Comparison of Canon XLH1 and Sony PMW EX3 telephoto capabilities

Steve Phillipps · March 28th, 2010, 03:24 AM

Agree with all of that Cris, I did say "if you can live with a prime" and that's what I had in mind, they can be really tricky and I don't like them on video either.
Steve

Doug Jensen · March 28th, 2010, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alastair Traill

A feature of the EX3 is the possibility of making compensations for various lens problems like “flare”. These adjustments can be stored in a file and retrieved whenever the lens is re-used. On paper this looks as though it should be very useful for those who want to get the best results from assorted lenses. Is it a feature available on the Canon?

Unfortunately I have not been able to get any clues as to the best way of making these adjustments despite posing the question on DVInfo Net, consulting the Manual and the local Sony Service centre. Even the invaluable PMW-EX3 Field Guide offers no clues.

Alastair,

The reason you're not going to find much information is because the creation of lens files is not something that mere mortals can really do. You have to have the right scopes, charts, experience, and skills to do it right or you'll just be causing more problems than you're solving.

Also, your comment that "on paper" it looks like a useful feature is dead on. On paper it does, but in reality, maybe not so much if you're using a decent lens in the first place.

Cris,
Great post! There's a lot of good advice in there.

Ray OBryan · March 29th, 2010, 10:04 AM

I think there is a lot of very good information in this thread. I learned a lot.

My reason for posting in the first place was to let some know if they had a few canon FD lens (like I have) there is adapter so you do not have to buy Nikon lenses. Have nothing against Nikon lenses I just happen to already own several FD lenses

I rented a EX3 about a month ago after buying the adaptimax adapter ( for EOS lenses). I have a 5D with EOS lenses. I tried it out and was able to shoot for several minutes at f4. ( yes there were times I did have to use the ND) I was using the 24-105 and like it quite well. I also used it with my 300 f4 and was also pleased with the results. HOWEVER even though I could change lenses pretty fast from one to the other and change f-stops some what fast, it did seem like I would like to use my FD lenses so I have now purchased the FD adapter so I can use my FD lenses and change the aperture as required.

I am sorry I had some misunderstanding with my statement. ( I find in doing Still's which I have been doing for a long time in a hours shooting I don't change f stops that much unless it is for depth of field reasons) No I am not changing shutter speed either. was way off the subject.

I am curious if you are not suppose to go to the higher speeds on the video camera (most people tell me to use 60 90% of the time) and that was talked about a lot in this thread why in the heck are they there for?

Also in regards to only using apertures in the 2.8 to f 5.6 range . again in watching training video's I have a couple both really stress not to go beyond these setting (maybe It is because that are training video's)? many of you also did not seem to go beyond f8

As far as going out and buying a Video DLSR it is not going to happen. I chose a real (what ever that means) video camera when I made the choice of the EX1 in 2008 (sound, quality flexibility, etc). I already own large format, med format, 35 film & 35 digital camera's (gave a lot of thought to the 5D mark II). I just want to use what I have.

I have now found out the Ex1 does not do what I want so I have now purchased (have not received) a EX3 I purchased a Nanoflash and a 2/3 lens adapter and the above still lenses adapters. That should take care of me for some time

Thank all of you for the great information. I will watch what I actually say in the future. I have a lot to learn and this is a great place to learn.

Steve Phillipps · March 29th, 2010, 11:40 AM

Ray, regarding shutter speeds, the general rule for progressive shooting is to use double the frame rate (ie 1/50th sec at 25fps, 1/60th at 30P etc.)
This seems to give the best compromise between lack of blurring and lack of strobing. Crank the speed up to 1/1000th sec and you see horrible strobing for instance.
The other way to vary exposure is with gain. With many cameras you'll find that you'll be happy with say -3db upto 6 db, which is 1 1/2 stops and you can vary the exposure within that range. If you're happy with shutter speeds anywhere between 1/25th and 1/125th that's another 2 stops to work with so you could do it I suppose without changing aperture - but there's substitute for doing it properly.
Steve

Ray OBryan · March 29th, 2010, 01:33 PM

Steve:

thanks, I will use the speed of 60 for awhile. I shoot in 1080 30P. I of course use the aperture on the stock lens. I will also be able to change aperture very easy on the FD lenses.As noted it is a little harder to change aperture on the EOS lenses with that adapter.

I am also going to try the over cranking. In talking to Olof Ekbergh (bought some of his products) he said on moving object it works well. it was also mentioned in one of the training video's

it does seem odd that the manufacture would put all those speeds in the camera when it does not work well. As you probably already know in still photography if you have moving objects you change the speed to how fast the object is moving then set the aperture for the best exposure.

Looks like in Video you set the speed and work around it. Thanks

Steve Phillipps · March 29th, 2010, 02:20 PM

Overcranking gives you slow motion, that's the way in which it helps with moving subjects, but you get no sync sound of course as the subject is moving at half speed or whatever you set it to (ie 60fps is half speed on a 30P clip).
There is a setting "180 degree" in the menu that does it all for you - it gives you hald the frame rate so if you change to overcranking and go to 40fps it'll give you 1/80th sec, if you go to 60fps it'll give you 1/120th sec. etc.
Steve

Steve Siegel · April 28th, 2010, 06:32 PM

In case any one is actually still reading this thread. I said my Canon lens on the XLH1 was the equivalent of 7200mm. Aaaauuugh. Of course it's 2800. The crop factor is 7.2, and I just was mixing numbers when very tired. Please don't think me that stupid!

