Long Video Project, need advice. at DVinfo.net

Denny Kyser · August 7th, 2010, 10:27 PM

I usually only shoot weddings, but have a Fair Queen Contest I am doing early next week and believe it usually runs a little less than 3 hours. Not sure if that will fit on a single DVD, never tried to put that much footage on one so not sure, hate to wait till then to have a plan.

I am pretty new to video, and have never shot anything but HD, and edit in Premier Pro CS4, render to MPEG2-DVD and burn to DVD with Encore.

By no means is giving the clients a HD DVD a must, just have never recorded any other way so unless I have to do not want to start now, I have enough SxS Pro cards to record in HD on both cameras for the full contest.

Can anyone point me in the right direction on how they would do this, I can probably edit it down if need be, just would like to know some options if its a long event.

Thanks

Perrone Ford · August 7th, 2010, 10:45 PM

Keep things simple. Split it in half, 2 DVDs. 1 DVD would look awful.

Denny Kyser · August 7th, 2010, 10:55 PM

I have considered that, and that may be the best option, I am guessing the max a dvd can handle is about 2 hours and 15 mins is this right.
I ask this because I have to make a DVD they can loop and play during the fair, this can be edited down to the main parts for this but want to fit in as much as possible and still have good quality.

Perrone Ford · August 7th, 2010, 11:06 PM

You can put 4 hours on a DVD if you really want to. The problem is what it's going to look like. And frankly, I wouldn't put more than 2 hours on a DVD.

Garrett Low · August 7th, 2010, 11:40 PM

You could use a dual layer DVD which you could fit the 3 hours on an it would look pretty good. DL discs can be somewhat iffy on some set top boxes. I will only use Verbatim DL discs when I have to and have only had one that didn't play for a client.

As far as the loop play at the fair you could keep it in HD by burning it to a large thumb drive and play it back on something like a WD TV media player.

I shoot everything in HD now and down convert when producing DVD's. For single layer discs I don't go over 2 hours. I like to keep it to 1:45. For Dual layer dics I'll go up to 3:45.

Garrett

John Peterson · August 8th, 2010, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denny Kyser

I usually only shoot weddings, but have a Fair Queen Contest I am doing early next week and believe it usually runs a little less than 3 hours. Not sure if that will fit on a single DVD, never tried to put that much footage on one so not sure, hate to wait till then to have a plan.

I am pretty new to video, and have never shot anything but HD, and edit in Premier Pro CS4, render to MPEG2-DVD and burn to DVD with Encore.

By no means is giving the clients a HD DVD a must, just have never recorded any other way so unless I have to do not want to start now, I have enough SxS Pro cards to record in HD on both cameras for the full contest.

Can anyone point me in the right direction on how they would do this, I can probably edit it down if need be, just would like to know some options if its a long event.

Thanks

Given the length, the fact that this is your first HD shoot, and the problems associated with downconversion to begin with I would recommend that you shoot it with your SD camera and save the HD to SD experiments for practice shooting or a shorter job. And even shot in SD, I would still recommend that you use two DVDs of 1 1/2 hrs each instead of one terrible looking 3 hr DVD.

John

Bruce Rawlings · August 8th, 2010, 01:03 PM

If it is looping I would think no one is really watching it. Can you just put a highlights together?

Robert Young · August 9th, 2010, 01:06 AM

Sounds like you've had plenty of experience shooting HD and delivering on DVD, so your workflow for HD to DVD must be satisfactory. I would stick with your usual routine on that.
If I had an edited program that was longer than 2 hrs, I would deliver it on a single dual layer DVD. IMO, it's practical, professional looking, and more efficient for the end user than multiple DVDs, and Encore will do it.
On the other hand, I have hardly ever had a 3 hour event, including a presidential address, that I couldn't edit at least half of it out one way or the other, to the benefit of a very grateful audience.
Almost nothing, including your own kids, is really interesting for 3 hours :-)
Well, there is football...
On the other hand, if you cut all the commercials, all the dorking around between plays and so forth, even a football game would move along right smartly & fit on a single DVD

