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March 6th, 2012, 08:45 AM | #1 |
Space Hipster
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Is the F3 for me?
I currently own an FS100, and while I am happy with the camera, I can't help but wonder if I should upgrade to an F3.
I mostly do local commercials and corporate videos. I am in the network pool of crews for bigger clients - i.e. networks, cable channels, large advertising firms, etc. I am wondering if owning an F3 would possibly open more doors for me with the bigger clientele. Is the F3 in demand? Is it a hot rental item? I would be open to renting the camera, as it would be a business expense. If it can make additional income, then I would use it as such. I'm confident of my shooting abilities. I'm just wondering if I buy an F3, will the clients come? I'm also wanting the better images you can get from an F3. The FS100 won't have the dynamic range of the F3, and after shooting a short film, I could see the advantages of a camera that could handle highlights better. It's interesting that Doug Jensen had a little quiz in this forum that picked what camera best suited your needs, the FS100 or the F3. According to the quiz, I should pick the F3. I would appreciate your thoughts. Thanks. |
March 6th, 2012, 09:25 AM | #2 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
The camera rents for $500-$750 with the 3 PL lenses. Are your clients willing to pay for the camera rental plus your personal fees?
If the answer is yes, buy it. If you really just like the toy, buy it.
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March 6th, 2012, 09:38 AM | #3 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Mine stays quite busy. Sometimes with me and sometimes on its own. I know many of the renters would not have gone for the FS100. Nothing at all against the FS100. I like them both. The F3 is considered the more professional camera.
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March 6th, 2012, 10:26 AM | #4 | |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Quote:
If the quiz says the F3 is the right choice, then you better make the switch. The quiz is never wrong! :-)
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March 6th, 2012, 12:04 PM | #5 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
S-log makes a huge difference to the look of the footage produced by the F3. Much more control and greater dynamic range as you noted. It's almost like two different cameras.
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March 6th, 2012, 12:16 PM | #6 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Charles,
S-Log is lost if your final output is TV which must confront with the much more limited HD standard. Glenn, For your kind of work, I think the biggest difference is the lack of ND filters of the FS100. F3 has also slightly better image, but personally I wouldn't have upgraded just for that. The inclusion of the 444 mode makes it a better deal, but maybe foreshadows an upgrade of FS100 at NAB. Since its around the corner, I would wait for the time being. |
March 6th, 2012, 12:58 PM | #7 | |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Quote:
Highlight handling is very different in s-log. It's much more film-like. I have heard the look of the F3 without s-log as "electronic", "classic Sony video look" and "broadcasty". I tend to agree with this. If that's the look one wants, that's fine.
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March 6th, 2012, 05:45 PM | #8 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
[QUOTE=Emmanuel Plakiotis;1719357]Charles,
S-Log is lost if your final output is TV which must confront with the much more limited HD standard. I would say s-log is great for me in TV because my footage must match other cameras from the 1st unit and s-log literally "makes the grade" to blend the looks. |
March 6th, 2012, 06:08 PM | #9 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
I would say that for anyone who is shooting footage that will be color corrected, espcially in contrasty environments that can't always be controlled, S-log is well worth it. If the post pipeline requires fast turnaround and a "Rec 709"/broadcast look, s-log wouldn't be that critical (and thus, if one can deal with the physical differences between the FS100 and the F3 and financials are a concern, the latter will probably be a more logical choice).
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March 7th, 2012, 09:56 AM | #10 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
"I totally disagree. It's about capturing a range of values that you can then manipulate in post as required. The more range you have to work with, the more you can fit into the delivery master.
Highlight handling is very different in s-log. It's much more film-like." Undoubtedly is more filmlike,but it won't be seen... Everything which is out of the dynamic range and colour gamut of the 709 spec., is lost during broadcasting. What you see in the monitor is not what the viewer receives in his TV. Actually if the image is not filmed and corrected between the boundaries of the broadcasting transmition, it may actually look worse, to the end viewer, because valuable visual information may not get through. Even in the old days of telecine, the DoP were exposing film very differently, when it was heading for TV, in order to account for the limits of video transmission. To expose video like film when is heading for TV in my opinion is a wrong approach. I remember in the old of monaural sound a very well respected editor, after finishing his mix, was always performing a last check from the lousy speaker of his monitor. When I asked why he does that. He replied: "that's the way, people at home are hearing it." |
March 7th, 2012, 10:09 AM | #11 | |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Quote:
The point is that the F3 when used in S-Log mode gives you an image that can be more easily matched to other cameras and gives you very nice roll-off into the highlights. When that image is graded to the broadcast colorspace of your choice it will look better and less video like than using one of the stock picture profiles in the camera.
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March 7th, 2012, 10:23 AM | #12 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Glenn,
will you se the difference between the two , depending on delivery format maybe will F3 open more doors for you with the bigger clientele, most likely; if you love what you do and you can afford it - buy it, it is better camera, you'll love it, i was debating between F3 and Scarlet and went with RED, but that's me; just wait until after NAB.
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March 7th, 2012, 11:50 AM | #13 | ||||
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
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But let's get back on point. I'm saying that s-log will absolutely allow one to capture a greater dynamic range than Sony picture profiles, and given proper grading of the footage, that will be apparent whether viewed on the web, home TV or transferred to film. I've recently sat through hours in the Davinci suite pushing and pulling the s-log footage from my series and I know this to be true (we had a few 60p shots pre-current firmware that was non s-log, and it was far more difficult to manipulate). There's plenty of clips from the show on Youtube that I can use as reference. Emmanuel, if you have some footage you've shot that you would like to share that you feel proves your point, I would be happy to take a look at it.
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March 7th, 2012, 12:09 PM | #14 | |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Disagree...both on a technical engineering level and personal experience.
Quote:
I'm really confused where you're coming from on this, Emmanuel. Please forgive my "bandwagon" debate technique, but there's also PLENTY of S-Log originated material out there in the broadcast world, F35 shooters have been using it for a couple years now, and before that, Thompson Viper users were doing something very similar even though it wasn't called "S-Log". There's NUMEROUS ways to legalize S-Log encoded material without clipping luma or chroma or losing the "look", and in the broadcast world the methods and gear are common.
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My Work: nateweaver.net Last edited by Nate Weaver; March 7th, 2012 at 12:45 PM. |
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March 7th, 2012, 01:36 PM | #15 |
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Re: Is the F3 for me?
Emmanuel,
You want to deliver a medium rare steak as an end product but you over cooked it to well done. (over exposed) With S Log & color grading you have much more dynamic range to resurrect your cooking mishap and can probably pull the steak back to medium rare. Shoot it in 709 and your dynamic range is much less and you'll probably stuck with delivering a well done steak. Is S Log worth it to you? Maybe not if you never color correct, or shoot only interiors having perfect control of your lighting contrast by not clipping highlights and filling the required amount of shadow details in your preferred 709 look. Us mortals don't mind the help when we go overboard on either side of exposure. S Log has nothing to do with delivery limitations but allows more range & freedom to grade your material to your preference BEFORE delivery. |
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