State of the card at DVinfo.net

Bill Heslip · June 5th, 2012, 08:01 PM

Just shipped off my EX1 to Teaneck for a firmware upgrade ($270 yikes!). This is part one of a workflow upgrade in order to achieve faster downloads from card to computer.

It's part two that has me wondering.

I'll start with card readers. My current thinking has me leaning toward a USB card 3 reader. Looked everywhere for one that will accept an Expresscard (found plenty that go the other way) but no luck, so it appears my options are limited to SDHC/SDXC card readers. This will require that I remove the SD card from the adapter for placement into the reader. No big deal?

Now on to adapters. I currently own 4 MxR (version 1) adapters, one of which is giving me problems being read by the camera. This has me seriously considering MxM. Any words of wisdom on these or any other adapters that are available?

As for SDHC/SDXC cards, it gets a bit more confusing. Are SanDisc Ultra's and Extreme's good enough or should I pony up for the Extreme Pro's? Then there's the Patriot EP Series that requires "host device must support SDXC for 64GB and 128GB". Does the EX1 with the latest firmware qualify?

I'd very much appreciate any real world experience that you would care to share.

Edit: One more thing. Is it safe to replace XDCAM EX ClipBrowser (v 2.6) with XDCAM Browser?

Bill

Luc De Wandel · June 6th, 2012, 02:17 AM

Hi Bill, if you're using your camera for professional jobs, I'd advise to convert to the real thing: SxS cards. They have become considerably less expensive and they're also available second hand for reasonable prices. I'm just an amateur in video, so I also started out with SDHC and adapters, but I did find the combination too flimsy and unreliable for my standards.

That said, even cheap Transcend (133x) SDHC's worked perfectly from a datarate point of view.I must add that the largest SDHC cards I used were 16 Gb. And as a pro stills photographer I've used Transcend a lot and their cards have never let me down.

But again, I abandoned the adapter/SDHC workflow after a few weeks and decided to go with SxS.

XDCAM browser does the same as Clip Browser plus a lot more. So yes, it is perfectly safe to make the switch.

Jack Zhang · June 6th, 2012, 04:02 AM

I'll say if you find a good combination, stick with it. I use the Sony branded SDHC adapter with a Kingston Class 10 G2 32GB card and never had reliability or durability issues. For $120, the Sony one is solidly built compared to the Hoodman or the early MxRs. I believe the MxR Extreme might be one to pick up to try if you miss overcranking or want to use SDXC. Yes, the absolute latest EX1 firmware should support SDXC with the MxR Extreme adapter. I wouldn't try an SDXC on a old MxR though. YMMV.

And the reason you have to ship off your EX1 to perform the update is because they actually swap out old Expresscard interface boards and connectors with new ones that support better USB transfers.

Bill Heslip · June 11th, 2012, 12:24 PM

Thanks for everyone's contributions. While I was initially leery of the expresscard adapter route, my 4 years of experience with them has been nothing but positive. Of course, that could change tomorrow.

Revealing that my questions to MxM from almost a week ago remain unanswered. Perhaps they are on holiday?

Marcus Durham · June 11th, 2012, 02:03 PM

MxM are usually very speedy with responses. Got a feeling there might be a national holiday in OZ today though.

I've been using the MxM and ATP (and a couple of Sandisk Extremes) combination for nearly 3 years now with no problems. No SD cards have broken, no data lost and no adaptors have broken despite having dropped a couple by accident (including from height onto concrete, and yes I did retire that adaptor just in case).

The only bad experiences I had would have also happened with SxS. I had load of corrupted footage about a year ago. Couldn't understand what was happened. Almost blamed the adaptors/SD but it turned out to be the hard drive I was using. Data was fine on the card but was getting corrupted when written.

Conclusion? Hundreds of hours captured, and the only problem experienced was unrelated to the adaptor or media choices I had made. It also shows it can be very easy to blame the SDHC media when in fact the problem lay elsewhere.

Jamie Roberts · June 12th, 2012, 02:54 AM

I've used MxM adapters with ATP Pro-max SDHC cards for several years without any issues whatsoever. Ive been using some of the those same SDHC cards for all that time and they've done a heap of work. Actually its probably time to get some new ones (just in cased Ive now jinxed it!).

Cheers

Jamie

Bill Heslip · June 12th, 2012, 11:36 AM

An update to my last post to inform everyone that MxM did make a timely response to my inquiries but I somehow managed to delete it to the trash without reading. My error.

I am looking forward to their USB3 reader coming to market. Transfer speed is a big issue for me.