Denny Kyser · August 9th, 2010, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Young

Sounds like you've had plenty of experience shooting HD and delivering on DVD, so your workflow for HD to DVD must be satisfactory. I would stick with your usual routine on that.
If I had an edited program that was longer than 2 hrs, I would deliver it on a single dual layer DVD. IMO, it's practical, professional looking, and more efficient for the end user than multiple DVDs, and Encore will do it.
On the other hand, I have hardly ever had a 3 hour event, including a presidential address, that I couldn't edit at least half of it out one way or the other, to the benefit of a very grateful audience.
Almost nothing, including your own kids, is really interesting for 3 hours :-)
Well, there is football...
On the other hand, if you cut all the commercials, all the dorking around between plays and so forth, even a football game would move along right smartly & fit on a single DVD

I have to agree with you, I can do a lot of editing and maybe offer a separate DVD of "Extras" like special music that they have and some of the "filler" stuff they have going on while the girls are changing.

Mike Marriage · August 9th, 2010, 08:40 AM

I once did a 3 hour DVD (maybe a little under).

The client wanted it on one DVD to save money as it was a very large (many thousand) run and dual layer was actually more expensive than 2 single layer discs. I made a test disc so that they could compare the difference in picture quality for the different options. They couldn't see the difference and we went with one single layer disc. I could see the difference but it wasn't that bad to be honest. Having said that the shots were all pretty static so the MPEG2 compression wasn't being very stretched.

In short, test it on a short clip and see. If there is a single client, let them make the call.

Olof Ekbergh · August 9th, 2010, 10:51 AM

On the Mac side there is a fantastic compressor for MPEG called Bitvice. It can make very high quality MPEG files at low bitrates.

http://www.innobits.com/

David Herman · August 10th, 2010, 02:37 AM

Unless there is a demand for every second to be presented, take the advice of the edit it down crowd. Viewers will not appreciate all the "dead" footage.

Philip Howells · August 14th, 2010, 09:20 PM

Hello Denny. We won't drop below an average of 7000 kB/s for DVD - like you we originate on HDV and seen no point in compromising any more quality than necessary simply to sequeeze more time out of a DVD.

For your specific project I'd use a WD streamer. It's full HD and space is limited only by your HDD. We use two units on our wedding fair displays.

August 7th, 2010, 10:27 PM	#1
Denny Kyser Major Player Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Warren, Pa Posts: 785	Long Video Project, need advice. I usually only shoot weddings, but have a Fair Queen Contest I am doing early next week and believe it usually runs a little less than 3 hours. Not sure if that will fit on a single DVD, never tried to put that much footage on one so not sure, hate to wait till then to have a plan. I am pretty new to video, and have never shot anything but HD, and edit in Premier Pro CS4, render to MPEG2-DVD and burn to DVD with Encore. By no means is giving the clients a HD DVD a must, just have never recorded any other way so unless I have to do not want to start now, I have enough SxS Pro cards to record in HD on both cameras for the full contest. Can anyone point me in the right direction on how they would do this, I can probably edit it down if need be, just would like to know some options if its a long event. Thanks __________________ 2 Canon XF305's Kyser Photography www.kyserphoto.com

August 7th, 2010, 10:45 PM	#2
Perrone Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 4,100	Keep things simple. Split it in half, 2 DVDs. 1 DVD would look awful. __________________ DVX100, PMW-EX1, Canon 550D, FigRig, Dell Octocore, Avid MC4/5, MB Looks, RedCineX, Matrox MX02 mini, GTech RAID, Edirol R-4, Senn. G2 Evo, Countryman, Moles and Lowels.

