The stock lens hood is worthless? Now what? at DVinfo.net

Brett OBourke · August 18th, 2009, 01:07 PM

OK, so I just unwrapped my spanking new EX-3 and much to my surprise, the 77 mm filters I have won't fit under the stock lens hood. A quick couple searches on this forum and it appears I either need to purchase slim filters or a new hood/matte box.

I don't really have a preference per se, but I guess if I have to spend more money, I'd prefer to spend it on what has the most amount of use down the line. I guess that's keeping the standard (stackable) filters and buying a matte box, right?

So, does anyone have a recommendation on an inexpensive (as I've pretty much shot the wad), functional, lightweight lens hood/matte box that will enable me to use the standard size filters?

99% of our shooting is run and gun documentary stuff in "fairly" controlled environments. I just need something simple, light, (hopefully) inexpensive.

thanks,

Brett

Boyd Ostroff · August 18th, 2009, 01:29 PM

Not sure if I understand... do you want to use screw-in filters with a mattebox?

If so, I think that will be a problem. I have the Century/Schneider mattebox and it's really nice. But it adapts to the lens using a 105mm screw-in "funnel" adaptor which would preclude the use of screw-in filters. They also recommend the use of rails (and I agree) so you're looking at something like $1,300 street price by the time you're done. You would need to use 4x4 filters.

DVMB W/A KIT 15MM SUPPORT EX1 - Schneider Optics

Cavision also has matteboxes which are less expensive than Century. Not entirely sure how they attach, but suspect something needs to screw into the lens.

I also have have the Century filter holder lens shade. It's much less expensive and lighter, but you will have the same issue with the funnel adaptor which is needed. It also uses 4x4 filters.

WIDE ANGLE SUNSHADE/FILTER HLD - Schneider Optics

Cavision makes some lens hoods like this. Don't think they will do what you want though.

Cavision Wide Angle Lens Hood

Offhand I can't think of a good solution for screw-in filters if you also want a lens hood... but that doesn't mean one doesn't exist!

Ron Wilk · August 18th, 2009, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boyd Ostroff

Not sure if I understand... do you want to use screw-in filters with a mattebox?

Cavision also has matteboxes which are less expensive than Century. Not entirely sure how they attach, but suspect something needs to screw into the lens.

WIDE ANGLE SUNSHADE/FILTER HLD - Schneider Optics

Cavision makes some lens hoods like this. Don't think they will do what you want though.

Cavision Wide Angle Lens Hood

Offhand I can't think of a good solution for screw-in filters if you also want a lens hood... but that doesn't mean one doesn't exist!

The Cavision Matte Box secures to the EX3 stock lens via a screw-in adapter ring. The box is quite functional, sturdy and a heck of a deal for the price. It too is best installed with rails and requires 4x4 and or 4x5.65 filters.

However, in re standard filters, I currently have a standard flanged (not slim) B&W 486 filter on my EX3 that sits quite comfortably behind the standard EX3 sunshade. This filter will accept the Cavision adapter ring into its threads without issue but I suspect that any further stacking of screwables might result in a degree of vignetting.

Brett OBourke · August 18th, 2009, 02:08 PM

I have these filters:

Formatt | 77mm Hi Def Circular Schott-Desag | BF 77-CP2000RH

and

Tiffen | 77mm Digital Pro SLR Glass Filter Kit | 77DPSLRKIT

None of them fit with the stock lens hood; it simply won't go back on. But sounds like I need 4x4 filters for a matte box, which makes sense, though it doesn't help either.

I guess I have to buy slimmer glass. Sucks.

B

Boyd Ostroff · August 18th, 2009, 06:13 PM

Maybe it's time to break out the gaffers tape? ;-)

Seriously, if you are going to replace the filters anyway, you might consider going with 4x4 glass and building a better system for future use. The sunshade I linked to will accept 4x4 filters and is reasonably priced: WIDE ANGLE SUNSHADE/FILTER HLD - Schneider Optics

Brett OBourke · August 18th, 2009, 06:29 PM

Yes. After a bit more reading I think you are right.

I'll still need a UV screw in filter though to protect the lens. And I'll need a screw in polarizer as well, right? From my search on B&H they have no 4x4 polarizer so I assume everyone uses screw in for that as well?

Thanks for the info. It's much appreciated.

B

Ed Kukla · August 18th, 2009, 06:40 PM

You could go old school. Buy an adapter ring to go from the lens thread to your filter threads and then add a simple screw in lens shade to that.

Boyd Ostroff · August 18th, 2009, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brett OBourke

And I'll need a screw in polarizer as well, right?

This is why eventually you will probably want a mattebox with a rotating stage :-) See the polarizer video here: Schneider Optics

I worry about my lens as well, but don't want to use any additional filters to degrade the image (with internal reflections, dust, etc) so I don't use a UV filter. I suppose if I was doing a shoot where I was especially worried I would use one. But you can get a clear glass or UV 4x4 filters also.

BTW, if using that Century lens hood you will need to purchase the "funnel" 77mm to 105mm adaptor and filter holder separately. If you get the mattebox, they are included.

Olof Ekbergh · August 18th, 2009, 07:33 PM

In my experience I use either a screw-in UV filter (slim I suppose) because all my 77 BW's work on EX3 stock lens.

Or I use a mattebox, no screw-in filter.