Bill

Dave Sperling · June 17th, 2012, 07:00 PM

plenty of different elements go into transfer speed, but from my experience, the fastest trasfers are from SxS cards going to a Nexto drive (typically about 5-6 GB/minute), or using a computer with an expresscard slot, copying either to an internal 7200rpm drive, or to an external 7200rpm drive via usb3 or eSata.

John Peterson · June 17th, 2012, 08:44 PM

I have been using a home made hard drive recorder in my EX1 for most jobs where I have electricity.

The rest of the time I use Patriot Memory Class 10 cards almost exclusively.

Newegg.com - Patriot LX 32GB Secure Digital High-Capacity (SDHC) Flash Card Model PSF32GSDHC10

They often come with $10 rebates and Patriot memory ALWAYS pays their rebates.

I use them in Sonnet SD-SXS-E34 adapters or the older Kensington adapters.

PROVANTAGE: SD-SXS-E34 SDHC Memory Card Adapter for SXS Camera Slot & EXPRESS34 Slot By Sonnet Technologies (Overview)

The Patriot cards have never failed me. Some people like to convince themselves that they have been better off with the SxS cards rather than admit that they have been price gouged by Sony. I have gotten the 32GB Patriot cards for as little as $10 after rebate. That's $10 compared to $1500 some paid for similar Sony SxS cards. YIKES!

John

Dave Sperling · June 17th, 2012, 10:27 PM

John,
Not questioning what may work for you. I was merely giving my experience in terms of which transfer times I've found to be fastest. (I typically shoot for producers who would like to be able to walk away with two full copies of the day's footage literally minutes after calling wrap, often when shooting up to 5 hours of footage with each of two or three cameras. For larger shoots I'll bring multiple laptops as well as the Nexto) I have yet to find a transfer solution with non-SxS cards that approaches the speeds I get with the 32GB and 64GB SxS-1 cards. Of course if your producers don't mind paying for the extra overtime at the end of the day waiting for transfers, sd cards could make you a bit of extra money there...
Yes, SxS cards cost more, I think the 64GB cards are currently just under $700.- but at least within my transfer systems the throughput I achieve is well worth the difference.

June 5th, 2012, 08:01 PM	#1
Bill Heslip Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Southeast USA Posts: 129	State of the card Just shipped off my EX1 to Teaneck for a firmware upgrade ($270 yikes!). This is part one of a workflow upgrade in order to achieve faster downloads from card to computer. It's part two that has me wondering. I'll start with card readers. My current thinking has me leaning toward a USB card 3 reader. Looked everywhere for one that will accept an Expresscard (found plenty that go the other way) but no luck, so it appears my options are limited to SDHC/SDXC card readers. This will require that I remove the SD card from the adapter for placement into the reader. No big deal? Now on to adapters. I currently own 4 MxR (version 1) adapters, one of which is giving me problems being read by the camera. This has me seriously considering MxM. Any words of wisdom on these or any other adapters that are available? As for SDHC/SDXC cards, it gets a bit more confusing. Are SanDisc Ultra's and Extreme's good enough or should I pony up for the Extreme Pro's? Then there's the Patriot EP Series that requires "host device must support SDXC for 64GB and 128GB". Does the EX1 with the latest firmware qualify? I'd very much appreciate any real world experience that you would care to share. Edit: One more thing. Is it safe to replace XDCAM EX ClipBrowser (v 2.6) with XDCAM Browser? Bill

June 6th, 2012, 02:17 AM	#2
Luc De Wandel Major Player Join Date: May 2008 Location: Knokke-Heist, Belgium Posts: 963	Re: State of the card Hi Bill, if you're using your camera for professional jobs, I'd advise to convert to the real thing: SxS cards. They have become considerably less expensive and they're also available second hand for reasonable prices. I'm just an amateur in video, so I also started out with SDHC and adapters, but I did find the combination too flimsy and unreliable for my standards. That said, even cheap Transcend (133x) SDHC's worked perfectly from a datarate point of view.I must add that the largest SDHC cards I used were 16 Gb. And as a pro stills photographer I've used Transcend a lot and their cards have never let me down. But again, I abandoned the adapter/SDHC workflow after a few weeks and decided to go with SxS. XDCAM browser does the same as Clip Browser plus a lot more. So yes, it is perfectly safe to make the switch.

June 6th, 2012, 04:02 AM	#3
Jack Zhang Inner Circle Join Date: May 2005 Location: Burnaby, BC, Canada Posts: 3,053	Re: State of the card I'll say if you find a good combination, stick with it. I use the Sony branded SDHC adapter with a Kingston Class 10 G2 32GB card and never had reliability or durability issues. For $120, the Sony one is solidly built compared to the Hoodman or the early MxRs. I believe the MxR Extreme might be one to pick up to try if you miss overcranking or want to use SDXC. Yes, the absolute latest EX1 firmware should support SDXC with the MxR Extreme adapter. I wouldn't try an SDXC on a old MxR though. YMMV. And the reason you have to ship off your EX1 to perform the update is because they actually swap out old Expresscard interface boards and connectors with new ones that support better USB transfers.