Steve Phillipps · April 29th, 2010, 02:38 AM

It's alright Steve, nobody's still reading this thread! lol

March 28th, 2010, 03:24 AM	#16
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	Agree with all of that Cris, I did say "if you can live with a prime" and that's what I had in mind, they can be really tricky and I don't like them on video either. Steve

March 29th, 2010, 10:04 AM	#18
Ray OBryan New Boot Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: St. Louis Park, MN Posts: 15	I think there is a lot of very good information in this thread. I learned a lot. My reason for posting in the first place was to let some know if they had a few canon FD lens (like I have) there is adapter so you do not have to buy Nikon lenses. Have nothing against Nikon lenses I just happen to already own several FD lenses I rented a EX3 about a month ago after buying the adaptimax adapter ( for EOS lenses). I have a 5D with EOS lenses. I tried it out and was able to shoot for several minutes at f4. ( yes there were times I did have to use the ND) I was using the 24-105 and like it quite well. I also used it with my 300 f4 and was also pleased with the results. HOWEVER even though I could change lenses pretty fast from one to the other and change f-stops some what fast, it did seem like I would like to use my FD lenses so I have now purchased the FD adapter so I can use my FD lenses and change the aperture as required. I am sorry I had some misunderstanding with my statement. ( I find in doing Still's which I have been doing for a long time in a hours shooting I don't change f stops that much unless it is for depth of field reasons) No I am not changing shutter speed either. was way off the subject. I am curious if you are not suppose to go to the higher speeds on the video camera (most people tell me to use 60 90% of the time) and that was talked about a lot in this thread why in the heck are they there for? Also in regards to only using apertures in the 2.8 to f 5.6 range . again in watching training video's I have a couple both really stress not to go beyond these setting (maybe It is because that are training video's)? many of you also did not seem to go beyond f8 As far as going out and buying a Video DLSR it is not going to happen. I chose a real (what ever that means) video camera when I made the choice of the EX1 in 2008 (sound, quality flexibility, etc). I already own large format, med format, 35 film & 35 digital camera's (gave a lot of thought to the 5D mark II). I just want to use what I have. I have now found out the Ex1 does not do what I want so I have now purchased (have not received) a EX3 I purchased a Nanoflash and a 2/3 lens adapter and the above still lenses adapters. That should take care of me for some time Thank all of you for the great information. I will watch what I actually say in the future. I have a lot to learn and this is a great place to learn.

March 29th, 2010, 11:40 AM	#19
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	Ray, regarding shutter speeds, the general rule for progressive shooting is to use double the frame rate (ie 1/50th sec at 25fps, 1/60th at 30P etc.) This seems to give the best compromise between lack of blurring and lack of strobing. Crank the speed up to 1/1000th sec and you see horrible strobing for instance. The other way to vary exposure is with gain. With many cameras you'll find that you'll be happy with say -3db upto 6 db, which is 1 1/2 stops and you can vary the exposure within that range. If you're happy with shutter speeds anywhere between 1/25th and 1/125th that's another 2 stops to work with so you could do it I suppose without changing aperture - but there's substitute for doing it properly. Steve

March 29th, 2010, 01:33 PM	#20
Ray OBryan New Boot Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: St. Louis Park, MN Posts: 15	Steve: thanks, I will use the speed of 60 for awhile. I shoot in 1080 30P. I of course use the aperture on the stock lens. I will also be able to change aperture very easy on the FD lenses.As noted it is a little harder to change aperture on the EOS lenses with that adapter. I am also going to try the over cranking. In talking to Olof Ekbergh (bought some of his products) he said on moving object it works well. it was also mentioned in one of the training video's it does seem odd that the manufacture would put all those speeds in the camera when it does not work well. As you probably already know in still photography if you have moving objects you change the speed to how fast the object is moving then set the aperture for the best exposure. Looks like in Video you set the speed and work around it. Thanks

March 29th, 2010, 02:20 PM	#21
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	Overcranking gives you slow motion, that's the way in which it helps with moving subjects, but you get no sync sound of course as the subject is moving at half speed or whatever you set it to (ie 60fps is half speed on a 30P clip). There is a setting "180 degree" in the menu that does it all for you - it gives you hald the frame rate so if you change to overcranking and go to 40fps it'll give you 1/80th sec, if you go to 60fps it'll give you 1/120th sec. etc. Steve

April 28th, 2010, 06:32 PM	#22
Steve Siegel Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico, USA Posts: 840	In case any one is actually still reading this thread. I said my Canon lens on the XLH1 was the equivalent of 7200mm. Aaaauuugh. Of course it's 2800. The crop factor is 7.2, and I just was mixing numbers when very tired. Please don't think me that stupid!

April 29th, 2010, 02:38 AM	#23
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	It's alright Steve, nobody's still reading this thread! lol