August 7th, 2010, 10:55 PM	#3
Denny Kyser Major Player Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Warren, Pa Posts: 785	I have considered that, and that may be the best option, I am guessing the max a dvd can handle is about 2 hours and 15 mins is this right. I ask this because I have to make a DVD they can loop and play during the fair, this can be edited down to the main parts for this but want to fit in as much as possible and still have good quality. __________________ 2 Canon XF305's Kyser Photography www.kyserphoto.com

August 7th, 2010, 11:06 PM	#4
Perrone Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 4,100	You can put 4 hours on a DVD if you really want to. The problem is what it's going to look like. And frankly, I wouldn't put more than 2 hours on a DVD. __________________ DVX100, PMW-EX1, Canon 550D, FigRig, Dell Octocore, Avid MC4/5, MB Looks, RedCineX, Matrox MX02 mini, GTech RAID, Edirol R-4, Senn. G2 Evo, Countryman, Moles and Lowels.

August 9th, 2010, 01:06 AM	#8
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Sounds like you've had plenty of experience shooting HD and delivering on DVD, so your workflow for HD to DVD must be satisfactory. I would stick with your usual routine on that. If I had an edited program that was longer than 2 hrs, I would deliver it on a single dual layer DVD. IMO, it's practical, professional looking, and more efficient for the end user than multiple DVDs, and Encore will do it. On the other hand, I have hardly ever had a 3 hour event, including a presidential address, that I couldn't edit at least half of it out one way or the other, to the benefit of a very grateful audience. Almost nothing, including your own kids, is really interesting for 3 hours :-) Well, there is football... On the other hand, if you cut all the commercials, all the dorking around between plays and so forth, even a football game would move along right smartly & fit on a single DVD __________________ Bob

August 7th, 2010, 11:40 PM	#5
Garrett Low Trustee Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Novato, CA Posts: 1,774	You could use a dual layer DVD which you could fit the 3 hours on an it would look pretty good. DL discs can be somewhat iffy on some set top boxes. I will only use Verbatim DL discs when I have to and have only had one that didn't play for a client. As far as the loop play at the fair you could keep it in HD by burning it to a large thumb drive and play it back on something like a WD TV media player. I shoot everything in HD now and down convert when producing DVD's. For single layer discs I don't go over 2 hours. I like to keep it to 1:45. For Dual layer dics I'll go up to 3:45. Garrett

August 8th, 2010, 01:03 PM	#7
Bruce Rawlings Major Player Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK Posts: 410	If it is looping I would think no one is really watching it. Can you just put a highlights together?

August 9th, 2010, 08:40 AM	#10
Mike Marriage Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: NE of London, England Posts: 788	I once did a 3 hour DVD (maybe a little under). The client wanted it on one DVD to save money as it was a very large (many thousand) run and dual layer was actually more expensive than 2 single layer discs. I made a test disc so that they could compare the difference in picture quality for the different options. They couldn't see the difference and we went with one single layer disc. I could see the difference but it wasn't that bad to be honest. Having said that the shots were all pretty static so the MPEG2 compression wasn't being very stretched. In short, test it on a short clip and see. If there is a single client, let them make the call. __________________ www.mikemarriage.com

August 9th, 2010, 10:51 AM	#11
Olof Ekbergh Sponsor: Westside AV Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Mount Washington Valley, NH, USA Posts: 1,365	On the Mac side there is a fantastic compressor for MPEG called Bitvice. It can make very high quality MPEG files at low bitrates. http://www.innobits.com/ __________________ Olof Ekbergh • olof@WestsideAV.com Westside A V Studios • http://www.WestsideAVstore.com/

August 10th, 2010, 02:37 AM	#12
David Herman Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: gloucestershire uk Posts: 93	Unless there is a demand for every second to be presented, take the advice of the edit it down crowd. Viewers will not appreciate all the "dead" footage.

August 14th, 2010, 09:20 PM	#13
Philip Howells Trustee Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 1,212	Hello Denny. We won't drop below an average of 7000 kB/s for DVD - like you we originate on HDV and seen no point in compromising any more quality than necessary simply to sequeeze more time out of a DVD. For your specific project I'd use a WD streamer. It's full HD and space is limited only by your HDD. We use two units on our wedding fair displays.