suggestions?

Rent an A7s or something similar?

[Dylan Couper]

Originally Posted by Jack Zhang

The clients I get literally are via networking and they constantly low ball me. If I communicated that I wanted ridiculous rates for stuff, I get no work. Even offering my services for half the rental rate of my current camera, the EX1R, I got NO GIGS.

I'm also a terrible communicator at cold calling and etc. So all my client relationships are friendship based, not professional. It's my condition that hinders me too.

That's a marketing and sales problem 100%. Even getting "the right" camera isn't going to keep you from getting low balled - and we're not talking about ridiculous rates, we're talking about getting paid a FAIR price for the work you do.

Solve your client/sales/marketing problem or do something else for work, because if you can't do sales, you aren't going to be in the game for the long haul.

If you want some suggestions, I'll start a new thread.

[Josh Bass]

Jack, my friend, I can' t offer much help 'cause I am ALSO a terrible salesman, but if you're actually doing work or offering it with an EX1 for half a camera rental rate -- which, should be between $200-350/day, making YOUR offer $100-175/day, that is pretty messed up (unless it was a last minute call, i.e., you would have made NO money that day otherwise -- that was just for a few hours, and preferably in the evening), and even more messed up if people won't hire you at those rates, since that is an insanely generous deal.

If you're still struggling that much I definitely wouldn't get ANOTHER piece of gear, putting you even further in the hole that will take forever to pay off (remember, if you make, say $500 a day with your cam, your cam isn't really making $500/day, your labor is part of that, and any other gear you're bringing along-- Your cam might be $200 of that, or $250 or something. So that day, your camera made $250 that's how you should think of it.. That cam hasn't REALLY made its money back until you've made back the cost IN CAMERA RENTAL FEES ALONE. I believe someone said that a cam should pay for itself the way I describe in a year to a year and a half, tops. If you spend $5500+ on a camera, will you make that back in that amount of time, IN CAMERA RENTAL FEES ALONE?

Again, I am also terrible at the sales side of this-- people just sort of find me when they find me -- but you should figure out how to be more viable with the gear you have (EX1 still a very nice cam, should be able to get decent work with it even now), and if people are DEMANDING 4k60p or anything else, you simply have to say "I can do that, but it will cost you $xxx. For what your budget is, I can only do [whatever]." That's all there is to it. Otherwise you're getting screwed hard and eventually it won't sustain and the whole thing will implode in on itself. We all make compromises on our rates occasionally to stay working (despite what many will insist on), but those compromises should only be UP TO A POINT. Sometimes you just have to say "no, sorry, can't do it. Good luck."