Early on when I started using mattebox on Betacam I got horrible results if I used a screw-in and mattebox 4x4's, because the alignment is not perfect on a mattebox most of the time especially on swing out units. You get a bunch of reflections between the screw-in and the 4x4. This is not a problem stacking 4x4's in a good mattebox.

So Run and Gun is a UV in stock EX3 hood. More careful work is always a mattebox with careful filter selection.

I end up with a lot of R&G shoots and the EX3 is still blowing me away with the quality I get w/o a lot of care.

Matt Davis · August 19th, 2009, 05:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boyd Ostroff

Maybe it's time to break out the gaffers tape?

Hope this question isn't 'thread hijack', but is there such a thing as 'close-up dioptres' for 4"x4" matte boxes?

Fate has it that I need to shoot more and more stuff in very-close-up and I don't like having to take the EX1 lens hood off and have stuff so close to my precious front element. Screw-in diopters would be the obvious way to go, but I also want quick and easy access to grads, polas and promist (hence my TLS Kestrel fixation).

Is it, to misquote Prof. Boole, a case of And or Either/Or?

August 18th, 2009, 01:07 PM	#1
Brett OBourke Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 72	The stock lens hood is worthless? Now what? OK, so I just unwrapped my spanking new EX-3 and much to my surprise, the 77 mm filters I have won't fit under the stock lens hood. A quick couple searches on this forum and it appears I either need to purchase slim filters or a new hood/matte box. I don't really have a preference per se, but I guess if I have to spend more money, I'd prefer to spend it on what has the most amount of use down the line. I guess that's keeping the standard (stackable) filters and buying a matte box, right? So, does anyone have a recommendation on an inexpensive (as I've pretty much shot the wad), functional, lightweight lens hood/matte box that will enable me to use the standard size filters? 99% of our shooting is run and gun documentary stuff in "fairly" controlled environments. I just need something simple, light, (hopefully) inexpensive. thanks, Brett

August 18th, 2009, 07:33 PM	#9
Olof Ekbergh Sponsor: Westside AV Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Mount Washington Valley, NH, USA Posts: 1,365	In my experience I use either a screw-in UV filter (slim I suppose) because all my 77 BW's work on EX3 stock lens. Or I use a mattebox, no screw-in filter. Early on when I started using mattebox on Betacam I got horrible results if I used a screw-in and mattebox 4x4's, because the alignment is not perfect on a mattebox most of the time especially on swing out units. You get a bunch of reflections between the screw-in and the 4x4. This is not a problem stacking 4x4's in a good mattebox. So Run and Gun is a UV in stock EX3 hood. More careful work is always a mattebox with careful filter selection. I end up with a lot of R&G shoots and the EX3 is still blowing me away with the quality I get w/o a lot of care. Last edited by Olof Ekbergh; August 18th, 2009 at 07:35 PM. Reason: edit

August 18th, 2009, 01:29 PM	#2
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Not sure if I understand... do you want to use screw-in filters with a mattebox? If so, I think that will be a problem. I have the Century/Schneider mattebox and it's really nice. But it adapts to the lens using a 105mm screw-in "funnel" adaptor which would preclude the use of screw-in filters. They also recommend the use of rails (and I agree) so you're looking at something like $1,300 street price by the time you're done. You would need to use 4x4 filters. DVMB W/A KIT 15MM SUPPORT EX1 - Schneider Optics Cavision also has matteboxes which are less expensive than Century. Not entirely sure how they attach, but suspect something needs to screw into the lens. I also have have the Century filter holder lens shade. It's much less expensive and lighter, but you will have the same issue with the funnel adaptor which is needed. It also uses 4x4 filters. WIDE ANGLE SUNSHADE/FILTER HLD - Schneider Optics Cavision makes some lens hoods like this. Don't think they will do what you want though. Cavision Wide Angle Lens Hood Offhand I can't think of a good solution for screw-in filters if you also want a lens hood... but that doesn't mean one doesn't exist!

August 18th, 2009, 02:08 PM	#4
Brett OBourke Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 72	I have these filters: Formatt \| 77mm Hi Def Circular Schott-Desag \| BF 77-CP2000RH and Tiffen \| 77mm Digital Pro SLR Glass Filter Kit \| 77DPSLRKIT None of them fit with the stock lens hood; it simply won't go back on. But sounds like I need 4x4 filters for a matte box, which makes sense, though it doesn't help either. I guess I have to buy slimmer glass. Sucks. B

August 18th, 2009, 06:13 PM	#5
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Maybe it's time to break out the gaffers tape? ;-) Seriously, if you are going to replace the filters anyway, you might consider going with 4x4 glass and building a better system for future use. The sunshade I linked to will accept 4x4 filters and is reasonably priced: WIDE ANGLE SUNSHADE/FILTER HLD - Schneider Optics

August 18th, 2009, 06:29 PM	#6
Brett OBourke Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 72	Yes. After a bit more reading I think you are right. I'll still need a UV screw in filter though to protect the lens. And I'll need a screw in polarizer as well, right? From my search on B&H they have no 4x4 polarizer so I assume everyone uses screw in for that as well? Thanks for the info. It's much appreciated. B

August 18th, 2009, 06:40 PM	#7
Ed Kukla Major Player Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: All over, USA Posts: 512	You could go old school. Buy an adapter ring to go from the lens thread to your filter threads and then add a simple screw in lens shade to that.