June 11th, 2012, 12:24 PM	#4
Bill Heslip Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Southeast USA Posts: 129	Re: State of the card Thanks for everyone's contributions. While I was initially leery of the expresscard adapter route, my 4 years of experience with them has been nothing but positive. Of course, that could change tomorrow. Revealing that my questions to MxM from almost a week ago remain unanswered. Perhaps they are on holiday?

June 11th, 2012, 02:03 PM	#5
Marcus Durham Major Player Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 693	Re: State of the card MxM are usually very speedy with responses. Got a feeling there might be a national holiday in OZ today though. I've been using the MxM and ATP (and a couple of Sandisk Extremes) combination for nearly 3 years now with no problems. No SD cards have broken, no data lost and no adaptors have broken despite having dropped a couple by accident (including from height onto concrete, and yes I did retire that adaptor just in case). The only bad experiences I had would have also happened with SxS. I had load of corrupted footage about a year ago. Couldn't understand what was happened. Almost blamed the adaptors/SD but it turned out to be the hard drive I was using. Data was fine on the card but was getting corrupted when written. Conclusion? Hundreds of hours captured, and the only problem experienced was unrelated to the adaptor or media choices I had made. It also shows it can be very easy to blame the SDHC media when in fact the problem lay elsewhere. __________________ Marcus Durham Media2u, Corporate Video Production For Your Business - http://www.media2u.co.uk

June 12th, 2012, 02:54 AM	#6
Jamie Roberts Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: bendigo, australia Posts: 204	Re: State of the card I've used MxM adapters with ATP Pro-max SDHC cards for several years without any issues whatsoever. Ive been using some of the those same SDHC cards for all that time and they've done a heap of work. Actually its probably time to get some new ones (just in cased Ive now jinxed it!). Cheers Jamie

June 12th, 2012, 11:36 AM	#7
Bill Heslip Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Southeast USA Posts: 129	Re: State of the card An update to my last post to inform everyone that MxM did make a timely response to my inquiries but I somehow managed to delete it to the trash without reading. My error. I am looking forward to their USB3 reader coming to market. Transfer speed is a big issue for me. Bill

June 17th, 2012, 07:00 PM	#8
Dave Sperling Major Player Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Tinton Falls, NJ Posts: 780	Re: State of the card plenty of different elements go into transfer speed, but from my experience, the fastest trasfers are from SxS cards going to a Nexto drive (typically about 5-6 GB/minute), or using a computer with an expresscard slot, copying either to an internal 7200rpm drive, or to an external 7200rpm drive via usb3 or eSata.

June 17th, 2012, 08:44 PM	#9
John Peterson Major Player Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Monroe, NY Posts: 703	Re: State of the card I have been using a home made hard drive recorder in my EX1 for most jobs where I have electricity. The rest of the time I use Patriot Memory Class 10 cards almost exclusively. Newegg.com - Patriot LX 32GB Secure Digital High-Capacity (SDHC) Flash Card Model PSF32GSDHC10 They often come with $10 rebates and Patriot memory ALWAYS pays their rebates. I use them in Sonnet SD-SXS-E34 adapters or the older Kensington adapters. PROVANTAGE: SD-SXS-E34 SDHC Memory Card Adapter for SXS Camera Slot & EXPRESS34 Slot By Sonnet Technologies (Overview) The Patriot cards have never failed me. Some people like to convince themselves that they have been better off with the SxS cards rather than admit that they have been price gouged by Sony. I have gotten the 32GB Patriot cards for as little as $10 after rebate. That's $10 compared to $1500 some paid for similar Sony SxS cards. YIKES! John

June 17th, 2012, 10:27 PM	#10
Dave Sperling Major Player Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Tinton Falls, NJ Posts: 780	Re: State of the card John, Not questioning what may work for you. I was merely giving my experience in terms of which transfer times I've found to be fastest. (I typically shoot for producers who would like to be able to walk away with two full copies of the day's footage literally minutes after calling wrap, often when shooting up to 5 hours of footage with each of two or three cameras. For larger shoots I'll bring multiple laptops as well as the Nexto) I have yet to find a transfer solution with non-SxS cards that approaches the speeds I get with the 32GB and 64GB SxS-1 cards. Of course if your producers don't mind paying for the extra overtime at the end of the day waiting for transfers, sd cards could make you a bit of extra money there... Yes, SxS cards cost more, I think the 64GB cards are currently just under $700.- but at least within my transfer systems the throughput I achieve is well worth the difference.